Socialized medicine's inevitable death panels

[pErvinalia]

Look at these young entrepeneurs. They are pulling themselves up by their bootstraps and will be millionaires in no time with the free market forces at their disposal. I dont know what all you pinkos are whining about.

yep.

[pErvinalia]

Besides, nobody said life is fair...or easy.

I know. Poor rich people are forced to pair their less-than-fair share in taxes by the big bad government.

What is their "fair share" exactly, and what calculations and rationalizations do you use in determining what that share is, pray tell?

I've heard many the socialist say that the rich don't pay their "fair share," in spite of the fact that the top 10 percent of taxpayers pay 68% of the taxes:

And yet they hold well over 90% of the wealth. But there's no such thing as inequality, right Seth?

Since the top 50% of taxpayers pay 97% of taxes, and the bottom 50% pay less than 3%, what's "fair share" in your opinion? Be specific. Give me a dollar amount, or a percentage of income, and some discussion of why a progressive income tax is reasonable, rational or fair.

I'll wait. For a while.

No one said life was fair Seth. In fact, some people positively love to point out how unfair it is (particularly when they are comfortably wealthy).

[Jason]

Firstly, there's a tax scale. Earn more income, pay a higher tax.

Secondly, people earning far more income than others will pay more taxes.

Thirdly, Derp.

Even a flat tax would have the rich paying more taxes than the poor.

[Warren Dew]

Well if I become incapacitated I want doctors making their best decision not my wife (and I've told her that). Not that I don't love my wife but she isn't a doctor and simply isn't qualified to make such decisions.

As for death panels, my mother has cancer she is also old with lots of other conditions She is perfectly competent and in discussion with the doctors she isn't being treated for the cancer as any drugs would interfere with anti-pain drugs she takes. Lunatics can call that death panels if they want I call it decent healthcare

You should read the original post. The whole point is that death panels are bureaucrats that get to overrule doctors.

[MrJonno]

There is only one country on Earth where its not the doctors making the decisions when it comes to medical care and that's the US where its insurance companies making them

[JimC]

Personally, I would like to be the one who decides when I'll shuffle off this mortal coil.

If I'm non compos mentis, then House will have to decide...

[mistermack]

You want to take what Seth writes about private health insurance with a pinch of salt.

He believes in the system so much, he hasn't got any health insurance for himself.
He's said so on several occasions.

[mistermack]

You should read the original post. The whole point is that death panels are bureaucrats that get to overrule doctors.

That's misrepresenting the true situation.
The panel only gets involved when the family and the doctors are at odds, and the alternative is to drag it through the courts, while the patient lies there suffering.

So in that situation, it's going to be either the courts overruling the doctors, or a panel.

Courts don't have doctors on the bench. The panel almost certainly will.

[Tero]

There is only one country on Earth where its not the doctors making the decisions when it comes to medical care and that's the US where its insurance companies making them

That may be true, but the hospital administrators in European countries have a budget to work with. The money is not endless. I believe it is a compromise between the doctor and the administrator. In case of disasters and terrorist activity, the hospital may get extra money.

[pErvinalia]

That's the reality of any health care. There's always money that can be spent on keeping people alive. But it's a case of diminishing returns (to apply a fairly repugnant metaphor/thingy). Accepting that doesn't mean we have to freak out about DEATH PANELS!!1!. It's a reality of a technological society. I think having both a private and public system is the way to go (like we have here in Australia). Then everyone gets covered, and those who can afford it get covered a bit nicer.

[Tero]

There may be cases where there is a treatment for a disease that buys you months maybe years of life. But is not available in your country. You can always pay cash and fly to Mayo Clinic or Anderson in Texas.

[MrJonno]

There is no medicine that actually works that a 1st world country can't afford for every citizen if it wants too.

You know why, because no one does medicine specifically for millionaires as quite simply there is money in it. You don't get situations where I can save your life but it will cost 1 million pounds/dollars to do as who would ever develop such a technique

Where you do get limitations in drugs that have an extremely limited if any level of efficiency, if you take this £50k drug it has a 10% chance of keeping you alive for any extra 6 weeks educate

[pErvinalia]

As usual, Jonno, your post is barely (if at all) coherent.

[Tyrannical]

Look at these young entrepeneurs. They are pulling themselves up by their bootstraps and will be millionaires in no time with the free market forces at their disposal. I dont know what all you pinkos are whining about.

They tried outlawing dump picking in India once as I recall


Well meaning liberals thought it was horrible that children were foraging through a dump looking for scrap to earn money. So the government was pressured to outlaw that practice. Then the dump pickers rioted because now they had no means to support their family.

[Tero]

No sign of socialized healthcare. I get the same plan as last year OR a cheap high deductible plan.

Yahoo News:

Obamacare Sites Still Swamped but Wait Times Cut
Myth: Obamacare is leading to part-time jobs
It's a common refrain of its opponents: Obamacare will force struggling Americans into part-time work. Well, the first bits of evidence have come in, and it does not look as if the Affordable Care Act has had any negative impact on full-time work.
Between August and September the economy has added 691,000 full-time jobs, while it has lost 594,000 part-time jobs, according to the September jobs report. While this is only one month's worth of data, it indicates that at least so far, the law hasn't pushed full-time employees into part-time work.
Myth: Employers aren't changing the insurance they offer because of Obamacare.
"If you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan," said President Obama in 2009 as he worked to sell the health care bill that would result in the Affordable Care Act. For many Americans, fall means open enrollment season for their employee-based health care plans. And some of those plans have definitely changed.
Here are some high profile examples: Citing the Affordable Care Act, UPS announced it would drop health coverage for some spouses of employees who were eligible for health insurance elsewhere. And Home Depot said it would shift its part-time employees to public health insurance exchanges instead of providing insurance through the company.
The truth is, some health insurance plans would be required to change because of the Affordable Care Act: Either they don't meet the minimum coverage requirements of the new law, or they are too generous -- so called "Cadillac" insurance plans.
But not all changes stem from the new law. Employers have been changing health insurance plans for years before the ACA. For example, the average deductible has increased every year since 2006 -- before and after the health care law -- according to the Kaiser Family Foundation.