Spoiler that!!!Făkünamę wrote: Precisely. Shall is still used in more rarefied discussion in the presumptive subjunctive form and, most commonly, in the inquisitive subjunctive.
"shall" vs "will"?
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FBM
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
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Tyrannical
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
No mention of "shalt" yet? It's the second-person singular simple present form of shall, whatever the hell that means.
A rational skeptic should be able to discuss and debate anything, no matter how much they may personally disagree with that point of view. Discussing a subject is not agreeing with it, but understanding it.
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FBM
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
As in, "Thou shalt not..." Maybe it's limited to the command form.Tyrannical wrote:No mention of "shalt" yet? It's the second-person singular simple present form of shall, whatever the hell that means.
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
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SteveB
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Why am I reading this? 
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Tyrannical
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Because it is one one the more interesting grammar Nazi topics.SteveB wrote:Why am I reading this?
A rational skeptic should be able to discuss and debate anything, no matter how much they may personally disagree with that point of view. Discussing a subject is not agreeing with it, but understanding it.
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SteveB
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Interesting to whom....or is it who? Ahhh! 
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Gawdzilla Sama
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Lack of will?SteveB wrote:Why am I reading this?
Ein Ubootsoldat wrote:“Ich melde mich ab. Grüssen Sie bitte meine Kameraden.”
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Screw it. The new word incorporating both is shill. Yes, I know that's already a word, and I don't care. We're taking it now. You shill use it and like it!
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Tyrannical
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
I miss Thee, Thou, and Dost.FBM wrote:As in, "Thou shalt not..." Maybe it's limited to the command form.Tyrannical wrote:No mention of "shalt" yet? It's the second-person singular simple present form of shall, whatever the hell that means.
Prithee tell me Willis, of what dost thou speak?
A rational skeptic should be able to discuss and debate anything, no matter how much they may personally disagree with that point of view. Discussing a subject is not agreeing with it, but understanding it.
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FBM
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
That reminds me, I need to refill my shalt shaker.
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Whoever heard of Shall-I-Am? 
A book is a version of the world. If you do not like it, ignore it; or offer your own version in return.
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Calilasseia
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Twoflower
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Salman Rushdie
You talk to God, you're religious. God talks to you, you're psychotic.
House MD
Who needs a meaning anyway, I'd settle anyday for a very fine view.
Sandy Denny
This is the wrong forum for bluffing
Paco
Yes, yes. But first I need to show you this venomous fish!
Calilasseia
I think we should do whatever Pawiz wants.
Twoflower
Bella squats momentarily then waddles on still peeing, like a horse
Millefleur
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FBM
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Free Shall vs Determinism...
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
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Xamonas Chegwé
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
Willots? 
A book is a version of the world. If you do not like it, ignore it; or offer your own version in return.
Salman Rushdie
You talk to God, you're religious. God talks to you, you're psychotic.
House MD
Who needs a meaning anyway, I'd settle anyday for a very fine view.
Sandy Denny
This is the wrong forum for bluffing
Paco
Yes, yes. But first I need to show you this venomous fish!
Calilasseia
I think we should do whatever Pawiz wants.
Twoflower
Bella squats momentarily then waddles on still peeing, like a horse
Millefleur
Salman Rushdie
You talk to God, you're religious. God talks to you, you're psychotic.
House MD
Who needs a meaning anyway, I'd settle anyday for a very fine view.
Sandy Denny
This is the wrong forum for bluffing
Paco
Yes, yes. But first I need to show you this venomous fish!
Calilasseia
I think we should do whatever Pawiz wants.
Twoflower
Bella squats momentarily then waddles on still peeing, like a horse
Millefleur
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Svartalf
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
That's how I was taught it too, though I must admit that the teacher was old already in the mid 80s, and that I had to wait till after I left secondary education for the subject to even get broached... before then, "will" was the only way we were taught.John_fi_Skye wrote:When it's the "normal" future tense ("future indicative active"), "shall" is first person, while "will" is second and third.
"I shall try it tomorrow."
"You will find this the best way to do it."
"He will start painting the house on Tuesday."
When it's implying determination that something must (or must not) happen, it's the other way round.
"I will never allow it."
"You shall do as I say."
"They shall not pass."
Having said all that, it's true that "shall" is indeed fading out, and becoming archaic.
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PC stands for "Patronizing Cocksucker" Randy Ping
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Svartalf
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?
John_fi_Skye wrote:Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I shall never stop using shall, e'en if the gates of Will yawn open before me.Sometimes you sound so BRuTISH!
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PC stands for "Patronizing Cocksucker" Randy Ping
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