Tottenham Riots

[Coito ergo sum]

What manual labour?

Dunno - there are a lot of potholes in the roads up here, and most councils are facing huge spending cuts...

And you don't think you might some skills to actually fill in potholes?, I wouldnt have a clue how to do it lots of complex machinery I believe and people who do this are on an okish wage to use them.

America may be a rural country country where everyone knows DIY but the people we are talking about are city dweller who would see a spanner as nothing more than something to smash a window with

You don't have the skills to fill in a pothole? I think that may well be where society went wrong, though. I've noticed a real issue with younger folks that I don't think was there AS MUCH when I was growing up. The way I was raised, we were taught to figure things out. Nowadays, I do see a lot of folks catering so much to their kids that they don't even let them try to figure things out. I mean - fill in a pothole? Really? You wouldn't have "clue?" And, you wouldn't even have a clue how to find out how to fill one? I find that shocking.

America is also not a rural country, by and large.

[Robert_S]

What manual labour?

Dunno - there are a lot of potholes in the roads up here, and most councils are facing huge spending cuts...

And you don't think you might some skills to actually fill in potholes?, I wouldnt have a clue how to do it lots of complex machinery I believe and people who do this are on an okish wage to use them.

America may be a rural country country where everyone knows DIY but the people we are talking about are city dweller who would see a spanner as nothing more than something to smash a window with

You can lern 'em how to fix a pothole in five minutes if you made it a condition for receiving benefits.

[Coito ergo sum]

I guess I was raised differently than a lot of folks these days. I was raised that to be on the dole was an embarrassment, and something to be ashamed of. If you are any kind of a grown man, suckling at the public teat was nothing to riot over. If you were getting such largesse, you ought to be thankful, and you ought to not publicize the fact that you are living off other people's hard work, and you should do what you can to make yourself worthwhile.

I think that's what bothers me the most about it. Folks have been getting free shit for years, and they're pissed about not having as much to play with as those who are footing the bill? Makes me want to say - o.k. - now you get nothing. Support yourself, fuckwad.

[Robert_S]

Or maybe if you're going to ditch some industries, try to foster some other ones to replace them.

[Bella Fortuna]

I think the UK needs the New Deal.

Lots of relatively low skilled people expanding a country with a lot of of undeveloped infrastrure simply doesnt apply to the UK in the 21st century

[Robert_S]

I think the UK needs the New Deal.

Lots of relatively low skilled people expanding a country with a lot of of undeveloped infrastrure simply doesnt apply to the UK in the 21st century

Put them to work in jobs that'll give them useful skills.

[Bella Fortuna]

I think the UK needs the New Deal.

Lots of relatively low skilled people expanding a country with a lot of of undeveloped infrastrure simply doesnt apply to the UK in the 21st century

Put them to work in jobs that'll give them useful skills.

[Robert_S]

Half the nation is a therapist for the other half? Sounds like a Woody Allen film.

[MrJonno]

Cool you need qualifcations to fill in pot holes in the UK

http://www.careerswales.com/16to19/serv ... eaflet.127

Basic training is usually given at the road maintenance depot, and you learn a lot on the job. You will
also be given health and safety training and may need to gain a CSCS (Construction Skills Certification
Scheme) card. You will probably work towards qualifications, such as a level 2 NVQ in roadbuilding
(construction) or highways maintenance.
Apprenticeships may be available with construction firms, leading to level 2 qualifications. The
ConstructionSkills website (see end of leaflet) has more information on Apprenticeships. Young people
should contact their local Connexions/careers service.
City & Guilds offers qualifications at operative and supervisory level in streetworks excavation and
reinstatement. These are aimed at those already employed in relevant work and lead to the issue of the
Street Works ID Card.

Yeah I can see the average yob who is has been on the dole several years being able to do that!

[Cormac]

Cool you need qualifcations to fill in pot holes in the UK

http://www.careerswales.com/16to19/serv ... eaflet.127

Basic training is usually given at the road maintenance depot, and you learn a lot on the job. You will
also be given health and safety training and may need to gain a CSCS (Construction Skills Certification
Scheme) card. You will probably work towards qualifications, such as a level 2 NVQ in roadbuilding
(construction) or highways maintenance.
Apprenticeships may be available with construction firms, leading to level 2 qualifications. The
ConstructionSkills website (see end of leaflet) has more information on Apprenticeships. Young people
should contact their local Connexions/careers service.
City & Guilds offers qualifications at operative and supervisory level in streetworks excavation and
reinstatement. These are aimed at those already employed in relevant work and lead to the issue of the
Street Works ID Card.

Yeah I can see the average yob who is has been on the dole several years being able to do that!

This is bollox though. Any fucking idiot can learn to fill a pothole in about 5 Minutes. The lesson would start "This is a shovel, that is a container on hot tarmac." And would end "... and the you put your tools back in the van and have a cup of tea and a hob-nob".

[Robert_S]

Cool you need qualifcations to fill in pot holes in the UK

http://www.careerswales.com/16to19/serv ... eaflet.127

Basic training is usually given at the road maintenance depot, and you learn a lot on the job. You will
also be given health and safety training and may need to gain a CSCS (Construction Skills Certification
Scheme) card. You will probably work towards qualifications, such as a level 2 NVQ in roadbuilding
(construction) or highways maintenance.
Apprenticeships may be available with construction firms, leading to level 2 qualifications. The
ConstructionSkills website (see end of leaflet) has more information on Apprenticeships. Young people
should contact their local Connexions/careers service.
City & Guilds offers qualifications at operative and supervisory level in streetworks excavation and
reinstatement. These are aimed at those already employed in relevant work and lead to the issue of the
Street Works ID Card.

Yeah I can see the average yob who is has been on the dole several years being able to do that!

This is bollox though. Any fucking idiot can learn to fill a pothole in about 5 Minutes. The lesson would start "This is a shovel, that is a container on hot tarmac." And would end "... and the you put your tools back in the van and have a cup of coffee and a hob-nob".

But other than that, you're pretty spot on. I did that kind of stuff when I was 16.

[Warren Dew]

I could live with appeasement, if it didn't include incentives for growing another generation that needed to be appeased.

I can't. It encourages a shitty attitude and a sense of helplessness. If you're down on your luck or need a little help with college or the power bill because things piled up this particular month, that' one thing. Anything longer than two years should be setting off alarm bells.

And yet, that's exactly what you're living with - the system is the same in the U.S. A few of our welfare programs have time limits - 60 months for TANF, for example - but many do not.

[Warren Dew]

Cool you need qualifcations to fill in pot holes in the UK

http://www.careerswales.com/16to19/serv ... eaflet.127

Basic training is usually given at the road maintenance depot, and you learn a lot on the job. You will
also be given health and safety training and may need to gain a CSCS (Construction Skills Certification
Scheme) card. You will probably work towards qualifications, such as a level 2 NVQ in roadbuilding
(construction) or highways maintenance.
Apprenticeships may be available with construction firms, leading to level 2 qualifications. The
ConstructionSkills website (see end of leaflet) has more information on Apprenticeships. Young people
should contact their local Connexions/careers service.
City & Guilds offers qualifications at operative and supervisory level in streetworks excavation and
reinstatement. These are aimed at those already employed in relevant work and lead to the issue of the
Street Works ID Card.

Yeah I can see the average yob who is has been on the dole several years being able to do that!

Sounds like the union version of how to fix a pothole.

[Robert_S]

I could live with appeasement, if it didn't include incentives for growing another generation that needed to be appeased.

I can't. It encourages a shitty attitude and a sense of helplessness. If you're down on your luck or need a little help with college or the power bill because things piled up this particular month, that' one thing. Anything longer than two years should be setting off alarm bells.

And yet, that's exactly what you're living with - the system is the same in the U.S. A few of our welfare programs have time limits - 60 months for TANF, for example - but many do not.

It did get better.

But as was pointed out earlier in the thread, there are spots where it must be demoralizing for people trying to get out of the welfare system, where effort pays off in reduced income.

[Warren Dew]

I could live with appeasement, if it didn't include incentives for growing another generation that needed to be appeased.

I can't. It encourages a shitty attitude and a sense of helplessness. If you're down on your luck or need a little help with college or the power bill because things piled up this particular month, that' one thing. Anything longer than two years should be setting off alarm bells.

And yet, that's exactly what you're living with - the system is the same in the U.S. A few of our welfare programs have time limits - 60 months for TANF, for example - but many do not.

It did get better.

A few welfare programs with mild time limits might be a bit better than none with any time limits, but it still "encourages a shitty attitude and a sense of helplessness", as you put it.

But as was pointed out earlier in the thread, there are spots where it must be demoralizing for people trying to get out of the welfare system, where effort pays off in reduced income.

"Spots"? All of welfare does that. That's where that "shitty attitude and ... sense of helplessness" comes from.