What do the anti-vaxers want?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

On a serious note ... is the MMR vaccine "controversy" as big (or at least persistent) an issue in the States as it is here?

The Merkin AVs what to pass laws for "conscientious objectors". You can opt out of mandatory vaccinations under those proposed laws. If we weren't talking human lives here I'd say it would be an educational moment.

[hackenslash]

What do they want? 15 minutes of fame, I suspect.

[Ronja]

Shared on FB. Thanks, 'Zilla: reading stuff like this does not make me happy , but I appreciate it anyway.

[Atheist-Lite]

Vaccines are partly responsible for the huge human population boom. Without allowing for natural forms of population control there is now the impending population crash caused by a over consumption of resources on a finite planet as numbers increase exponentially. The simplest and most fair thing to do is abandon vaccines and spend the money on palliative care for the dying. There is the inhuman side to saving so many lives that they bring on a much greater tragedy by unsustainable growth. Better the natural evolved mechanisms of population control - I would even adocate a small man made plague to bring numbers down, not because I lack compassion but because I have it for the survivors. What is the alternative? You can see what little food price shocks are doing in the middle east - the modern world, and it's population, will utterly collapse as these trends continue. Everyday that passes vaccines are being produced and all they do is increase a very large impending human disaster.

[JimC]

Vaccines are partly responsible for the huge human population boom. Without allowing for natural forms of population control there is now the impending population crash caused by a over consumption of resources on a finite planet as numbers increase exponentially. The simplest and most fair thing to do is abandon vaccines and spend the money on palliative care for the dying. There is the inhuman side to saving so many lives that they bring on a much greater tragedy by unsustainable growth. Better the natural evolved mechanisms of population control - I would even adocate a small man made plague to bring numbers down, not because I lack compassion but because I have it for the survivors. What is the alternative? You can see what little food price shocks are doing in the middle east - the modern world, and it's population, will utterly collapse as these trends continue. Everyday that passes vaccines are being produced and all they do is increase a very large impending human disaster.

Brought to you by the poster that puts the "M" in Malthusian...

[Ronja]

Crumple: You're being even denser than usual. If the diseases we vaccinate against really would kill those they kill cleanly and completely and leave the rest of the population unharmed, you might have a cold, calculating point that could be considered rationally. But the bigger problem, cost, tragedy (whatever we choose to call it) is that so many of these diseases leave behind people who are disabled for life, and have to be rehabilitated, cared for etc. and many of them won't be able to be truly productive, ever.

For an idea about how to make life better on Earth, which is more likely to actually work, listen to Hitch (from 0:38 to 1:21) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t4VhQX5Ckk

[GenesForLife]

I would argue that advanced standards of healthcare (including vaccines) could be associated with lower population growth, reason being that if children grow up into healthy adults and childhood and youth mortality is low people can have less kids and still ensure that they live a long, healthy life, instead of producing a whole lot and then hoping some of them get through to adulthood.

[Atheist-Lite]

I would argue that advanced standards of healthcare (including vaccines) could be associated with lower population growth, reason being that if children grow up into healthy adults and childhood and youth mortality is low people can have less kids and still ensure that they live a long, healthy life, instead of producing a whole lot and then hoping some of them get through to adulthood.

Leads to a ageing population with some large risk of a collapse in social infrastructure as a cosequence?

[GenesForLife]

I would argue that advanced standards of healthcare (including vaccines) could be associated with lower population growth, reason being that if children grow up into healthy adults and childhood and youth mortality is low people can have less kids and still ensure that they live a long, healthy life, instead of producing a whole lot and then hoping some of them get through to adulthood.

Leads to a ageing population with some large risk of a collapse in social infrastructure as a cosequence?

Choice between everybody breeding like rabbits and an ageing population I suppose.

[GenesForLife]

Of course, one way to sort that out would be to maintain the population ratio, no collapse will happen as long as growth is steady state while not being exponential.

[Atheist-Lite]

I would argue that advanced standards of healthcare (including vaccines) could be associated with lower population growth, reason being that if children grow up into healthy adults and childhood and youth mortality is low people can have less kids and still ensure that they live a long, healthy life, instead of producing a whole lot and then hoping some of them get through to adulthood.

Leads to a ageing population with some large risk of a collapse in social infrastructure as a cosequence?

Choice between everybody breeding like rabbits and an ageing population I suppose.

Maybe it isn't a choice? We are cofronted by reality and reality will determine what is possible. If countries were compartments on a ship then some have tried this and others that. Overall despite putting towels under the doorways to the cabin and shutting all the port holes the water of exponential population growth is still getting in. This ship appears to be sinking right now because it carries too many passengers. Can't afford panic despite ominous waves of bleak information on climate change, resource depletion and impending food/fresh water scarcity. Any 'market' panic about the reality of the situation and the passengers could all rush to one side or the other and the thing will capsize? The future will be a empty supermarket.

[JimC]

I would argue that advanced standards of healthcare (including vaccines) could be associated with lower population growth, reason being that if children grow up into healthy adults and childhood and youth mortality is low people can have less kids and still ensure that they live a long, healthy life, instead of producing a whole lot and then hoping some of them get through to adulthood.

I agree 100%...

[Ronja]

I would argue that advanced standards of healthcare (including vaccines) could be associated with lower population growth, reason being that if children grow up into healthy adults and childhood and youth mortality is low people can have less kids and still ensure that they live a long, healthy life, instead of producing a whole lot and then hoping some of them get through to adulthood.

I agree 100%...

Me, too.

[Geoff]

Vaccines are partly responsible for the huge human population boom. Without allowing for natural forms of population control there is now the impending population crash caused by a over consumption of resources on a finite planet as numbers increase exponentially. The simplest and most fair thing to do is abandon vaccines and spend the money on palliative care for the dying. There is the inhuman side to saving so many lives that they bring on a much greater tragedy by unsustainable growth. Better the natural evolved mechanisms of population control - I would even adocate a small man made plague to bring numbers down, not because I lack compassion but because I have it for the survivors. What is the alternative? You can see what little food price shocks are doing in the middle east - the modern world, and it's population, will utterly collapse as these trends continue. Everyday that passes vaccines are being produced and all they do is increase a very large impending human disaster.

Brought to you by the poster that puts the "M" in Malthusian...

We should also set up captive breeding projects for the anopheles mosquito, tsetse fly and similar endangered species...

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Leads to a ageing population with some large risk of a collapse in social infrastructure as a cosequence?

That's a maffs joke, ain't it?