A secular debate about eating meat.

[JimC]

And perhaps the best response is:

"For those animals capable of feeling pain and suffering, choosing to eat them should involve minimising their pain and suffering during their life, and in the slaughtering process, as much as possible"

I would add that, in addition to minimizing suffering, we might want to take into account the pleasure those animals have in their lives. To the extent that meat eating provides an opportunity for animals to lead pleasurable lives, it can be seen as a moral positive, rather than a negative.

Most aspects of animal welfare (and possibly pleasure) are addressed by having animals in a free-ranging situation, rather than pens, feed-lots or cages...

I'm sure there are other issues as well, but given a free-ranging existence, no overcrowding, adequate food and water, vetinary attention as required, humane transport and an instant death, I will eat 'em...

[Rob]

I like meat but as a poor college student who is always doing something I need a proper diet that is readily available and just as cheap as the easily made meat products. Until this is provided I'll just keep buying whatever meat I can find at the local grocery market. Don't get me wrong, I dislike factory farming on an instinctual level, one has priorities however.

[Gallstones]

This should make everybody happy.

Rescued Cow Arrives at new Montana Home

(AP) STEVENSVILLE, Mont. (AP) - A cow that avoided slaughter five years ago by famously jumping a slaughterhouse gate and leading officials on a chase finally has a new home in Montana.

The cow is called the "Unsinkable Molly B" because her 2006 escape included a swim in the Missouri River. She was recently rescued from an overcrowded animal sanctuary and is now at the New Dawn Montana Farm Animal Sanctuary near Stevensville.

[Coito ergo sum]

[egbert]

I like meat but as a poor college student who is always doing something I need a proper diet that is readily available and just as cheap as the easily made meat products. Until this is provided I'll just keep buying whatever meat I can find at the local grocery market.

One word - TOFU. Make sure you buy the "Free Range" variety!

[maiforpeace]

I like meat but as a poor college student who is always doing something I need a proper diet that is readily available and just as cheap as the easily made meat products. Until this is provided I'll just keep buying whatever meat I can find at the local grocery market. Don't get me wrong, I dislike factory farming on an instinctual level, one has priorities however.

F
Grass fed ground beef at Trader Joe's is $5.50 a lb. At my local high end supermarket it's about $6.00 a lb. Factory farmed ground beef (like ground round) at most supermarkets is $4.00 - $4.75 a lb. That's not that much of a difference. If your priority is to get the most nutritional bang for your buck, eat a little less of the crappy stuff, and eat grass fed, it's better nutritionally (less saturated fat, and more Omega-3's) AND superior in flavor.

[Coito ergo sum]

Wow - that sounds pretty high for ground beef. Publix here in FL has ground beef for like, $2.69 a pound on up to about $3.99 a pound for the lean sirloin ground. Publix isn't the cheapest store either. Wal-Mart has ground beef about 40 cents a pound lower.

If I was going to pay $5.50 a pound for ground beef, I'll buy myself a steak first.

[maiforpeace]

Wow - that sounds pretty high for ground beef. Publix here in FL has ground beef for like, $2.69 a pound on up to about $3.99 a pound for the lean sirloin ground. Publix isn't the cheapest store either. Wal-Mart has ground beef about 40 cents a pound lower.

If I was going to pay $5.50 a pound for ground beef, I'll buy myself a steak first.

The price I quoted was $5.50 for grass fed ground beef, otherwise regular (factory farmed) beef prices are just a bit higher than yours. I did shop at Publix when I was in Orlando last year and I know they don't sell grass fed beef there because I looked for it. I would highly doubt Walmart sells it too.

[Coito ergo sum]

Wow - that sounds pretty high for ground beef. Publix here in FL has ground beef for like, $2.69 a pound on up to about $3.99 a pound for the lean sirloin ground. Publix isn't the cheapest store either. Wal-Mart has ground beef about 40 cents a pound lower.

If I was going to pay $5.50 a pound for ground beef, I'll buy myself a steak first.

The price I quoted was $5.50 for grass fed ground beef, otherwise regular (factory farmed) beef prices are just a bit higher than yours. I did shop at Publix when I was in Orlando last year and I know they don't sell grass fed beef there because I looked for it. I would highly doubt Walmart sells it too.

I think Publix has grass fed beef under their "Greenwise" brand - although, maybe that is just "organic" (which is essentially a nonsense word meaning whatever anyone wants it to mean, just about).

I can't wait for someone to come up with factory grown meat, which was never a walking-around animal - just meat grown in a lab. If they can grow organs (and they have), we should be able to grow muscle tissue. Then this whole debate can come to an end. Well, it probably won't. Someone will complain about the meat grown in a lab....

It's kind of like how the anti-abortion folks still complain about the morning after pill. They should be the most ardent proponents of the morning after pill, but they aren't - mainly because it kills their activist movement. Ironically, the last thing any activist movement wants is to actually ultimately succeed.

[JimC]

Wow - that sounds pretty high for ground beef. Publix here in FL has ground beef for like, $2.69 a pound on up to about $3.99 a pound for the lean sirloin ground. Publix isn't the cheapest store either. Wal-Mart has ground beef about 40 cents a pound lower.

If I was going to pay $5.50 a pound for ground beef, I'll buy myself a steak first.

The price I quoted was $5.50 for grass fed ground beef, otherwise regular (factory farmed) beef prices are just a bit higher than yours. I did shop at Publix when I was in Orlando last year and I know they don't sell grass fed beef there because I looked for it. I would highly doubt Walmart sells it too.

I think Publix has grass fed beef under their "Greenwise" brand - although, maybe that is just "organic" (which is essentially a nonsense word meaning whatever anyone wants it to mean, just about).

I can't wait for someone to come up with factory grown meat, which was never a walking-around animal - just meat grown in a lab. If they can grow organs (and they have), we should be able to grow muscle tissue. Then this whole debate can come to an end. Well, it probably won't. Someone will complain about the meat grown in a lab....

It's kind of like how the anti-abortion folks still complain about the morning after pill. They should be the most ardent proponents of the morning after pill, but they aren't - mainly because it kills their activist movement. Ironically, the last thing any activist movement wants is to actually ultimately succeed.

If they could do it in a system without waste products, or excessive energy use, preferably with a feedstock coming from algal farming in ponds supplied with treated sewage, then it could be a real winner...

[FBM]

I'm a meat-eater, but the sort of animal abuse that goes on at factory farms and at slaughterhouses needs to be outlawed. This video:

http://www.meatvideo.com/

shows it all. WARNING!!!: That's a gory, disgusting, shocking video. Not for the faint-hearted.

[Coito ergo sum]

Wow - that sounds pretty high for ground beef. Publix here in FL has ground beef for like, $2.69 a pound on up to about $3.99 a pound for the lean sirloin ground. Publix isn't the cheapest store either. Wal-Mart has ground beef about 40 cents a pound lower.

If I was going to pay $5.50 a pound for ground beef, I'll buy myself a steak first.

The price I quoted was $5.50 for grass fed ground beef, otherwise regular (factory farmed) beef prices are just a bit higher than yours. I did shop at Publix when I was in Orlando last year and I know they don't sell grass fed beef there because I looked for it. I would highly doubt Walmart sells it too.

I think Publix has grass fed beef under their "Greenwise" brand - although, maybe that is just "organic" (which is essentially a nonsense word meaning whatever anyone wants it to mean, just about).

I can't wait for someone to come up with factory grown meat, which was never a walking-around animal - just meat grown in a lab. If they can grow organs (and they have), we should be able to grow muscle tissue. Then this whole debate can come to an end. Well, it probably won't. Someone will complain about the meat grown in a lab....

It's kind of like how the anti-abortion folks still complain about the morning after pill. They should be the most ardent proponents of the morning after pill, but they aren't - mainly because it kills their activist movement. Ironically, the last thing any activist movement wants is to actually ultimately succeed.

If they could do it in a system without waste products, or excessive energy use, preferably with a feedstock coming from algal farming in ponds supplied with treated sewage, then it could be a real winner...

Yes, well there are waste products and excessive energy use associated with the growth of plants for human consumption. There will, of course, be energy use and waste.

[Coito ergo sum]

[Coito ergo sum]

[hadespussercats]

Wow - that sounds pretty high for ground beef. Publix here in FL has ground beef for like, $2.69 a pound on up to about $3.99 a pound for the lean sirloin ground. Publix isn't the cheapest store either. Wal-Mart has ground beef about 40 cents a pound lower.

If I was going to pay $5.50 a pound for ground beef, I'll buy myself a steak first.

The price I quoted was $5.50 for grass fed ground beef, otherwise regular (factory farmed) beef prices are just a bit higher than yours. I did shop at Publix when I was in Orlando last year and I know they don't sell grass fed beef there because I looked for it. I would highly doubt Walmart sells it too.

I think Publix has grass fed beef under their "Greenwise" brand - although, maybe that is just "organic" (which is essentially a nonsense word meaning whatever anyone wants it to mean, just about).

I can't wait for someone to come up with factory grown meat, which was never a walking-around animal - just meat grown in a lab. If they can grow organs (and they have), we should be able to grow muscle tissue. Then this whole debate can come to an end. Well, it probably won't. Someone will complain about the meat grown in a lab....

It's kind of like how the anti-abortion folks still complain about the morning after pill. They should be the most ardent proponents of the morning after pill, but they aren't - mainly because it kills their activist movement. Ironically, the last thing any activist movement wants is to actually ultimately succeed.

They already do make meat in labs, and have been for years. I've watched reports within the last few months about recent meat-making breakthroughs, but here's an article from a few years back:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... d=90235492