Christianity - A respectful dialogue

[thedistillers]

Yay one of Calli's chew toys. He will be here soon to give you another chomping. Welcome brave one.

I'm not sure why some people almost worship "Calli". Just because his answers are incisive doesn't make him right. His philosophical worldview is outdated, and self-refuting.

The Christian worldview might be false, but it is not self-refuting. Therefore a Christian is more rational than a positivist, even if Christianity is false.

[thedistillers]

Evidence? (for the sense, not the sockpuppetry, sciwoman's word is good enough for me)

What evidence is there that the world exists and is not just an illusion?

I don't have any evidence that the world is not an illusion, I just trust my senses that the world is real. Why should it be different for God?

You don't have any choice but to assume that the world your senses reveal to you is at least in some way real, or you wouldn't bother eating and drinking.

Regardless, I'm not interested in arguments, only in evidence. So if you have none, I'm not really interested in continuing to discuss the matter.

Okay. Bye.

[Uselesstwit]

If all humans have this "sensus divinitatis" how come you don't consider all gods equal? Does it just become a numbers game or are some people malfunctioning?

[thedistillers]

Evidence? (for the sense, not the sockpuppetry, sciwoman's word is good enough for me)

What evidence is there that the world exists and is not just an illusion?

I don't have any evidence that the world is not an illusion, I just trust my senses that the world is real. Why should it be different for God?

Because we can generally agree on definitions for "real world" things, whether it is a shared illusion or not. If I say "desk", you are not automatically going to think of an ocean, or an elephant, or a red wagon. That significantly doesn't happen when I say "God".

Actually if you say "desk", each person will have a different image in mind. When people think God, they think about the immaterial creator of the universe. The rest is just theological details, like the color of a desk.

[statichaos]

I'm going to expand on my earlier reply: I do sense what I believe to be God, or at least the presence of the divine. Others do not sense it. I have no idea why this is, but the idea that this stems from "wickedness" seems to have no bearing in fact whatsoever, and I'm not sure how one would go about determining such things. I've known people who would qualify as wicked by my definition who also claimed to sense God. I've additionally known people who claim to not sense God who are among the kindest and most compassionate people I've ever met.

I suppose that my uncertainty here is how you go about determining the wickedness of a person, and how you would associate that with their sense of the divine. Is there a chart? A scale? If you masturbate often, are you less likely to sense God? If you take in stray kittens and give money to the poor, are you more likely to do so? How about those who claim to sense God, yet seem to indulge in all manner of depravity?

No, this explains nothing. I do not believe that my sense of the divine is a delusion. However, if the only alternative were that this sense of the divine had something to do with the wickedness of others, I would accept it as such, as I consider myself no more or less wicked than most of the people I know.

[statichaos]

Evidence? (for the sense, not the sockpuppetry, sciwoman's word is good enough for me)

What evidence is there that the world exists and is not just an illusion?

I don't have any evidence that the world is not an illusion, I just trust my senses that the world is real. Why should it be different for God?

Because we can generally agree on definitions for "real world" things, whether it is a shared illusion or not. If I say "desk", you are not automatically going to think of an ocean, or an elephant, or a red wagon. That significantly doesn't happen when I say "God".

Actually if you say "desk", each person will have a different image in mind. When people think God, they think about the immaterial creator of the universe. The rest is just theological details, like the color of a desk.

Really? I don't think about the immaterial creator of the universe, as I don't claim to know the reasons or the cause for the existence of the universe other than what scientists refer to as the big bang.

[Feck]

But if I say unicorn people automatically think of a white one does that mean that unicorns exist or that it is an Idea lots of people have heard of ?

And why is it wicked to not believe ? Even if you are right that some external thing created the universe why does it follow that I'm wicked ?

what is wicked anyway ?

[Valden]

Here's a starter:

- Humans have a sensus divinitatis, which allow them to know that the proposition "God exists" is true,without any empirical evidence needed. Those who deny that the proposition "God exists" is true purposely reject the spirit in their wickedness.

Discuss.

Cali is male.

I have no idea what a "sensus divinitatis" even is. And I highly doubt anyone even has one.
Btw, which god are you referring too?

I also don't consider myself to be wicked.

[Mephistopheles]

Sensus divinitatis

Evidence that this exists, please?

know...without any empirical evidence needed.

Oh, never mind then. How very rational of you.

[statichaos]

But if I say unicorn people automatically think of a white one does that mean that unicorns exist or that it is an Idea lots of people have heard of ?

And why is it wicked to not believe ? Even if you are right that some external thing created the universe why does it follow that I'm wicked ?

what is wicked anyway ?

An overrated book, but the musical had a good tune or two.

[Valden]

Sensus divinitatis

Evidence that this exists, please?

know...without any empirical evidence needed.

Oh, never mind then. How very rational of you.

Hey Meph.. I didn't say any of that. Quote the right person silly!

An overrated book, but the musical had a good tune or two.

I love that book. Haven't read the other two yet.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

First I hope I'm welcomed here. I was banned from RD forum, and was informed that legal action would be taken against me if I would try to register again. All I did was challenging the positivist Calilasseia and her (or his?) vacuous slogans (e.g. If an entity X is postulated to exist, and there exists in turn no substantive evidence supporting the existence of entity X, then the default position is to regard entity x as non-existent until said substantive evidence materialises. ).

I would like to have a respectful dialogue with non-Christians, and challenge their worldview.

Here's a starter:

- Humans have a sensus divinitatis, which allow them to know that the proposition "God exists" is true,without any empirical evidence needed. Those who deny that the proposition "God exists" is true purposely reject the spirit in their wickedness.

Discuss.

I don't sense God. I would've accepted that feeling very quickly when I was struggling to keep my faith as a young teenager.

Your assuming way too much about what others sense.

In other words; You're full of incredible amounts of shit.

No need for that last line. Try and keep things civil. Cheers.

[Mac_Guffin]

First I hope I'm welcomed here. I was banned from RD forum, and was informed that legal action would be taken against me if I would try to register again. All I did was challenging the positivist Calilasseia and her (or his?) vacuous slogans (e.g. If an entity X is postulated to exist, and there exists in turn no substantive evidence supporting the existence of entity X, then the default position is to regard entity x as non-existent until said substantive evidence materialises. ).

I would like to have a respectful dialogue with non-Christians, and challenge their worldview.

Here's a starter:

- Humans have a sensus divinitatis, which allow them to know that the proposition "God exists" is true,without any empirical evidence needed. Those who deny that the proposition "God exists" is true purposely reject the spirit in their wickedness.

Discuss.

I don't sense God. I would've accepted that feeling very quickly when I was struggling to keep my faith as a young teenager.

Your assuming way too much about what others sense.

In other words; You're full of incredible amounts of shit.

No need for that last line. Try and keep things civil. Cheers.

Oh, sorry.

[Bruce Burleson]

All I did was challenging the positivist Calilasseia and her (or his?) vacuous slogans (e.g. If an entity X is postulated to exist, and there exists in turn no substantive evidence supporting the existence of entity X, then the default position is to regard entity x as non-existent until said substantive evidence materialises.).

Where did the blue butterfly go after RDF disappeared?

[Mephistopheles]

Sensus divinitatis

Evidence that this exists, please?

know...without any empirical evidence needed.

Oh, never mind then. How very rational of you.

Hey Meph.. I didn't say any of that. Quote the right person silly!

An overrated book, but the musical had a good tune or two.

I love that book. Haven't read the other two yet.

lol, I quoted your post cuz I was lazy and deleted the wrong quote. My apologies. Will fix.