The state of the UK

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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Brian Peacock » Mon Dec 20, 2021 1:00 pm


Scot Dutchy wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:
Mon Dec 20, 2021 1:15 am
Scot Dutchy wrote:Brian

A vast majority of nutritional experts warn about vegan diets. If you think yours is sufficient for you and you can live with it fair enough. I dont want to know about or be constantly exposed to false propaganda thank you.
Veganism is not just dietary, and you know it is not, it is also a life style which many diehards of the movement want to impose on the rest of us.
Yes, you've said that often enough. But repetition alone does not forward your point. Why are you reluctant to acknowledge that omnivores can also be nutritionally impoverished? The inclusion of animal ingredients in one's diet is no more an indicator of health and well-being than their absence. The mythical vegans, with some mysterious power to dictate what you are allowed to eat, are a spectre of your own imagination, even as you decry and chide those who, for whatever reason, do not adhere to your own dietary norms and standards. You demand the freedom and autonomy to eat as you wish, but in doing so you also require everyone else to endorse and adopt your dietary ideals. It seems to me that it is you, my friend, who is the one playing the part of the intolerant dietary ideolgue in this particular conversation.

How's your vitamin D level?
I suppose you ignore their advertising campaigns. They are pretty active here. I never see ad campaigns from the other side. In my supermarket which is close to a cell of them, yep they live in the best districts, has a separate section for them full of processed soya. They also have a separate label on all other produce that is suitable for them.
Have a look https://www.ah.nl/shop/dieetwensen/vegan

Most of it is heavily processed but who is bothered so long it suits their demands.

My vitamin D is fine thanks. I get it on prescription and take it twice a month. I take on D3 every day as well. I have my blood examined every three months. What surprises my GP is the high blood oxygenation (usually 98%) even with only 40% lung capacity.
1. Vegans don't advertise. You're confusing the companies hawking their wears for the people they're hawking them at. Is this why you think vegans are trying to impose their diets on you - through advertising?

2. We also have the same labelling, along with labelling for allergies and intolerances (nuts, gluten free etc). Are the gluten intolerant similarly forcing their lifestyle on you simply by being visibly catered for?

3. Yeah, there's a lot of money to he made out of vegans, but you really must shake this assumption that vegans can only survive by purchasing processed alternatives to meat, milk, and cheese etc. Ever wondered why you never see a 'Vegan Potato' or a 'Vegan Carrot' at the supermarket? Shopping vegan basically means not walking up the dairy or meat aisle - pretty much most of the other staples in the rest of the store are available without the need for special labelling. Do you really think that vegans can only buy or eat things with 'vegan' written on them?

4. Good to hear about your vitamin D. Taking a supplement is a reliable way to cover any shortfall in vitamins, minerals and trace elements etc.


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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Scot Dutchy » Mon Dec 20, 2021 1:43 pm

Vegans are lobbying through lobby firms. Why have a separate label when normal food wont kill them? Nuts do kill that is why they have warning labels. We have vegan labels on vegetables and fruits. Well the vegan section in the supermarket contains heavily processed food. Maybe you dont eat it but someone does. I would agree why does the vegan label then exist? Is nutritional knowledge not understood by most vegans?

I only take a supplement for vitamin D because there is no natural source and the sun at this time of year is too weak. Summertime I hardly use it but these days due to lack of mobility I have used it the whole year as I was advised to. I dont take any medicine either just the occasional pain killer when my lungs flair up.
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Brian Peacock » Mon Dec 20, 2021 7:21 pm

The main shortfall for veg*ns is B12 - which is predominantly acquired through the intermediatory of a herbivore. In the olden days we munched a bit of brewer's yeast to cover that - but if you don't mind marmite you can get all you need on your morning toast. I think most ethical vegans are well informed about their nutrition - the TikTok trend followers probably not so much. The point is, if you're aware of your nutritional requirements you can take steps to cover it - like you do with vitamin D.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Scot Dutchy » Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:34 pm

B12 is readily available. D and D3 are not unless you are in sunny areas. There are no alternative sources which is different from B12. It is not only B12 though is it? The thing is if I could get a supply of D and D3 naturally I would take it. Vegans ignore the ready supply of B12 in meat.

10 Vegan Diet Dangers (#4 can get you in BIG trouble)!

Eight Potential Vegan Diet Dangers (One Is Irreversible)

7 Warning Signs Your Vegan Diet Won’t Last

5 potential drawbacks of following a vegan diet

Never mind the shortages of key vitamins:

7 vitamin supplements you might need if you're vegan

For something claimed to be healthy it is a great way to kill yourself.
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by pErvinalia » Mon Dec 20, 2021 11:07 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Mon Dec 20, 2021 1:43 pm
Vegans are lobbying through lobby firms. Why have a separate label when normal food wont kill them? Nuts do kill that is why they have warning labels. We have vegan labels on vegetables and fruits. Well the vegan section in the supermarket contains heavily processed food.
Who gives a fuck? Why do you have to hate everything different to you?
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Brian Peacock » Mon Dec 20, 2021 11:20 pm


Scot Dutchy wrote:Vegans ignore the ready supply of B12 in meat.
I don't think you get what it means to be a vegetarian do you? When you don't eat meat you should supplement your B12, like when you don't live in sunny climes you should supplement your D vitamins.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by macdoc » Mon Dec 20, 2021 11:31 pm

B12 us easily added and is to meat substitutes
Beyond Burger
Vitamin B12 2.4mcg 100%
Mince

Meat-free Monday, any night. A tasty protein switch in your favourite dish. High in protein and containing no artificial colours or preservatives, Birds Eye Plant Based Mince is a deliciously tasty plant based alternative. Crafted using the highest quality ingredients Birds Eye Plant Based Mince are a source of iron, zinc and B12 and are low in saturated fat and are vegan friendly. Enjoy Meat free Mondays any night of the week with Birds Eye Plant Based Mince. Our range is high in protein & vegan friendly, so enjoy plant based eating with this flavourful and versatile range.
https://birdseye.com.au/our-range/plant ... ange/mince

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Re: The state of the UK

Post by pErvinalia » Tue Dec 21, 2021 2:30 am

Yes but they are different to Scot. He can't abide that.
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Hermit » Tue Dec 21, 2021 3:26 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:34 pm
B12 is readily available. D and D3 are not unless you are in sunny areas. There are no alternative sources which is different from B12. It is not only B12 though is it? The thing is if I could get a supply of D and D3 naturally I would take it. Vegans ignore the ready supply of B12 in meat.
No vitamin D3 supplements in the Netherlands? What a primitive country!

I just had a quick look at one of my local grocery shops.

$14.00

Image


$14.50

Image
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Scot Dutchy » Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:23 am

Once again your arse has taken over Hermit but there you go. Try reading for a change. I said natural sources. Supplements are not natural. Usually the result of a chemical process. The best natural B12 is readily available in red meat but D and D3 rely on sunlight. Of course we can get supplements and at damn cheaper price as well.
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Brian Peacock » Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:36 am

Sunlight is the natural source of vitamin D, therefore we should all move below the 32nd parallel to live a natural, chemical-free life.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Hermit » Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:46 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:23 am
Once again your arse has taken over Hermit but there you go. Try reading for a change. I said natural sources.
You did not. You wrote "if I could get a supply of D and D3 naturally I would take it" and "There are no alternative sources". The ambiguity is palpable in the former and plain wrong in the latter assertion.
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Scot Dutchy » Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:52 am

Hermit wrote:
Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:46 am
Scot Dutchy wrote:
Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:23 am
Once again your arse has taken over Hermit but there you go. Try reading for a change. I said natural sources.
You did not. You wrote "if I could get a supply of D and D3 naturally I would take it" and "There are no alternative sources". The ambiguity is palpable in the former and plain wrong in the latter assertion.
Never mind. :fp: You misquoted me as well which is against the Rules. But reporting has no point anymore.
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Brian Peacock » Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:57 am

The naturalistic fallacy is an informal logical fallacy which argues that if something is ‘natural’ it must be good. It is closely related to the is/ought fallacy – when someone tries to infer what ‘ought’ to be done from what ‘is’.

https://ethics.org.au/ethics-explainer- ... c-fallacy/
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The state of the UK

Post by Hermit » Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:59 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:52 am
Hermit wrote:
Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:46 am
Scot Dutchy wrote:
Tue Dec 21, 2021 7:23 am
Once again your arse has taken over Hermit but there you go. Try reading for a change. I said natural sources.
You did not. You wrote "if I could get a supply of D and D3 naturally I would take it" and "There are no alternative sources". The ambiguity is palpable in the former and plain wrong in the latter assertion.
Never mind. :fp: You misquoted me as well which is against the Rules.
I copypasted your exact words, and there was no cherry picking involved. :lay:
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops. - Stephen J. Gould

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