The Trump Pandemic

[rainbow]

What happened in virus news today, and how does it show Trump's racism?

Trump not only still blames the Chinese for lying about person to person transmission, he wants to make them pay for it.

I suppose he forgot to ask the CIA to fact check their statement.

...so silly of him!

[pErvinalia]

[Tero]

Here are the facts:

1) President Trump has the authority to use the DPA to meet a number of critical needs—including #COVID19 tests.

2) Congress allocated $1B to the DPA fund for that exact reason.

3) 40,000 Americans died before President Trump used the DPA to order tests.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RepKatiePort ... 2225923072

[Sean Hayden]

Actually, those are just facts without context attempting to assert as fact that things would have been better had Trump used the DPA sooner. Unfortunately these facts without context fail to do so for anyone not already convinced that just having another president in the White House would have given us a better outcome.

A bit of context would include the reasons why the DPA wasn't used sooner e.g. advisors against it, philosophical differences, and even more interesting and useful in my opinion would be detailed explanations rather than hand-waiving about how the DPA would have solved problems the private sector couldn't on its own. It's a bit much to expect Americans to accept that as awful as the US government is at just about everything, its merely turning towards resolving production issues would have been a magic bullet.

So, give specifics, give details, tell me how you've performed in relevant past situations...

--//--

If it turns out that more could have been done and much better, then we can confidently say that the myth of salvation from the private sector is busted. However, it would be a mistake to then conclude that our government could have done better!

[Tero]

So it could not be helped? We were stuck with both Trump and a pandemic. It was destiny!

9E59D069-5B45-4EF2-8782-CBEFE0974783.jpeg (89.57 KiB) Viewed 1094 times

[Sean Hayden]

--and Twitter goes wild!

[Sean Hayden]

[Seabass]

Actually, those are just facts without context attempting to assert as fact that things would have been better had Trump used the DPA sooner. Unfortunately these facts without context fail to do so for anyone not already convinced that just having another president in the White House would have given us a better outcome.

A bit of context would include the reasons why the DPA wasn't used sooner e.g. advisors against it, philosophical differences, and even more interesting and useful in my opinion would be detailed explanations rather than hand-waiving about how the DPA would have solved problems the private sector couldn't on its own. It's a bit much to expect Americans to accept that as awful as the US government is at just about everything, its merely turning towards resolving production issues would have been a magic bullet.

So, give specifics, give details, tell me how you've performed in relevant past situations...

--//--

If it turns out that more could have been done and much better, then we can confidently say that the myth of salvation from the private sector is busted. However, it would be a mistake to then conclude that our government could have done better!

There's no missing context. You just keep asserting that there is. Trump weakened the US's pandemic response, then failed use authority that he does have in a productive manner. There's no other context needed. I don't care if his advisors told him not to use the DPA. That in way absolves him of his failure to act. He chooses his advisors.

Obama obviously would have handled this pandemic differently. We know this because he dealt with several epidemics during his tenure. Whether fewer Americans would have died with Obama at the helm, we can only speculate, but the notion that the outcome would have been exactly the same with a totally different administration is a bit ludicrous if you ask me...

[Sean Hayden]

I provided examples of what I considered to be the missing context. I did not merely assert it was missing, it isn't there, and without it the facts don't do what the author hoped. By showing the reasons for not using DPA sooner it may become apparent that the hoped for outcome of using DPA wasn't realistic, or may even have been harmful. By the same token, detailed DPA implementation specifics rather than hand-waiving could help demonstrate why it would have worked as intended. At least we should hope that information like the administration's reasoning, and DPA implementation details would help provide the appropriate context for evaluating these facts.

I don't care if his advisors told him not to use the DPA. That in way absolves him of his failure to act. He chooses his advisors.

Then why should I value your opinion at all? You don't even concern yourself with the opinion of advisors, or believe they play no role because they only, advise...

[Seabass]

I didn't say they play no role. They're his advisors. He chooses them. Trump's not some hapless bystander, he occupies the most powerful political office in the most powerful country in the world.

Likewise, if a president chooses a neo-Nazi who uses spray-on hair to advise him on immigration policy, ultimately it is the president who bears responsibility for any changes made to the nation's immigration policy. He doesn't get a pass there either. Not from me, anyway...

[Seabass]

What have you got to lose? Take it!

Study finds no benefit, higher death rate in patients taking hydroxychloroquine for Covid-19
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/21/health/h ... index.html

[Sean Hayden]

I didn't say they play no role. They're his advisors. He chooses them. Trump's not some hapless bystander, he occupies the most powerful political office in the most powerful country in the world.

Likewise, if a president chooses a neo-Nazi who uses spray-on hair to advise him on immigration policy, ultimately it is the president who bears responsibility for any changes made to the nation's immigration policy. He doesn't get a pass there either. Not from me, anyway...

I wanted to look at what advisors say because I want to understand the decisions made. I don't look at them just because I'm trying to figure out who to blame! But blame is all you're ever offering here. I want more.

What did the advisers say about DPA? Many experts who are not direct advisors to the president were recommending he use it immediately. But FEMA thought it was unnecessary as did Assistant Director of Health ADM Brett P. Giroir. Why?

[Tero]

NPR Reports:
The federal veto

Attorney General Bill Barr opened up a new front in the federalism wars on Tuesday with comments on a radio show that suggested he'd support lawsuits against states that preserve restrictions for too long.

Trump has sought both to empower governors to manage their own states' policies but also sided with small groups of protesters calling for some states to lift their stay-at-home and business restrictions.

All the same, Barr's comments on Tuesday revived the idea that federal officials might try to preserve a veto over states deemed too stringent or too slow in opening back up.

Trump also repeated on Tuesday that he wanted governors to act as they see fit but if he saw anything of which he disapproved he vowed to try to stop it.

https://www.npr.org/2020/04/21/83878136 ... ars-simmer

[Brian Peacock]

It's just The Culture war folks. Nothing to see here. Move along now... move along.

[JimC]

I was thinking how different this American spat between the feds and the states is to the way recent politics have played out in Oz. The PM, a Liberal Party/National Party coalition leader, whose politics I generally detest, has (after a late and fumbling start) done a pretty good overall job, putting a lot of money into supporting jobs. The main contrast comes in the relationship between the Federal government and the Premiers of the states, several of whom are ALP leaders. There is a national emergency cabinet of the PM and the pre, meeting electronically several times a week, and relatively little political argument, with a commitment from all to follow the medical/scientific advice. The lockdown is a pain for all, but it's working, with relatively few new cases per day, and a death toll in the 70s...