Global Climate Change Science News

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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Feb 13, 2020 3:52 am

Cunt wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 3:08 am
Just what was it that 'thousands of scientists' agreed on? Was it the phrase 'anthropogenic climate change is partially real'

Something more definitive?
Do you know anything about the submissions and review process for papers which may eventually contribute to the IPCC reports and appendixes, or the number of papers so far submitted, the range and scope of those papers, the revision and/or citation rate of those papers and the researchers who contributed them, or even the shortfalls in research that the IPCC have identified? That information is open to the public if one is truly interested in being informed, regardless of the view one might take. Your sceptic-fu is weak my chilly friend.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Cunt » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:00 am

Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 3:52 am
Cunt wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 3:08 am
Just what was it that 'thousands of scientists' agreed on? Was it the phrase 'anthropogenic climate change is partially real'

Something more definitive?
Do you know anything about the submissions and review process for papers which may eventually contribute to the IPCC reports and appendixes, or the number of papers so far submitted, the range and scope of those papers, the revision and/or citation rate of those papers and the researchers who contributed them, or even the shortfalls in research that the IPCC have identified? That information is open to the public if one is truly interested in being informed, regardless of the view one might take. Your sceptic-fu is weak my chilly friend.
None of that matters, because no-one is asking me to do anything.

If they asked me to stop running my truck, I would have to consider the question.

If they asked me to stop using diesel to heat my home, I would have to consider the question.

Those things aren't suggested, because they are ludicrous. Going 'fossil-fuel-free' in any short time is a pipe dream, and everyone knows it.

What they are doing is trying to dominate the conversation, so that no dissent is allowed.

Why dump Dr. Moore from that conference? Is it so dangerous to have a dissenting Phd present alongside over 40 others (who are all in lockstep)?

I mean, if their ideas can't stand public scrutiny by peers, then I trust them (and their jet-setting promo team) a lot less.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:11 am

Who are 'they', and who would you accept advice from if asked not to run your diesel truck or rely on fossil fuel for your household energy needs?
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Cunt » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:19 am

Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:11 am
Who are 'they', and who would you accept advice from if asked not to run your diesel truck or rely on fossil fuel for your household energy needs?
They would be government. No-one else is stupid enough to try to talk me into stopping using diesel (furnace oil) to heat my home.

As to my truck, I don't start it often this time of year. Not only is it a fuel-hog, it takes more damage when run in the cold. I avoid it when I can.

But if government asks me to vote on a carbon tax, I'll vote no.

If they ask me to elect the greens, I'll say FUCK no.

If you want me to believe that humans increase the temperature of Earth, I might believe you (but it would take a lot of study to agree, if you see my meaning)

If you want me to believe that paying more tax will change future weather, well, that just sounds like fantasy.

Why not make a case for better energy, like nuclear or something else reasonable. Most of the fools are trying to fund solar (a dead end) and wind (not all that reliable either)

I'm all for better energy solutions, but when I hear someone suggesting no fossil fuels, I think of all the people they would be condemning to death and hardship, and dismiss their ideas as unworkable. Do you live somewhere that you could just stop using fossil fuels? Or would you, like me, have to immediately start burning a FUCKTON of wood to stay warm?
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:25 am

Cunt wrote:
Hermit wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 2:30 am
Whatever capacity for scepticism you have keeps getting blindsided by your confirmation bias. One of the posts your from just a few hours ago was a textbook example of how that works. You found that 1977 Time magazine title page warning us of the coming ice age valuable evidence to support your belief that anthropogenic global warming is bullshit.
Incorrect.

It was evidence that Time magazine is bullshit.

I told you after, I reviewed MANY Time covers after your explanation. Then I asked you about their 'polar bear' lie, and if you knew about it.
It strengthened you scepticism. So, when it was pointed out to you that it was faked, did it diminish your belief that anthropogenic global warming is bullshit? Did it diminish your doubt that anthropogenic global warming is real? It seems not.
I don't know about 'anthropogenic climate change', or what it would mean to agree or disagree. I'm not a scientist, but if I had a phd, and a different opinion on it, what do you suppose would happen?

What would be the response of government, CBC and academia? To discuss my ideas and refute them if incorrect? Or throw a tantrum and try to have me removed from the conference schedule?

Well, it just happened in Regina. Dr. Moore (co-founder of Greenpeace) is a Phd with a relevant degree, LOTS of experience in the field, and the courageous academics/government/media marched in lockstep to de-platform him.

If you wonder why I find that 'popular opinion' about 'climate change' suspicious, this is the kind of behaviour that makes me fairly dismissive of foreign governments who try to push it (like the EU or UN does) and laughably dismissive of the CBC who push it, because lets face it, they are in the pocket of government as much as BBC, or Pravda.
You know you can read the IPCC report directly, without any media spin affecting it? It's written by scientists. You know those people who created pretty much everything that you rely on day to day.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:26 am


Cunt wrote:
JimC wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 2:17 am
Legal issues and lawsuits loom large in future climate change actions:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-13/ ... g/11943146
ABC...isn't that the network that spiked the Epstein story?

So they covered for an elite, world-hopping convicted pedophile, and you want me to be convinced?

Holy shit, the only thing more hilarious would be if Disney owned ABC lol

...oh wait...
Australian Broadcasting Corporation. :fp:


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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:30 am

pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:25 am
You know you can read the IPCC report directly, without any media spin affecting it? It's written by scientists. You know those people who created pretty much everything that you rely on day to day.
There's nothing that gives me a greater laugh than reading how scientists know jack shit about fuck all from people who flapped their sausage fingers over a computer keyboard on another continent.
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There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

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"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Cunt » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:32 am

pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:26 am

Australian Broadcasting Corporation. :fp:
So is that like BBC, CBC or Pravda? Government-funded 'news'?
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Cunt » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:34 am

Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:30 am
pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:25 am
You know you can read the IPCC report directly, without any media spin affecting it? It's written by scientists. You know those people who created pretty much everything that you rely on day to day.
There's nothing that gives me a greater laugh than reading how scientists know jack shit about fuck all from people who flapped their sausage fingers over a computer keyboard on another continent.
If a thousand scientists agreed with the whole paper, and ten didn't, would you listen to the thousand? Or the ten? Both groups?

The dissenting opinion I mentioned today was a scientist who dissents. He is accused of being a 'denier' (as if insults will convince people that it is similar to being a 'holocaust denier')

Now, since I listened to him, and heard very quickly that he doesn't deny climate change, it starts to make those insulting fuckwads look...a bit less sciency.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:35 am

Cunt wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:11 am
Who are 'they', and who would you accept advice from if asked not to run your diesel truck or rely on fossil fuel for your household energy needs?
They would be government. No-one else is stupid enough to try to talk me into stopping using diesel (furnace oil) to heat my home.

As to my truck, I don't start it often this time of year. Not only is it a fuel-hog, it takes more damage when run in the cold. I avoid it when I can.

But if government asks me to vote on a carbon tax, I'll vote no.

If they ask me to elect the greens, I'll say FUCK no.

If you want me to believe that humans increase the temperature of Earth, I might believe you (but it would take a lot of study to agree, if you see my meaning)

If you want me to believe that paying more tax will change future weather, well, that just sounds like fantasy.

Why not make a case for better energy, like nuclear or something else reasonable. Most of the fools are trying to fund solar (a dead end) and wind (not all that reliable either)

I'm all for better energy solutions, but when I hear someone suggesting no fossil fuels, I think of all the people they would be condemning to death and hardship, and dismiss their ideas as unworkable. Do you live somewhere that you could just stop using fossil fuels? Or would you, like me, have to immediately start burning a FUCKTON of wood to stay warm?
No one is saying no fossil fuels. They are saying zero NET emissions.

And how is solar a dead end?
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Cunt » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:45 am

pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:35 am
And how is solar a dead end?
Well, it takes a large plastics and oil-fuelled manufacturing industry to create the panels, and they don't work so good. Their study is yielding interesting options, but mostly it's only 'worth it' when government funding / rebates make it worth it.

We have a bunch of 'off-grid' types here. Usually, they live on houseboats, equipped with solar panels and generators (with added propane often for winter heat)

They can only afford to do that if they are VERY well off. The poor 'off-grid' folk use wood instead.

Passive heating and stuff will improve our lot, but geothermal isn't going to cut it for us here, and so far nothing but nuclear, or diesel seems to do the job.

Net-zero? If it still means we are shipping HUGE truckloads of fuel north to keep this town alive, how does that phrase change anything? I mean other than increasing the bureacracy...
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:50 am

Cunt wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:34 am
Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:30 am
pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:25 am
You know you can read the IPCC report directly, without any media spin affecting it? It's written by scientists. You know those people who created pretty much everything that you rely on day to day.
There's nothing that gives me a greater laugh than reading how scientists know jack shit about fuck all from people who flapped their sausage fingers over a computer keyboard on another continent.
If a thousand scientists agreed with the whole paper, and ten didn't, would you listen to the thousand? Or the ten? Both groups?

The dissenting opinion I mentioned today was a scientist who dissents. He is accused of being a 'denier' (as if insults will convince people that it is similar to being a 'holocaust denier')

Now, since I listened to him, and heard very quickly that he doesn't deny climate change, it starts to make those insulting fuckwads look...a bit less sciency.
Science isn't based on opinion but on the verification of sound methodologies, the rigorous acquisition of data, and a robust critical appraisal of what has been observed. Only by this can science progress, can scientific understanding be secured and, if necessary, revised or recinded - by the exact same process.

Let's not pretend you're raising any scientific objections here - but if you are please share your datasets.

🐩
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"It isn't necessary to imagine the world ending in fire or ice.
There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

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"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
.

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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:53 am

Cunt wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:45 am
pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:35 am
And how is solar a dead end?
Well, it takes a large plastics and oil-fuelled manufacturing industry to create the panels, and they don't work so good. Their study is yielding interesting options, but mostly it's only 'worth it' when government funding / rebates make it worth it.

We have a bunch of 'off-grid' types here. Usually, they live on houseboats, equipped with solar panels and generators (with added propane often for winter heat)

They can only afford to do that if they are VERY well off. The poor 'off-grid' folk use wood instead.

Passive heating and stuff will improve our lot, but geothermal isn't going to cut it for us here, and so far nothing but nuclear, or diesel seems to do the job.

Net-zero? If it still means we are shipping HUGE truckloads of fuel north to keep this town alive, how does that phrase change anything? I mean other than increasing the bureacracy...
Solar efficiency improves every year through research. You know, that thing scientist (the people you have zero understanding of) do?

Net-zero, for the terminally uninformed, means the capturing of greenhouse gasses at least matches the output of greenhouse gasses. The clue is in the name. NET zero emissions.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Cunt » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:57 am

Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:50 am
Cunt wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:34 am
Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:30 am
pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:25 am
You know you can read the IPCC report directly, without any media spin affecting it? It's written by scientists. You know those people who created pretty much everything that you rely on day to day.
There's nothing that gives me a greater laugh than reading how scientists know jack shit about fuck all from people who flapped their sausage fingers over a computer keyboard on another continent.
If a thousand scientists agreed with the whole paper, and ten didn't, would you listen to the thousand? Or the ten? Both groups?

The dissenting opinion I mentioned today was a scientist who dissents. He is accused of being a 'denier' (as if insults will convince people that it is similar to being a 'holocaust denier')

Now, since I listened to him, and heard very quickly that he doesn't deny climate change, it starts to make those insulting fuckwads look...a bit less sciency.
Science isn't based on opinion but on the verification of sound methodologies, the rigorous acquisition of data, and a robust critical appraisal of what has been observed. Only by this can science progress, can scientific understanding be secured and, if necessary, revised or recinded - by the exact same process.

Let's not pretend you're raising any scientific objections here - but if you are please share your datasets.

🐩
No datasets, just examining how you 'science-types' deal with dissent.

It is very informative. For example, you all must accept the dogma, or be called 'denier'. Look at that language...it comes from 'holocaust denier', and seems an attempt to be as insulting as possible.

As to peer review, and all that rigor you were blathering about, you might want to listen to a real scientist provide criticism for the current state of peer review, and the academic establishment in general. Two brothers, commanding phd's in math and biology, discuss it at length and I found it surprisingly corrosive to my (previously undented) admiration for the peer review process.

Of course, it might not agree with dogma, so you might not want to listent to the Weinstein brothers, but hey, you might. It was a VERY interesting podcast.

https://podcasts.google.com/?feed=aHR0c ... HQAAAAAQAg

If you take the time to understand these folks (they talk pretty plainly) I'll be interested to hear your take on 'the DISC' they talk about.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:03 am

Would somebody who argued that the World was flat in spite of rigorously verified evidence to the contrary be considered a dissenter? What other words might we use to describe their position?
Rationalia relies on voluntary donations. There is no obligation of course, but if you value this place and want to see it continue please consider making a small donation towards the forum's running costs.
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"It isn't necessary to imagine the world ending in fire or ice.
There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

Frank Zappa

"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
.

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