Only in America

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Re: Only in America

Post by Seabass » Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:47 am

The only thing that can stop a bad diaper bag with a gun is a good diaper bag with a gun.

Alabama man dies after gun in diaper bag goes off
https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/ala ... g-62424603
An Alabama man has died days after he was accidentally shot outside a Chuck E. Cheese restaurant when a gun discharged inside a baby's diaper bag.

Al.com quotes the Jefferson County coroner's office as saying Tuesday that 22-year-old Timothy Roshun Smith Jr. has died.

Police in the Birmingham suburb of Vestavia Hills say Smith was preparing to change his daughter's diaper in a car outside the pizza restaurant Saturday when a gun stored in the diaper bag went off, hitting them both.

Police say the girl was shot in the leg and the man in the chest. The girl's injuries weren't considered life threatening.

Lt. Michael Keller says investigators believe the man was searching inside the diaper bag when he hit the weapon and it fired accidentally.
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Re: Only in America

Post by pErvinalia » Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:38 am

Darwin award.
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Re: Only in America

Post by Forty Two » Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:53 pm

Joe wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:13 pm
The stupid; it burns!
Fox News contributor Katie Pavlich attempted to counter Senator Elizabeth Warren’s call to discuss the injustices of slavery, and its lasting systemic impact on generations of African-Americans, by claiming that the United States does not get “enough credit” for ending slavery.

While discussing reparations to descendents of enslaved people on Fox News’ "Outnumbered" on Tuesday, Ms Pavlich claimed that the US was the first country to abolish slavery.

“They keep blaming America for the sin of slavery but the truth is, throughout human history, slavery existed, and America came along as the first country to end it within 150 years,” she said. “And we get no credit for that to move forward and try to make good on that.”
:fp: :fp: :fp:
Her point is not wholly without merit. Remember, slavery in the Americas was created not by the United States, but by the United Kingdom, France, Spain and Portugal, predominantly. Those countries ignore their history in slavery and the slave trade. Spain and Portugal were far bigger slavers than the UK and France.

Brazil (a colony of Portugal) alone accounted almost 50% of the entirety of the slaves reaching the New World, and they almost kept slavery to the 20th century. Spanish America and the Caribbean accounted for another approximately 45% and the slaves that wound up in the US? Drum roll please.... about 5% of the slaves shipped to the new world went to the United States (and only the southern states).

The United Kingdom was the colonial empire that did the most to end slave trade, and ultimately the abolitionist movement in the US achieved its goals. The end of slavery did not come from South America or Spanish north America or the Caribbean. It did not come from Portugal, or Spain or France - or Asia or Africa. It came from the British Enlightenment, with most credit to the Scots.

Worldwide, slavery has existed for most of human history. Throughout much of Africa and muslim countries, slavery and the slave trade still goes on. During the time of the atlantic slave trade, Muslim countries rounded up slaves all the time - they would take them from Europe and the Americas, and slavery was quite common. See Barbary Slave Trade - and Corsairs, etc.

It was the western Enlightenment originating in the UK that gave the world the principles which ultimately ended slavery in the West. And that was before the rest of the world.

I wouldn't so much credit the US, as the lady in the article says - but it's a British achievement. I credit the British.

But most people focus on United States slavery as if it was the United States that created it, and the US that resisted ending it. That's not really an accurate way to look at it.
The most comprehensive analysis of shipping records over the course of the slave trade is the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade Database, edited by professors David Eltis and David Richardson. (While the editors are careful to say that all of their figures are estimates, I believe that they are the best estimates that we have, the proverbial "gold standard" in the field of the study of the slave trade.) Between 1525 and 1866, in the entire history of the slave trade to the New World, according to the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade Database, 12.5 million Africans were shipped to the New World. 10.7 million survived the dreaded Middle Passage, disembarking in North America, the Caribbean and South America.

And how many of these 10.7 million Africans were shipped directly to North America? Only about 388,000. That's right: a tiny percentage.

In fact, the overwhelming percentage of the African slaves were shipped directly to the Caribbean and South America; Brazil received 4.86 million Africans alone! Some scholars estimate that another 60,000 to 70,000 Africans ended up in the United States after touching down in the Caribbean first, so that would bring the total to approximately 450,000 Africans who arrived in the United States over the course of the slave trade.
https://www.theroot.com/how-many-slaves ... 1790873989

Let's also understand that the focus is on the US due to the civil war, but the abolition of slavery in British Colonies did not occur until 1834, and slavery ended in the US in 1865. So, it was only 32 years separating the two. In Brazil I think it was 1888, or 1890 before slavery ended there (nominally).

When the Brits freed their slaves in 1834, there were even slaves in Canada. Not many people understand that. But, there were - and throughout the British holdings in the Caribbean and the New World.

This was an effort basically started by the Quakers in the late 18th century, which took a generation or so to take hold and start working. In the rest of the world, however, slavery was still normal, as it was for most of human history. In Ethiopia, slavery and involuntary servitude were only officially abolished in 1942, or that of Saudi Arabia, where it went until about 1962.

This is not to say that the UK and the US don't have a lot to answer for in regards to slavery - they do. But, let's also not pretend that if we were all born in the 17th and early 18th centuries a world without slavery would hardly be thinkable. It's not as if we would, at least in all likelihood, be enlightened figures, seeing the inherent evil in the practice. Most of us would grow up in that milieu, and be part of it.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Only in America

Post by laklak » Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:29 pm

Dont go confusing the issue with pesky facts, we're speaking to a Larger Truth here. That means it's OK to lie.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Only in America

Post by Hermit » Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:34 pm

Forty Two wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:53 pm
Joe wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:13 pm
The stupid; it burns!
Fox News contributor Katie Pavlich attempted to counter Senator Elizabeth Warren’s call to discuss the injustices of slavery, and its lasting systemic impact on generations of African-Americans, by claiming that the United States does not get “enough credit” for ending slavery.

While discussing reparations to descendents of enslaved people on Fox News’ "Outnumbered" on Tuesday, Ms Pavlich claimed that the US was the first country to abolish slavery.

“They keep blaming America for the sin of slavery but the truth is, throughout human history, slavery existed, and America came along as the first country to end it within 150 years,” she said. “And we get no credit for that to move forward and try to make good on that.”
:fp: :fp: :fp:
Her point is not wholly without merit.
Yes it is. Not only did Great Britain abolish slavery in 1834, but
1846 - Danish governor proclaims emancipation of slaves in Danish West Indies, abolishing slavery

1848 - France abolishes slavery

1858 - Portugal abolishes slavery in its colonies, although all slaves are subject to a 20-year apprenticeship

1861 - Netherlands abolishes slavery in Dutch Caribbean colonies

1862 - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln proclaims emancipation of slaves with effect from January 1, 1863; 13th Amendment of U.S. Constitution follows in 1865 banning slavery
Pointing out that only 388,000 - 5% of the 12.5 million Africans who were shipped to the New World (10.7 million of whom actually survived the journey) - finished up in the USA does not lend any merit whatsoever to Ms Pavlich's claim that the US was the first country to abolish slavery, especially since she never mentioned that fact. Also, by the time Lincoln abolished slavery, there were about 4 million of them, mostly concentrated in the Confederate States.

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Re: Only in America

Post by laklak » Wed Apr 17, 2019 10:33 pm

Yeh, it was good to be an involuntarialy relocated African in Great Britian. Not so much to be Irish a few years later, at least if you liked to eat.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Only in America

Post by Forty Two » Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:13 pm

Hermit wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:34 pm
Forty Two wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:53 pm
Joe wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:13 pm
The stupid; it burns!
Fox News contributor Katie Pavlich attempted to counter Senator Elizabeth Warren’s call to discuss the injustices of slavery, and its lasting systemic impact on generations of African-Americans, by claiming that the United States does not get “enough credit” for ending slavery.

While discussing reparations to descendents of enslaved people on Fox News’ "Outnumbered" on Tuesday, Ms Pavlich claimed that the US was the first country to abolish slavery.

“They keep blaming America for the sin of slavery but the truth is, throughout human history, slavery existed, and America came along as the first country to end it within 150 years,” she said. “And we get no credit for that to move forward and try to make good on that.”
:fp: :fp: :fp:
Her point is not wholly without merit.
Yes it is. Not only did Great Britain abolish slavery in 1834, but
1846 - Danish governor proclaims emancipation of slaves in Danish West Indies, abolishing slavery

1848 - France abolishes slavery

1858 - Portugal abolishes slavery in its colonies, although all slaves are subject to a 20-year apprenticeship

1861 - Netherlands abolishes slavery in Dutch Caribbean colonies

1862 - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln proclaims emancipation of slaves with effect from January 1, 1863; 13th Amendment of U.S. Constitution follows in 1865 banning slavery
Pointing out that only 388,000 - 5% of the 12.5 million Africans who were shipped to the New World (10.7 million of whom actually survived the journey) - finished up in the USA does not lend any merit whatsoever to Ms Pavlich's claim that the US was the first country to abolish slavery, especially since she never mentioned that fact. Also, by the time Lincoln abolished slavery, there were about 4 million of them, mostly concentrated in the Confederate States.
That will teach you not to read the entirety of my posts I stated, expressly, that yes Great Britain abolished (technically) slavery in 1834 - I wrote that in my post. What the fuck is your problem? The whole of my post CREDITS Great Britain with being probably the greatest driving force which caused slavery to be abolished - the Enlightenment.

I never said that the claim that the US was the first country to abolish slavery was accurate. What I said was not entirely without merit was that the US is unfairly singled out and criticized for slavery, and was in fact part of the driving force in eliminating it. Only the southern states in the US were slave states - it was a different country at the time - states were sovereign. It was questionable if the federal government could even abolish slavery in the states. However, the abolitionist movement was very strong in the United States.

Look - I'm not going to go back over it. All you want to do is score points and come after me. Fine. Do you thing. However, had you bothered to read my post with any degree of willingness to discuss a point, rather than attack and personalize the issue, you'd see my point was much more nuanced, and I did not suggest that the US was the first country to abolish slavery or anything like that. It wasn't - but that list you stated there - it's nothing really worth applauding any of the countries - so the UK beat the US by 30 years? So the other countries by a few years? So what that the US beat Brazil by 23 years? The point is, the countries doing the abolishing of slavery owe that abolition to the Quakers and the Enlightenment thinkers of the West - mainly the United Kingdom. The "rest of the world" still had slavery (including North Africa, Asia, the Middle East, etc).

And, Pavlich corrected her statement during the broadcast, stating she misspoke and meant "one of the first."

The reality is that slavery was the norm in the world, and not just black slavery, but millions of Europeans were enslaved in North Africa and Arabia - there was a whole trade throughout the mediterrenean - Barbary Slave Trade. That didn't end until way after the UK, France, US et al ended it.

And, it's no great bragging right for Portugal and Spain to have abolished it in their colonies - the independent countries left behind by those colonial empires kept their slaves - as you didn't mention, Brazil still had slaves through at least 1888.

Where Ms. Pavlich's comments are "not entirely without merit" - which is a far cry from endorsing them wholecloth - was that the US and often the UK too are very unfairly blamed for the institution of slavery.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Only in America

Post by Hermit » Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:28 pm

Forty Two wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:13 pm
Hermit wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:34 pm
Forty Two wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:53 pm
Joe wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:13 pm
The stupid; it burns!
Fox News contributor Katie Pavlich attempted to counter Senator Elizabeth Warren’s call to discuss the injustices of slavery, and its lasting systemic impact on generations of African-Americans, by claiming that the United States does not get “enough credit” for ending slavery.

While discussing reparations to descendents of enslaved people on Fox News’ "Outnumbered" on Tuesday, Ms Pavlich claimed that the US was the first country to abolish slavery.

“They keep blaming America for the sin of slavery but the truth is, throughout human history, slavery existed, and America came along as the first country to end it within 150 years,” she said. “And we get no credit for that to move forward and try to make good on that.”
:fp: :fp: :fp:
Her point is not wholly without merit.
Yes it is. Not only did Great Britain abolish slavery in 1834, but
1846 - Danish governor proclaims emancipation of slaves in Danish West Indies, abolishing slavery

1848 - France abolishes slavery

1858 - Portugal abolishes slavery in its colonies, although all slaves are subject to a 20-year apprenticeship

1861 - Netherlands abolishes slavery in Dutch Caribbean colonies

1862 - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln proclaims emancipation of slaves with effect from January 1, 1863; 13th Amendment of U.S. Constitution follows in 1865 banning slavery
Pointing out that only 388,000 - 5% of the 12.5 million Africans who were shipped to the New World (10.7 million of whom actually survived the journey) - finished up in the USA does not lend any merit whatsoever to Ms Pavlich's claim that the US was the first country to abolish slavery, especially since she never mentioned that fact. Also, by the time Lincoln abolished slavery, there were about 4 million of them, mostly concentrated in the Confederate States.
That will teach you not to read the entirety of my posts
I read all of your previous post and decided to reply to one sentence of it, which was: "Her point is not wholly without merit.", explaining, as I went along, why her point is entirely without merit. No need to be a snowflake about me not salami slicing your usual Gish gallop.

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Re: Only in America

Post by Joe » Fri Apr 19, 2019 3:55 am

Joe wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:13 pm
The stupid; it burns!
Fox News contributor Katie Pavlich attempted to counter Senator Elizabeth Warren’s call to discuss the injustices of slavery, and its lasting systemic impact on generations of African-Americans, by claiming that the United States does not get “enough credit” for ending slavery.

While discussing reparations to descendents of enslaved people on Fox News’ "Outnumbered" on Tuesday, Ms Pavlich claimed that the US was the first country to abolish slavery.

“They keep blaming America for the sin of slavery but the truth is, throughout human history, slavery existed, and America came along as the first country to end it within 150 years,” she said. “And we get no credit for that to move forward and try to make good on that.”
:fp: :fp: :fp:
Oh, I remember this. I had to play the clip again, and it's still about the stupidest thing I've heard lately.
Forty Two wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:53 pm
Her point is not wholly without merit. Remember, slavery in the Americas was created not by the United States, but by the United Kingdom, France, Spain and Portugal, predominantly. Those countries ignore their history in slavery and the slave trade. Spain and Portugal were far bigger slavers than the UK and France.

Brazil (a colony of Portugal) alone accounted almost 50% of the entirety of the slaves reaching the New World, and they almost kept slavery to the 20th century. Spanish America and the Caribbean accounted for another approximately 45% and the slaves that wound up in the US? Drum roll please.... about 5% of the slaves shipped to the new world went to the United States (and only the southern states).

The United Kingdom was the colonial empire that did the most to end slave trade, and ultimately the abolitionist movement in the US achieved its goals. The end of slavery did not come from South America or Spanish north America or the Caribbean. It did not come from Portugal, or Spain or France - or Asia or Africa. It came from the British Enlightenment, with most credit to the Scots.

Worldwide, slavery has existed for most of human history. Throughout much of Africa and muslim countries, slavery and the slave trade still goes on. During the time of the atlantic slave trade, Muslim countries rounded up slaves all the time - they would take them from Europe and the Americas, and slavery was quite common. See Barbary Slave Trade - and Corsairs, etc.

It was the western Enlightenment originating in the UK that gave the world the principles which ultimately ended slavery in the West. And that was before the rest of the world.

I wouldn't so much credit the US, as the lady in the article says - but it's a British achievement. I credit the British.

But most people focus on United States slavery as if it was the United States that created it, and the US that resisted ending it. That's not really an accurate way to look at it.
The most comprehensive analysis of shipping records over the course of the slave trade is the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade Database, edited by professors David Eltis and David Richardson. (While the editors are careful to say that all of their figures are estimates, I believe that they are the best estimates that we have, the proverbial "gold standard" in the field of the study of the slave trade.) Between 1525 and 1866, in the entire history of the slave trade to the New World, according to the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade Database, 12.5 million Africans were shipped to the New World. 10.7 million survived the dreaded Middle Passage, disembarking in North America, the Caribbean and South America.

And how many of these 10.7 million Africans were shipped directly to North America? Only about 388,000. That's right: a tiny percentage.

In fact, the overwhelming percentage of the African slaves were shipped directly to the Caribbean and South America; Brazil received 4.86 million Africans alone! Some scholars estimate that another 60,000 to 70,000 Africans ended up in the United States after touching down in the Caribbean first, so that would bring the total to approximately 450,000 Africans who arrived in the United States over the course of the slave trade.
https://www.theroot.com/how-many-slaves ... 1790873989

Let's also understand that the focus is on the US due to the civil war, but the abolition of slavery in British Colonies did not occur until 1834, and slavery ended in the US in 1865. So, it was only 32 years separating the two. In Brazil I think it was 1888, or 1890 before slavery ended there (nominally).

When the Brits freed their slaves in 1834, there were even slaves in Canada. Not many people understand that. But, there were - and throughout the British holdings in the Caribbean and the New World.

This was an effort basically started by the Quakers in the late 18th century, which took a generation or so to take hold and start working. In the rest of the world, however, slavery was still normal, as it was for most of human history. In Ethiopia, slavery and involuntary servitude were only officially abolished in 1942, or that of Saudi Arabia, where it went until about 1962.

This is not to say that the UK and the US don't have a lot to answer for in regards to slavery - they do. But, let's also not pretend that if we were all born in the 17th and early 18th centuries a world without slavery would hardly be thinkable. It's not as if we would, at least in all likelihood, be enlightened figures, seeing the inherent evil in the practice. Most of us would grow up in that milieu, and be part of it.
That was chivalrous of you Forty Two, but I still think Pavlich's point is wholly without merit.

As you say, the British get the credit and they did it without waging one of the 19th century's bloodiest wars against themselves. The power of people like William Wilberforce's ideas carried the day for Britain, while the US put itself to the sword. I can't see what credit we're due for falling so far short of our civilized cousin's example.

What's worse is that, after paying that awful price to end the institution of slavery, the US abandoned the freed slaves to Jim Crow, the sharecropping system, segregation, and the tender mercies of the Ku Klux Klan. I can certainly see why we might be blamed for such profligacy and dereliction.

Sure other countries held slaves longer, but we're the ones holding certain truths to be self evident, so why wouldn't we be singled out for failing to live up to our ideals?

Pavlich's simpering excuses do nothing to move us forward, and I've spent more time on them than they deserve. It's better to face our failings honestly and as a call to improve. Here's an example for your consideration.
Five score years ago, a great American, in whose symbolic shadow we stand today, signed the Emancipation Proclamation. This momentous decree came as a great beacon light of hope to millions of Negro slaves who had been seared in the flames of withering injustice. It came as a joyous daybreak to end the long night of their captivity.

But one hundred years later, the Negro still is not free. One hundred years later, the life of the Negro is still sadly crippled by the manacles of segregation and the chains of discrimination. One hundred years later, the Negro lives on a lonely island of poverty in the midst of a vast ocean of material prosperity. One hundred years later, the Negro is still languishing in the corners of American society and finds himself an exile in his own land. So we have come here today to dramatize a shameful condition.

In a sense we have come to our nation's capital to cash a check. When the architects of our republic wrote the magnificent words of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, they were signing a promissory note to which every American was to fall heir. This note was a promise that all men, yes, black men as well as white men, would be guaranteed the unalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

It is obvious today that America has defaulted on this promissory note insofar as her citizens of color are concerned. Instead of honoring this sacred obligation, America has given the Negro people a bad check, a check which has come back marked "insufficient funds." But we refuse to believe that the bank of justice is bankrupt. We refuse to believe that there are insufficient funds in the great vaults of opportunity of this nation. So we have come to cash this check — a check that will give us upon demand the riches of freedom and the security of justice.
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Re: Only in America

Post by Forty Two » Fri Apr 19, 2019 1:35 pm

We should be held accountable for not living up to ideals. I never said that we shouldn't. Saying the point is "not wholly without merit" is not saying it is "wholly meritorious" or even "mostly meritorious." I explained the kernel of merit that lies within. So often "the west" is vilified as if it was the west that created slavery. It wasn't. Slavery was the normal human condition, and it was Western Enlightenment thinking (the same thinking on which the American revolution and Constitution were based) which ended the awful practice (which still exists in so many places who are not built on that foundation). The US is AMONG the countries that follow the western tradition. It was, of course, conceived at a time when slavery was normal, and the abolitionist movement nascent - but that abolitionist movement was born in the UK and the US (the British Commonwealth).
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Only in America

Post by Seabass » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:38 pm

MLK was an SJW progressive leftist. :prof:
The demagogue is one who preaches doctrines he knows to be untrue to men he knows to be idiots. ―H.L. Mencken

Bad government is the natural product of rule by those who believe government is bad. —Thomas Frank

Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. —Einstein
I’m a nationalist. —Trump

The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country. —Hermann Göring

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Re: Only in America

Post by Joe » Fri Apr 19, 2019 7:05 pm

Forty Two wrote:
Fri Apr 19, 2019 1:35 pm
We should be held accountable for not living up to ideals. I never said that we shouldn't. Saying the point is "not wholly without merit" is not saying it is "wholly meritorious" or even "mostly meritorious." I explained the kernel of merit that lies within. So often "the west" is vilified as if it was the west that created slavery. It wasn't. Slavery was the normal human condition, and it was Western Enlightenment thinking (the same thinking on which the American revolution and Constitution were based) which ended the awful practice (which still exists in so many places who are not built on that foundation). The US is AMONG the countries that follow the western tradition. It was, of course, conceived at a time when slavery was normal, and the abolitionist movement nascent - but that abolitionist movement was born in the UK and the US (the British Commonwealth).
For me, "the kernel of merit" sinks into irrelevance when balanced with the US civil war's estimated 620K to 850K casualties, the millions of people who lived under Jim Crow and the KKK's reign of terror, and the fact that in my lifetime one of my fellow citizens led 250K like minded citizens to the Capital to tell us Lincoln's work wasn't done, and that they were not free in the "land of the free" and was murdered for his effort.

Pavlich's comments were stupid, not because of their historical inaccuracy, but for devaluing the massive human suffering the US is solely responsible for.
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Re: Only in America

Post by JimC » Fri Apr 19, 2019 10:08 pm

:this:
Nurse, where the fuck's my cardigan?
And my gin!

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Re: Only in America

Post by Hermit » Sat Apr 20, 2019 12:12 am

I think Coito Two's posts are in good part motivated by frustration, the origin of which is well demonstrated by this sketch:



Just replace "accountant" with "mechanical engineer" and "lion tamer" with "barrister".

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Scot Dutchy
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Re: Only in America

Post by Scot Dutchy » Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:04 am

Nice Russian sub-titles. :shiver:
"Wat is het een gezellig boel hier".

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