Should Trump Re-Hire Comey?

[Brian Peacock]

Asking Comey for his loyalty, and then asking his security heads to make public statements against the FBI investigation isn't ambigous either - the later amounting to an obstruction of justice.

[Forty Two]

There's nothing wrong with him questioning an investigation. He's allowed to fire the FBI director.

Moreover, the investigation of Flynn hasn't ended. The grand jury just issued subpoenas. Nothing has been stopped. Moreover, the top cop is the President, not the FBI director. The FBI Director reports to the Department of Justice, which reports to the President. The FBI is helping the President do his constitutional duties as Chief Executive. So, not only can the President fire the FBI Director at will, but he can specify how the FBI will exercise prosecutorial discretion. He can end an investigation, if he wants the FBI to focus on other things.

[Brian Peacock]

Hmm, even in investigations of the president's own affairs?

[pErvinalia]

There's nothing wrong with him questioning an investigation.

In an appropriate way.

Moreover, the investigation of Flynn hasn't ended.

And lo and behold Comey is fired.

Moreover, the top cop is the President, not the FBI director.

Oh right. So Trump is investigating himself.

The FBI Director reports to the Department of Justice, which reports to the President. The FBI is helping the President do his constitutional duties as Chief Executive. So, not only can the President fire the FBI Director at will, but he can specify how the FBI will exercise prosecutorial discretion. He can end an investigation, if he wants the FBI to focus on other things.

L'Emmy and I have debunked this nonsense before (which you ignored, like you always do when a rebuttal is too inconvenient for your world view). The FBI is apolitical. And even if it wasn't, that in no way repudiates a charge of interfering with justice.

[Forty Two]

Hmm, even in investigations of the president's own affairs?

This is not an investigation of the President's own affairs. The investigation is of Russia's meddling in the election. Comey mentioned that it "includes" anything they find out about the Trump campaign's communications, etc. However, it is NOT - expressly NOT -- an investigation OF Trump or of Trump's campaign or of the Trump administration. The investigation would also, presumably, include anything the FBI finds out about the Hillary camp's communications with the Russians, if any.

But, yes, if the FBI started using its resources to investigate the president, the President can fire the FBI chief and end the investigation. If that's a problem, the Congress can set up its own investigation, and file articles of impeachment.

[Forty Two]

There's nothing wrong with him questioning an investigation.

In an appropriate way.

It's a matter of opinion whether Mr. Trump's expression of hope was "inappropriate." It certainly was not illegal, and certainly was not obstruction of justice.

Moreover, the investigation of Flynn hasn't ended.

And lo and behold Comey is fired.

The investigation has not ended even after Comey was fired, consistent with the express wishes of the Democrats who had lost confidence in him and called for his resignation. After Comey was fired, the grand jury issued subpoenas. They're still going.

Moreover, the top cop is the President, not the FBI director.

Oh right. So Trump is investigating himself.

Trump is not under investigation by the FBI. Comey said so himself to Congress. Comey merely clarified that if in the course of their general investigation of Russia's attempts to interfere with the political process they find something to do with Trump officials, then that would be included. But, they were very clear that this is not an investigation of either Trump or his administration, per se. Be clear on this: The FBI is conducting a counter intelligence investigation into Russia's efforts to manipulate public opinion in the U.S. presidential election, examining how the operation was paid for and whether any Americans were involved.

The FBI Director reports to the Department of Justice, which reports to the President. The FBI is helping the President do his constitutional duties as Chief Executive. So, not only can the President fire the FBI Director at will, but he can specify how the FBI will exercise prosecutorial discretion. He can end an investigation, if he wants the FBI to focus on other things.

L'Emmy and I have debunked this nonsense before (which you ignored, like you always do when a rebuttal is too inconvenient for your world view). The FBI is apolitical. And even if it wasn't, that in no way repudiates a charge of interfering with justice.

You've not debunked anything. If you don't agree that the FBI director can be fired by the President at will, because he serves at the pleasure of the President, then you're wrong. The President can also determine the allocation of FBI resources, and if he doesn't want the FBI focusing on something, he can say so. He has that right. Obviously, nobody has to like it, and he can, and probably should, face very stiff political penalties if he went ahead and said "i'm shutting down this investigation" -- people could certainly be pissed off at him - but, it's within his authority to do so.

The FBI is a bureau in the executive branch, reporting to the President through the department of justice. The President is their boss. Both parties try to have the FBI be as apolitical as possible, which is why it's kryptonite for him to go ahead and end the investigation. One, it's not overtly or directly an investigation of him or his administration, and two it would be something lots of people would object to and rightly so. He should let the investigation continue, and that's what is happening.

[L'Emmerdeur]

According to US senators briefed on its progress, the investigation has moved from counter-intelligence to criminal.

The Justice Department’s look at Russian meddling in the presidential election has turned from a counterintelligence investigation into a criminal probe, leading senators said Thursday as they emerged from a secret briefing with Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein.

[Brian Peacock]

Hmm, even in investigations of the president's own affairs?

This is not an investigation of the President's own affairs. The investigation is of Russia's meddling in the election. Comey mentioned that it "includes" anything they find out about the Trump campaign's communications, etc. However, it is NOT - expressly NOT -- an investigation OF Trump or of Trump's campaign or of the Trump administration. The investigation would also, presumably, include anything the FBI finds out about the Hillary camp's communications with the Russians, if any.

But, yes, if the FBI started using its resources to investigate the president, the President can fire the FBI chief and end the investigation. If that's a problem, the Congress can set up its own investigation, and file articles of impeachment.

How is the investigation of possible collusion between the Trump campaign and a foreign power not an investigation into Trump's own affairs in any normal or regular sense? Are you certain about your contention that the president has the right to quell or quash investigations which touch on their own activity?

[Forty Two]

Yes he has the power.

But it would not be popular and could get him impeached, like Nixon was going to be.

It's not his own affairs because the FBI has been saying that the investigation is of Russian involvement in the election, which includes trump folks if the evidence goes that way. But it would be the same if Clinton folks were found to be up to no good.

I was unaware of the announcement that they switched from an intelligence investigation to criminal. A big issue there becomes the amount of info they will share . It'll be less now as it moves forward.

[pErvinalia]

Hmm, even in investigations of the president's own affairs?

This is not an investigation of the President's own affairs. The investigation is of Russia's meddling in the election. Comey mentioned that it "includes" anything they find out about the Trump campaign's communications, etc. However, it is NOT - expressly NOT -- an investigation OF Trump or of Trump's campaign or of the Trump administration.

It expressly is. As the actual words from Comey that I quoted to you show. Seriously, is English your 15th language?!?

[pErvinalia]

Moreover, the top cop is the President, not the FBI director.

Oh right. So Trump is investigating himself.

Trump is not under investigation by the FBI. Comey said so himself to Congress. Comey merely clarified that if in the course of their general investigation of Russia's attempts to interfere with the political process they find something to do with Trump officials, then that would be included. But, they were very clear that this is not an investigation of either Trump or his administration, per se. Be clear on this: The FBI is conducting a counter intelligence investigation into Russia's efforts to manipulate public opinion in the U.S. presidential election, examining how the operation was paid for and whether any Americans were involved.

I'd love to know whether it is malicious intent or just spectacular bias that makes you lie so openly like this. Comey's words are unequivocal. I quoted them to you earlier in the thread (or perhaps it was another thread). The investigation specifically includes links between Trump's team and Russia.

The FBI Director reports to the Department of Justice, which reports to the President. The FBI is helping the President do his constitutional duties as Chief Executive. So, not only can the President fire the FBI Director at will, but he can specify how the FBI will exercise prosecutorial discretion. He can end an investigation, if he wants the FBI to focus on other things.

L'Emmy and I have debunked this nonsense before (which you ignored, like you always do when a rebuttal is too inconvenient for your world view). The FBI is apolitical. And even if it wasn't, that in no way repudiates a charge of interfering with justice.

You've not debunked anything. If you don't agree that the FBI director can be fired by the President at will, because he serves at the pleasure of the President, then you're wrong.

That's not the bit we are objecting to.

The President can also determine the allocation of FBI resources, and if he doesn't want the FBI focusing on something, he can say so. He has that right. Obviously, nobody has to like it, and he can, and probably should, face very stiff political penalties if he went ahead and said "i'm shutting down this investigation" -- people could certainly be pissed off at him - but, it's within his authority to do so.

Please provide some proof to support this claim.

The FBI is a bureau in the executive branch, reporting to the President through the department of justice. The President is their boss.

Of course. That doesn't mean they aren't apolitical like the rest of the bureaucracy.

One, it's not overtly or directly an investigation of him or his administration,

It overtly and directly is, as Comey testified to congress.

and two it would be something lots of people would object to and rightly so.

Not you, and other rusted on Trump supporters, apparently.

[Forty Two]

Hmm, even in investigations of the president's own affairs?

This is not an investigation of the President's own affairs. The investigation is of Russia's meddling in the election. Comey mentioned that it "includes" anything they find out about the Trump campaign's communications, etc. However, it is NOT - expressly NOT -- an investigation OF Trump or of Trump's campaign or of the Trump administration.

It expressly is. As the actual words from Comey that I quoted to you show. Seriously, is English your 15th language?!?

Seriously, go fuck yourself.

I've quoted Comey too. He has said exactly what I've written.

[pErvinalia]

What he said was clear and unambiguous. You're interpretation is, as usual, head-scratchingly bizarre. Here's what he said:

...and that includes investigating the nature of any links between individuals associated with the Trump campaign and the Russian government and whether there was any coordination between the campaign and Russia's efforts.

It couldn't be any clearer or unambiguous. It beggars belief that you can read that and think that the investigation isn't expressly looking for links between Trump et al and Russia.

[Forty Two]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/byron ... le/2622899 On Tuesday, the president's letter said that Director Comey told him he was not under investigation. Senator Feinstein and I heard nothing that contradicted the president's statement.

What to make of the Grassley-Feinstein exchange? While nothing is ever completely clear in the Russia affair, it seems that Grassley was saying that Comey had told him, and Feinstein, that some individuals were targets of the FBI Russia probe, and that President Trump was not among them.

Blumenthal opened the question of Trump being a target of the investigation right now. Grassley and Feinstein appear to have closed it.

[Forty Two]

What he said was clear and unambiguous. You're interpretation is, as usual, head-scratchingly bizarre. Here's what he said:

...and that includes investigating the nature of any links between individuals associated with the Trump campaign and the Russian government and whether there was any coordination between the campaign and Russia's efforts.

It couldn't be any clearer or unambiguous. I beggars belief that you can read that and think that the investigation isn't expressly looking for links between Trump et al and Russia.

Seriously, go fuck yourself. I don't give a flying fuck what you think "beggars belief" and your rude insults which are part and parcel of your thoroughly disagreeable, mean spirited and unpleasant personality.

You left out the statement of what he said the investigation is: "I have been authorized by the Department of Justice to confirm that the FBI, as part of our counter-intelligence mission, is investigating the Russian government’s efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election." That's the investigation. Comey has said it six ways from Sunday that they "follow the evidence" and "keep an open mind" which is why that "includes any links..." as you've stated above. It would also "include" anything they find out about non-Trump people involved, and even other candidates' people.

Trump wasn't under investigation --

This is good news on at least three counts. First, by making this announcement, the FBI has ended months of sometimes-irresponsible speculation about its activities. Second, the FBI is informing America that it is doing its job. Of course we should want the FBI to comprehensively investigate a foreign power’s efforts to interfere with an American presidential election. Of course that would include following the evidence wherever it leads, including (if applicable) to one or both of the rival campaigns. Third, since the Trump administration’s DOJ authorized this announcement, it is a sign to all Americans that its system is still working as intended. This announcement is not helpful to the administration, but the DOJ authorized it anyway. None of this means the election outcome is illegitimate. None of this means that anyone affiliated with the Trump campaign broke the law. None of this means that illegal leaks are somehow proper simply because an investigation exists. At all times the Constitution protects the rights of each investigated American. It could very well be that a thorough investigation exonerates the Trump campaign. We simply don’t know yet.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/44 ... nd-russian

God damn, you are an insufferable prick, you know that? I only say that to be helpful, actually. Stop being such an insulting douchebag, and people can talk to you without it constantly, every single time, devolving into a fight.

Sure, give me a warning, mods. But, I'll stop calling him names. I'm only doing so because he's been constantly, lately, making veiled insults about me not being able to read or understand English, and otherwise being stupid. Fuck you, pErvin. I hope I speak for most everyone when I say that. If not, oh, well, fuck you anyway.