Poll: Whaddya reckon about God's existence?

[Animavore]

You were doing so well until this point.

I was contrasting knowing God with, "knowing the quantum state of every particle in London." The reasons we can't know the quantum state of every particle in London are ones of practicality and technicality. Not because they are unknowable except by means of belief.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

You were doing so well until this point.

I was contrasting knowing God with, "knowing the quantum state of every particle in London." The reasons we can't know the quantum state of every particle in London are ones of practicality and technicality. Not because they are unknowable except by means of belief.

Actually, that's wrong. You cannot know the quantum states of every particle in London because, until the wave-functions collapse during observation, those states are not defined!

[MiM]

You were doing so well until this point.

I was contrasting knowing God with, "knowing the quantum state of every particle in London." The reasons we can't know the quantum state of every particle in London are ones of practicality and technicality. Not because they are unknowable except by means of belief.

Actually, that's wrong. You cannot know the quantum states of every particle in London because, until the wave-functions collapse during observation, those states are not defined!

And any way, due to Heisenberg, you just cannot know them precisely, collapsed or not.

[pErvinalia]

Geeks ruin everything.

[Seth]

You keep posing these maybe questions to me, and I guess you think I haven't thought about them, or that you're trying to challenge my assumptions, but you keep over-looking that they work both ways.

You seem to get it more than most do. The point of my argument is that from the scientific, rational and logical view, the ONLY rational answer to the God question is "I don't know." Everything else is straining at gnats or flatly ignoring reason and logic. I press this issue because a) it amuses me to do so; and b) making it clear that atheism =/= Atheism and Atheism = religion. I do this because it constantly amuses and amazes me how otherwise rational and logical people simply put aside all reason and logic when it comes to theistic claims. It's as if they just lose their minds at the prospect that something they don't believe in and/or don't understand cannot be dismissed with an airy wave of the hand and an arrogant attitude.

Whether God exists is far less important than whether belief in God is useful and helpful to individuals and societies, and that answer is highly specific to each individual religion and theistic claim. Therefore, it is my claim that blanket condemnation or scoffing at religion is not a rational act, and is in fact just as irrational as the theistic claims Atheists rail against.

[Hermit]

You seem to get it more than most do. The point of my argument is that from the scientific, rational and logical view, the ONLY rational answer to the God question is "I don't know."

Most? Look at the straw poll above. 4 out of 29 voters chose the "Strong atheist. I know there is no God." option. Doesn't look like that even remotely fits the definition of "most."

Perhaps you have better data. If so, give us a link to them, thanks.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

You seem to get it more than most do. The point of my argument is that from the scientific, rational and logical view, the ONLY rational answer to the God question is "I don't know."

Most? Look at the straw poll above. 4 out of 29 voters chose the "Strong atheist. I know there is no God." option. Doesn't look like that even remotely fits the definition of "most."

Perhaps you have better data. If so, give us a link to them, thanks.

Plus, unless you have a reason to believe that there actually is a god, you can pretty much extend "I don't know" to "I don't know but fuck all that getting up early on a Sunday!"

[Sean Hayden]

[JimC]

Hominids have so many silly ideas. Gods of various kinds are merely one of them...

Life's too short to be diverted by delusions...

[Seth]

You seem to get it more than most do. The point of my argument is that from the scientific, rational and logical view, the ONLY rational answer to the God question is "I don't know."

Most? Look at the straw poll above. 4 out of 29 voters chose the "Strong atheist. I know there is no God." option. Doesn't look like that even remotely fits the definition of "most."

Perhaps you have better data. If so, give us a link to them, thanks.

I've got 25 years of data accrued from listening to the insults, aspersions, lies, and other intellectual malfeasance of hundreds if not thousands of Atheists, all of whom sing the same hymn, but when called on their bad behavior, try to excuse it with platitudes and denials, just like you're doing now.

Polls lie, just like the people who vote in them.

[pErvinalia]

All you've got is personal bias

[Animavore]

You keep posing these maybe questions to me, and I guess you think I haven't thought about them, or that you're trying to challenge my assumptions, but you keep over-looking that they work both ways.

You seem to get it more than most do. The point of my argument is that from the scientific, rational and logical view, the ONLY rational answer to the God question is "I don't know." Everything else is straining at gnats or flatly ignoring reason and logic. I press this issue because a) it amuses me to do so; and b) making it clear that atheism =/= Atheism and Atheism = religion. I do this because it constantly amuses and amazes me how otherwise rational and logical people simply put aside all reason and logic when it comes to theistic claims. It's as if they just lose their minds at the prospect that something they don't believe in and/or don't understand cannot be dismissed with an airy wave of the hand and an arrogant attitude.

Whether God exists is far less important than whether belief in God is useful and helpful to individuals and societies, and that answer is highly specific to each individual religion and theistic claim. Therefore, it is my claim that blanket condemnation or scoffing at religion is not a rational act, and is in fact just as irrational as the theistic claims Atheists rail against.

Well whether God(s) exist isn't important to me at all these days, but I do think some people need religion. I've a creationist friend, and in Ireland that is a rarity, we used to argue over God and evolution all the time, but eventually I saw no point in it and avoid the subject. Of late I've noticed how depressed he seems and I honestly think it's because he's alone in his views. Most Irish people have never heard of creationism and when he starts blabbing his Jesus stuff they'll either make quick excuses to leave or outright tell him to fuck off, he's a lone warrior. Even his family think he's a spacer.

I recently found out there is a creationist church in Swords near the city and emailed the preacher and asked him could he contact my friend because I'm starting to think he needs the support of people who share his beliefs, as much as I'd rather see him get an education.

That was a few months ago and I noticed last week that small church is boarded up and fenced off, I guess it never took off, not surprisingly, and now I don't know who can help him. I think he should go to America where he'll find plenty of like-minded people.

[Hermit]

I've got 25 years of data accrued from listening to the insults, aspersions, lies, and other intellectual malfeasance of hundreds if not thousands of Atheists, all of whom sing the same hymn, but when called on their bad behavior, try to excuse it with platitudes and denials, just like you're doing now.

Polls lie, just like the people who vote in them.

Thanks for accusing me of lying and other intellectual malfeasance. Meanwhile a subsidiary of Nielsen polled 2250 adults across the US. 74% of them said that they believe in the existence of a God. Almost three quarters of those believers said they are absolutely certain that there is a God. More lies and other intellectual malfeasance?

[Seth]

All you've got is personal bias

And you don't, I suppose...

[Seth]

I've got 25 years of data accrued from listening to the insults, aspersions, lies, and other intellectual malfeasance of hundreds if not thousands of Atheists, all of whom sing the same hymn, but when called on their bad behavior, try to excuse it with platitudes and denials, just like you're doing now.

Polls lie, just like the people who vote in them.

Thanks for accusing me of lying and other intellectual malfeasance. Meanwhile a subsidiary of Nielsen polled 2250 adults across the US. 74% of them said that they believe in the existence of a God. Almost three quarters of those believers said they are absolutely certain that there is a God. More lies and other intellectual malfeasance?

Don't knows, don't care. It's their business and as long as it neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg I couldn't possibly care less what they believe.