Socialized medicine's inevitable death panels

[Tero]

No sign of socialized healthcare. I get the same plan as last year OR a cheap high deductible plan.

Yahoo News:

Obamacare Sites Still Swamped but Wait Times Cut
Myth: Obamacare is leading to part-time jobs
It's a common refrain of its opponents: Obamacare will force struggling Americans into part-time work. Well, the first bits of evidence have come in, and it does not look as if the Affordable Care Act has had any negative impact on full-time work.
Between August and September the economy has added 691,000 full-time jobs, while it has lost 594,000 part-time jobs, according to the September jobs report. While this is only one month's worth of data, it indicates that at least so far, the law hasn't pushed full-time employees into part-time work.
Myth: Employers aren't changing the insurance they offer because of Obamacare.
"If you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan," said President Obama in 2009 as he worked to sell the health care bill that would result in the Affordable Care Act. For many Americans, fall means open enrollment season for their employee-based health care plans. And some of those plans have definitely changed.
Here are some high profile examples: Citing the Affordable Care Act, UPS announced it would drop health coverage for some spouses of employees who were eligible for health insurance elsewhere. And Home Depot said it would shift its part-time employees to public health insurance exchanges instead of providing insurance through the company.
The truth is, some health insurance plans would be required to change because of the Affordable Care Act: Either they don't meet the minimum coverage requirements of the new law, or they are too generous -- so called "Cadillac" insurance plans.
But not all changes stem from the new law. Employers have been changing health insurance plans for years before the ACA. For example, the average deductible has increased every year since 2006 -- before and after the health care law -- according to the Kaiser Family Foundation.

[subversive science]

No sign of socialized healthcare. I get the same plan as last year OR a cheap high deductible plan.

Yahoo News:

Obamacare Sites Still Swamped but Wait Times Cut
Myth: Obamacare is leading to part-time jobs
It's a common refrain of its opponents: Obamacare will force struggling Americans into part-time work. Well, the first bits of evidence have come in, and it does not look as if the Affordable Care Act has had any negative impact on full-time work.
Between August and September the economy has added 691,000 full-time jobs, while it has lost 594,000 part-time jobs, according to the September jobs report. While this is only one month's worth of data, it indicates that at least so far, the law hasn't pushed full-time employees into part-time work.
Myth: Employers aren't changing the insurance they offer because of Obamacare.
"If you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan," said President Obama in 2009 as he worked to sell the health care bill that would result in the Affordable Care Act. For many Americans, fall means open enrollment season for their employee-based health care plans. And some of those plans have definitely changed.
Here are some high profile examples: Citing the Affordable Care Act, UPS announced it would drop health coverage for some spouses of employees who were eligible for health insurance elsewhere. And Home Depot said it would shift its part-time employees to public health insurance exchanges instead of providing insurance through the company.
The truth is, some health insurance plans would be required to change because of the Affordable Care Act: Either they don't meet the minimum coverage requirements of the new law, or they are too generous -- so called "Cadillac" insurance plans.
But not all changes stem from the new law. Employers have been changing health insurance plans for years before the ACA. For example, the average deductible has increased every year since 2006 -- before and after the health care law -- according to the Kaiser Family Foundation.

Since facts and reality have a liberal bias, I suspect this post will be discounted by those who could use the information the most.

[Tero]

Well, even though we fucked up...all over the planet, we are doing OK. No need to be freaking out. Most people's life spans are not affected much by medicine or the lack of.

[Seth]

There is only one country on Earth where its not the doctors making the decisions when it comes to medical care and that's the US where its insurance companies making them

Horseshit.

Double horseshit.

The simple fact is if your insurance company doesn't want to pay for treatment, you can go get it somewhere else on your own dime any time you want, and get the best care on earth as well.

And in the UK the bureaucrats are indeed making the decisions, albeit indirectly, by rationing care and making regulations. That's how socialized medicine works.

[piscator]

That's how health insurance works too.
If you don't like that, you're free to underwrite all your risk with your own money.

[Seth]

That's how health insurance works too.
If you don't like that, you're free to underwrite all your risk with your own money.

Or, you can find another company or negotiate a better contract. You can't negotiate anything with government-run medicine, you get what they decide to give you.

[Warren Dew]

That's how health insurance works too.
If you don't like that, you're free to underwrite all your risk with your own money.

The problem is, we aren't.

[piscator]

That's how health insurance works too.
If you don't like that, you're free to underwrite all your risk with your own money.

The problem is, we aren't.

It's never been a problem before.

[Audley Strange]

There is only one country on Earth where its not the doctors making the decisions when it comes to medical care and that's the US where its insurance companies making them

Horseshit.

Double horseshit.

The simple fact is if your insurance company doesn't want to pay for treatment, you can go get it somewhere else on your own dime any time you want, and get the best care on earth as well.

And in the UK the bureaucrats are indeed making the decisions, albeit indirectly, by rationing care and making regulations. That's how socialized medicine works.

Horseshit.

Double horseshit.

The simple fact is if your NHS provider doesn't want to pay for treatment, you can go get it somewhere else on your own dime any time you want, and get the best care on earth as well.

And in the U.S. the Insurance Companies are indeed making the decision, albeit indirectly, by restricting payouts and regulating treatment, That's how insurance companies make money.

[MrJonno]

If the NHS doesn't want to pay for the treatment its 99.9% certain its because the treatment doesn't work

No one will develop a treatment that the NHS can't afford, who do you think is the biggest customer for medical technology it sure isn't American millionaires

[Audley Strange]

If the NHS doesn't want to pay for the treatment its 99.9% certain its because the treatment doesn't work

No one will develop a treatment that the NHS can't afford, who do you think is the biggest customer for medical technology it sure isn't American millionaires

Actually nothing you've said there is the case either Jonno. Some NHS trusts will pay for all kind of weird shitty alternative treatments and some won't pay for expensive but effective drugs. It depends on many factors of budget managment. Also most manufacturers of medical technology and chemicals go to America first to ply their wares, since most other countries have various regulations and caps when it comes to purchasing new tech or chems. America has the freest market in the world when it comes to both and the companies make exorbitant profits off the U.S. system which in turn increases the cost for their medical care,

[Tero]

Any of you Brits can fly straight to Mayo Clinic and be admitted today. With a wad of 100 dollar bills in your pocket.

[ronmcd]

Any of you Brits can fly straight to Mayo Clinic and be admitted today. With a wad of 100 dollar bills in your pocket.

Any of us Brits can do the same here, in Britland. (we just don't need to, as we already pay through NI and taxation for a very good healthcare system)

[Tero]

That was for the 0.01% of treatments the NIH does not cover.

Meanwhile:

Medicine is a complex industry. It employs more people than any other business. With an estimated 1 million pages of laws and regulations, the current system is unbelievably complicated and difficult to navigate. Obamacare simplifies the system for consumers by offering a one-stop shop where people can compare and buy discounted insurance plans.Obamacare will protect jobs. If we change nothing, we won't be able to afford to pay the millions of people now working in health care: the doctors, nurses, therapists, aides, technicians, housekeepers, maintenance crews and others.Why do doctors make so much money? Because they can. The new system will help control doctors' salaries to keep health care affordable.

Read more here: http://www.adn.com/2013/10/14/3122451/c ... rylink=cpy

[Seth]

If the NHS doesn't want to pay for the treatment its 99.9% certain its because the treatment doesn't work

More likely it's "experimental" and may well work, but has not been "accepted" as "standard practice" and therefore it won't be paid for, which is exactly what happens here with insurance companies. There's no reason to think that the NHS is going to be any more generous to the small number of people who might be helped by orphan drugs or experimental procedures than anyone else is.

No one will develop a treatment that the NHS can't afford, who do you think is the biggest customer for medical technology it sure isn't American millionaires

It sure isn't the NHS.