Perception of Marijuana as a 'Safe Drug' Is Inaccurate

[JimC]

I wonder if anybody else had the experience of eventually developing petite mal like symptoms from smoking dope?

I still miss it, mind...

(the high, not the petite mal...)

[charlou]

I dropped smoking it a very loooong time ago when it eventually gave me too much of a sense of losing control.

I've considered indulging again some time, just to revisit the pleasant, not quite soporofic, but hedonistic relaxed state of it ..

But, it's no biggie in the scheme of life.

[Rum]

I've held back on this thread so far because I know my experience is not typical, but I developed cannabis psychosis of some kind eventually when I smoked the stuff, as I have reported in the past. It wasn't diagnosed as such, but the symptoms were there. Extreme anxiety, obsessional thoughts, bizarre thoughts and things like that. I did see my GP who eventually referred me to a psychologist. He didn't get to the bottom of it and at the time I didn't even make the connection, except that I knew that when I did indulged (which tailed off pretty rapidly at the time) I went straight into an out of control splintering of thinking and perception that was scary as hell.

This was on the back of quite a few LSD experiences mind you. It felt as if some sort of 'gate' had been opened and smoking dope - even a little - opened it up for all hell to break loose.

If my sort of reaction only happens in 1% of users then I would certainly not categorise it as 'safe'. It took me the best part of a decade to get back to something akin to normality..whatever that is.

[Cormac]

Pretty much. Making it legal or at least decriminalized would hurt only the private prison industry, otherwise there'd be little if any change.

Well, legalisation would remove the market for criminal scumbags - or at least would allow them to go legit.

True, I guess it would hurt the cartels. Unless, as you said, they go legitimate. There's gold in that Acapulco Gold. And Panama Red, and Swazi Gold, and Skunk, and Chronic, and Seattle Green, and....

Yes - and if they go legit, then they'll have lots of competition - from organic farmers and botanists who're expert in creating mellow highs, and so on. They'd be spanked up and down Mary Jane street.

They're invested in moving contraband. They'd more likely switch the contraband.

Fine. To what? If all drugs were legalised, they'd not be shipping drugs

More likely, they'd switch to other forms of criminality, where behaviours are more obvious, and therefore, successful interventions would be easier.

[MrFungus420]

There is no doubt that marijuana smokers have more lung cancer than non smokers. This is often explained by the fact that many marijuana smokers also smoke tobacco. But the jury is still out on that.

To say that the jury is still out on it means that THERE IS DOUBT.

You are contradicting yourself.

And no. We have no clear evidence that alcohol causes more harm to the individual than marijuana. Both cause harm. Comparing degree of harm is difficult, because the harms are different. How do you quantify te harm from teenage psychoses caused by marijuana to the liver harm caused by alcohol in middle aged people? You cannot.

Alcohol is poisonous to EVERYBODY. Marijuana MAY increase your risk for psychosis IF you are already at risk.

Alcohol KILLS, marijuana does not.

Alcohol is objectively more harmful than marijuana.

[MrFungus420]

I've held back on this thread so far because I know my experience is not typical, but I developed cannabis psychosis of some kind eventually when I smoked the stuff, as I have reported in the past. It wasn't diagnosed as such, but the symptoms were there. Extreme anxiety, obsessional thoughts, bizarre thoughts and things like that. I did see my GP who eventually referred me to a psychologist. He didn't get to the bottom of it and at the time I didn't even make the connection, except that I knew that when I did indulged (which tailed off pretty rapidly at the time) I went straight into an out of control splintering of thinking and perception that was scary as hell.

This was on the back of quite a few LSD experiences mind you. It felt as if some sort of 'gate' had been opened and smoking dope - even a little - opened it up for all hell to break loose.

If my sort of reaction only happens in 1% of users then I would certainly not categorise it as 'safe'. It took me the best part of a decade to get back to something akin to normality..whatever that is.

But the point is that nobody is saying that it is safe, full stop.

It is relatively safe. It is safer than virtually all other drugs.

[Tyrannical]

The nature of the teenage brain makes users of cannabis amongst this population particularly at risk of developing addictive behaviors and suffering other long-term negative effects, according to researchers at the University of Montreal and New York's Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai.

Those wacky Dutch did some study I saw on TV several years back where they let young teens (possibly juvenile jail) smoke all the pot they wanted. By their later teens they were done with it.

[Tyrannical]

Has any state in the U.S. legalized marijuana farming? I thought it was just possession for personal use.

Anywho, I'm sure there'd be a shit-fuckton of standards, regulations, licenses, and other bullshit, put in place on marijuana farming if it was legalized. The price would likely go up for the consumer as corporate conglomerates take over production and distribution.

I live in one of those medical marijuana states, so patients can have up to six adult plants. But they can out source that six to a "caregiver" who may grow plants for several patients, or buy pot from a dispensary. I'm not sure all the details, but the end result is you can not find Mexican commercial grade pot on the local market anymore. All legally and illegally sold pot is indoor grown locally. Prices are about 50% higher, but the quality is much better.

[Blind groper]

To MrFungus who believes alcohol kills.

Certainly it does, in overdose. So does water.

The lethality of alcohol is such that among males it will kill 50% at a dose equivalent to 1.5 litres of whisky. (That is : a man who drinks two 26 ounce bottles of whisky in a sitting has a 50% chance of dying.) For women, the equivalent is 1 litre.

The key point here is the variability from individual to individual, and the very high dose required. Certainly alcohol can kill. So can anything else we ingest. But alcohol is low in toxicity, because we have to consume a hell of a lot for it to become toxic.

As far as chronic toxicity is concerned, that also depends on the individual. I have been a lover of red wine for 40 years, and drink about 4 bottles per week. My health is superb. My blood pressure is that of a healthy 20 year old. My cholesterol is low. Resting pulse is low. Heart and liver function excellent. My father died at 83 (of lung cancer, since he was a smoker), and I expect to substantially outlive him (I am not a smoker).

Chemical analysis shows that marijuana smoke contains a lot of toxins and carcinogens. However, most marijuana smokers do not consume a lot. Compared to tobacco smokers, the dose is low. And that is why we do not see a lot of marijuana smokers (except those who also smoke tobacco) go down with lung cancer. That does not alter the fact that marijuana smoke contains those nasty materials. Smoking marijuana is not healthy. And not just for teenagers.

[Cormac]

To MrFungus who believes alcohol kills.

Certainly it does, in overdose. So does water.

The lethality of alcohol is such that among males it will kill 50% at a dose equivalent to 1.5 litres of whisky. (That is : a man who drinks two 26 ounce bottles of whisky in a sitting has a 50% chance of dying.) For women, the equivalent is 1 litre.

The key point here is the variability from individual to individual, and the very high dose required. Certainly alcohol can kill. So can anything else we ingest. But alcohol is low in toxicity, because we have to consume a hell of a lot for it to become toxic.

As far as chronic toxicity is concerned, that also depends on the individual. I have been a lover of red wine for 40 years, and drink about 4 bottles per week. My health is superb. My blood pressure is that of a healthy 20 year old. My cholesterol is low. Resting pulse is low. Heart and liver function excellent. My father died at 83 (of lung cancer, since he was a smoker), and I expect to substantially outlive him (I am not a smoker).

Chemical analysis shows that marijuana smoke contains a lot of toxins and carcinogens. However, most marijuana smokers do not consume a lot. Compared to tobacco smokers, the dose is low. And that is why we do not see a lot of marijuana smokers (except those who also smoke tobacco) go down with lung cancer. That does not alter the fact that marijuana smoke contains those nasty materials. Smoking marijuana is not healthy. And not just for teenagers.

Fucking hell. I should be dead. In my teens and early 20s, I regularly drank more whiskey than that in a single sitting, accompanied by 8 or 10 beers.

[Audley Strange]

I never thought it was safe, you'd need to be dead from the feet up to think anything is "safe". However one good doobie would blast me for hours. When I smoked cigarettes, I smoked perhaps 10/15 a day at tops. I was lucky if I had two or three joints a night. When I used to drink, I used to smoke as well. So I guess I could say there was harm reduction in smoking cannabis, but the truth was and is, I fucking love it, but then like everything, moderation is the key.

[Pappa]

To MrFungus who believes alcohol kills.

Certainly it does, in overdose. So does water.

The lethality of alcohol is such that among males it will kill 50% at a dose equivalent to 1.5 litres of whisky. (That is : a man who drinks two 26 ounce bottles of whisky in a sitting has a 50% chance of dying.) For women, the equivalent is 1 litre.

The key point here is the variability from individual to individual, and the very high dose required. Certainly alcohol can kill. So can anything else we ingest. But alcohol is low in toxicity, because we have to consume a hell of a lot for it to become toxic.

As far as chronic toxicity is concerned, that also depends on the individual. I have been a lover of red wine for 40 years, and drink about 4 bottles per week. My health is superb. My blood pressure is that of a healthy 20 year old. My cholesterol is low. Resting pulse is low. Heart and liver function excellent. My father died at 83 (of lung cancer, since he was a smoker), and I expect to substantially outlive him (I am not a smoker).

Chemical analysis shows that marijuana smoke contains a lot of toxins and carcinogens. However, most marijuana smokers do not consume a lot. Compared to tobacco smokers, the dose is low. And that is why we do not see a lot of marijuana smokers (except those who also smoke tobacco) go down with lung cancer. That does not alter the fact that marijuana smoke contains those nasty materials. Smoking marijuana is not healthy. And not just for teenagers.

Alcohol can be a contributing factor in heart disease and some types of cancer.

[Robert_S]

To MrFungus who believes alcohol kills.

Certainly it does, in overdose. So does water.

The lethality of alcohol is such that among males it will kill 50% at a dose equivalent to 1.5 litres of whisky. (That is : a man who drinks two 26 ounce bottles of whisky in a sitting has a 50% chance of dying.) For women, the equivalent is 1 litre.

The key point here is the variability from individual to individual, and the very high dose required. Certainly alcohol can kill. So can anything else we ingest. But alcohol is low in toxicity, because we have to consume a hell of a lot for it to become toxic.

As far as chronic toxicity is concerned, that also depends on the individual. I have been a lover of red wine for 40 years, and drink about 4 bottles per week. My health is superb. My blood pressure is that of a healthy 20 year old. My cholesterol is low. Resting pulse is low. Heart and liver function excellent. My father died at 83 (of lung cancer, since he was a smoker), and I expect to substantially outlive him (I am not a smoker).

Chemical analysis shows that marijuana smoke contains a lot of toxins and carcinogens. However, most marijuana smokers do not consume a lot. Compared to tobacco smokers, the dose is low. And that is why we do not see a lot of marijuana smokers (except those who also smoke tobacco) go down with lung cancer. That does not alter the fact that marijuana smoke contains those nasty materials. Smoking marijuana is not healthy. And not just for teenagers.

Alcohol can be a contributing factor in heart disease and some types of cancer.

Let's not forget brain damage, "wet brain", higher incidents of violence, it's much more dangerous when combined with a motor vehicle, it tends to cause more and worse domestic abuse, date rapes, it can give you physical as well as psychological dependence.

And then there's fucking noisy obnoxious drunks... Give me potheads over drunks for neighbors any time.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

To MrFungus who believes alcohol kills.

Certainly it does, in overdose. So does water.

The lethality of alcohol is such that among males it will kill 50% at a dose equivalent to 1.5 litres of whisky. (That is : a man who drinks two 26 ounce bottles of whisky in a sitting has a 50% chance of dying.) For women, the equivalent is 1 litre.

The key point here is the variability from individual to individual, and the very high dose required. Certainly alcohol can kill. So can anything else we ingest. But alcohol is low in toxicity, because we have to consume a hell of a lot for it to become toxic.

As far as chronic toxicity is concerned, that also depends on the individual. I have been a lover of red wine for 40 years, and drink about 4 bottles per week. My health is superb. My blood pressure is that of a healthy 20 year old. My cholesterol is low. Resting pulse is low. Heart and liver function excellent. My father died at 83 (of lung cancer, since he was a smoker), and I expect to substantially outlive him (I am not a smoker).

Chemical analysis shows that marijuana smoke contains a lot of toxins and carcinogens. However, most marijuana smokers do not consume a lot. Compared to tobacco smokers, the dose is low. And that is why we do not see a lot of marijuana smokers (except those who also smoke tobacco) go down with lung cancer. That does not alter the fact that marijuana smoke contains those nasty materials. Smoking marijuana is not healthy. And not just for teenagers.

Alcohol can be a contributing factor in heart disease and some types of cancer.

Let's not forget brain damage, "wet brain", higher incidents of violence, it's much more dangerous when combined with a motor vehicle, it tends to cause more and worse domestic abuse, date rapes, it can give you physical as well as psychological dependence.

And then there's fucking noisy obnoxious drunks... Give me potheads over drunks for neighbors any time.

I wouldn't believe any claim that implied potheads were better drivers though!

[Robert_S]

I wouldn't believe any claim that implied potheads were better drivers though!

I would. They both fuck up your skills and I wouldn't recommend driving on either. But one of them, makes a regular person into a cocky bastard, that alone makes a huge difference in safety. One blows right through the stop sign, the other waits for it to change color.