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Mysturji
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by Mysturji » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:01 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23665106
A judge in the US has ordered a baby's first name to be changed from Messiah to Martin, arguing that the only true messiah is Jesus Christ, reports say.
Messiah came in at number 387 in the list of the most popular of baby names in the US in 2012, up from 633 in 2011.
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klr
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by klr » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:06 am
Hold on ... if it's anywhere at all on the "most popular" list, sure that means it must be valid?
Or is this just a case of some bizarre local law or ruling?
Anyway, the magistrate has very likely overstepped the bounds, as she does not have the right to decide what is "acceptable" or not.
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Svartalf
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by Svartalf » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:18 am
Only in the Bible Belt... anyway, that will get overturned if the parents have the $$ to appeal.
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by Robert_S » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:19 am
The judge sorta makes the point that the name could cause problems for the child. I'm almost in favor of that kind of intervention and have leaned that way ever since (I shit you not) Charity Seamen showed up in 10th grade Sex Ed already very much pregnant.
I can't say for sure the name had an influence but...
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
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klr
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by klr » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:21 am
Svartalf wrote:Only in the Bible Belt... anyway, that will get overturned if the parents have the $$ to appeal.
Or someone else offers the resources to appeal on their behalf, which may well happen.
Robert_S wrote:The judge sorta makes the point that the name could cause problems for the child. I'm almost in favor of that kind of intervention and have leaned that way ever since (I shit you not) Charity Seamen showed up in 10th grade Sex Ed already very much pregnant.
I can't say for sure the name had an influence but...
The judge may well have a point, but it's not her call to make.
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by Robert_S » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:22 am
klr wrote:Svartalf wrote:Only in the Bible Belt... anyway, that will get overturned if the parents have the $$ to appeal.
Or someone else offers the resources to appeal on their behalf, which may well happen.
Robert_S wrote:The judge sorta makes the point that the name could cause problems for the child. I'm almost in favor of that kind of intervention and have leaned that way ever since (I shit you not) Charity Seamen showed up in 10th grade Sex Ed already very much pregnant.
I can't say for sure the name had an influence but...
The judge may well have a point, but it's not her call to make.
I think it goes without saying it can't be sustained on religious grounds.
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
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by Svartalf » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:27 am
klr wrote:The judge may well have a point, but it's not her call to make.
If she had only made the point of "messiah" being bound to cause problems for the kid (anything from making him megalomaniac to getting him murdered as a false messiah), she'd have had a point... as soon as she dug out the JC and the notion of only He being entitled to the title "Messiah" (wrong anyway since all the High Priests and Kings of Judah and Israel were anointed too), she overstepped her powers.
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by klr » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:28 am
Svartalf wrote:klr wrote:The judge may well have a point, but it's not her call to make.
If she had only made the point of "messiah" being bound to cause problems for the kid (anything from making him megalomaniac to getting him murdered as a false messiah), she'd have had a point... as soon as she dug out the JC and the notion of only He being entitled to the title "Messiah" (wrong anyway since all the High Priests and Kings of Judah and Israel were anointed too), she overstepped her powers.
Robert_S wrote:
...
I think it goes without saying it can't be sustained on religious grounds.
Indeed. I continue to be surprised at all sorts of rulings and policy decisions made in the US that clearly violate the separation of religion part of the 1st Amendment. They should never be made in the first place.
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by mistermack » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:31 am
The principle is totally invalid anyway. Jesus is a popular name around the globe. So is Mohammed.
Stupid judge, for giving stupid reasons. And stupid parents, for giving a stupid name.
It's funny that it happened in COCKE county. Very apt.
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by Trinity » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:50 am
Bit of a tangent here but related re religion in law. Do courts atill get you to swear on the bible? I would object if I was asked to, or say, "I'll swaer on it if you like but from then on don't believe a word I might say!"
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by mistermack » Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:57 am
Trinity wrote:Bit of a tangent here but related re religion in law. Do courts atill get you to swear on the bible? I would object if I was asked to, or say, "I'll swaer on it if you like but from then on don't believe a word I might say!"
I'm pretty sure that you can just affirm in Britain, rather than swear on a book.
I don't know about other countries though. I'd be interested to hear.
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by pErvinalia » Mon Aug 12, 2013 12:59 pm
mistermack wrote:Trinity wrote:Bit of a tangent here but related re religion in law. Do courts atill get you to swear on the bible? I would object if I was asked to, or say, "I'll swaer on it if you like but from then on don't believe a word I might say!"
I'm pretty sure that you can just affirm in Britain, rather than swear on a book.
I don't know about other countries though. I'd be interested to hear.
Yeah, we can affirm here. Surely that's the case in every secular nation?
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by Clinton Huxley » Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:06 pm
Be ironic if it turns of he actually is the messiah.
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by pErvinalia » Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:07 pm
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by klr » Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:14 pm
Clinton Huxley wrote:Be ironic if it turns of he actually is the messiah.
... or more ironic still if he turns out to be just a very naughty boy!
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