The case against guns

[Tero]

Sounds like they should get rid of Chicago. Put some barracks up in Peoria and check the exodus to the low rent home for guns. Any gun owners housed in a fenced compound by themselves. We could make it a toirist attraction to see them shoot each other. Think of the reality tv. Gun owners leave guns in their compound to go pick up welfare check and for conjugal visits to females.

Female gun owners need a special strategy. I think we can handle it.

[laklak]

Just fence off the whole city. Charge folks a premium to stand on the walls and randomly shoot gangbangers, junkies and derelicts. $100 for three shots, step right up and win the little lady a stuffed panda! Solves the Chicago problem and gives us knuckle-dragging gun owners something to shoot at, while balancing the budget. Win-win-win, if you ask me.

[MrJonno]

Just fence off the whole city. Charge folks a premium to stand on the walls and randomly shoot gangbangers, junkies and derelicts. $100 for three shots, step right up and win the little lady a stuffed panda! Solves the Chicago problem and gives us knuckle-dragging gun owners something to shoot at, while balancing the budget. Win-win-win, if you ask me.

Boring just legalise human hunting and lock the red necks in. That would make great reality TV, good old boys militia versus gang bangers

[Coito ergo sum]

Just fence off the whole city. Charge folks a premium to stand on the walls and randomly shoot gangbangers, junkies and derelicts. $100 for three shots, step right up and win the little lady a stuffed panda! Solves the Chicago problem and gives us knuckle-dragging gun owners something to shoot at, while balancing the budget. Win-win-win, if you ask me.

Boring just legalise human hunting and lock the red necks in. That would make great reality TV, good old boys militia versus gang bangers

The Truman Show 2: Locked and Loaded?

I don't know, if you put the Russians, Italians and WASPs all on one side, I'm not sure the "gang bangers" will have much of a chance....

Who would be on whose team?

[Seth]

Sounds like they should get rid of Chicago.

From your mouth to God's ears....

Put some barracks up in Peoria and check the exodus to the low rent home for guns. Any gun owners housed in a fenced compound by themselves. We could make it a toirist attraction to see them shoot each other. Think of the reality tv. Gun owners leave guns in their compound to go pick up welfare check and for conjugal visits to females.

Female gun owners need a special strategy. I think we can handle it.

I've got a better idea: Neighborhood by neighborhood the commanders of the State Militia and National Guard send troops in to check the criminal history of each person in the neighborhood. If the adults don't have a criminal history, and they are physically able to handle a firearm, then they are trained by the Guard how to shoot, and when, and they are issued an AR-15, shotgun and/or military issue handgun with ammunition, body armor, a radio and they are inducted into the Organized Militia. Then a cadre of trained National Guard or State Militia troops are assigned to that neighborhood to continue training and drill and to supervise formations and armed neighborhood patrols. The Militia members would be authorized by the Governor to arrest and detain pending response of law enforcement officers any person committing a crime, and the would be authorized to use deadly force in self-defense, just as they are now.

The Militia presence would be permanent and the patrols used as necessary to suppress crime.

All of this would be highly effective at suppressing criminal violence and it's all entirely legal and constitutional.

More guns, less crime.

[JacksSmirkingRevenge]

I reckon it would be quite possible to recuce all crime by 100% - Just do away with all laws. Simples.

[Coito ergo sum]

I reckon it would be quite possible to recuce all crime by 100% - Just do away with all laws. Simples.

And as Bob Marley said, if you want to reduce all cry by 100%, just do away with all woman. Simples.

[Blind groper]

To Fakuname

Re the murder rate in Canada.

Current murder rates

USA 4.3 killings per 100,000 people per year.
Canada 1.6
Britain 1.2
Australia 1.0
New Zealand 0.9.

The Canadian murder rate fits nicely with the idea that it is influenced by the relative ease of access to firearms, although a lot less access to hand guns than in the USA does make the murder rate substantially lower than in the US.

[Jason]

Yeah sure.

Police State UK: 1.2
Relatively Free Canada: 1.6

That fits very nicely.

ETA: How many of those murders are committed with firearms?

[Blind groper]

I have not researched how many Canadian murders are done with firearms. Probably not a high percentage, if it is in line with other nations with limited access to hand guns. It is the USA, with all those hundred million hand guns, that have half their murders done with hand guns.

PS. Fakuname, I think your description of the UK as a police state rather ties up more with prejudice than fact. The UK is not perfect, but it is at least as free a nation as the USA.

[JimC]

I have not researched how many Canadian murders are done with firearms. Probably not a high percentage, if it is in line with other nations with limited access to hand guns. It is the USA, with all those hundred million hand guns, that have half their murders done with hand guns.

PS. Fakuname, I think your description of the UK as a police state rather ties up more with prejudice than fact. The UK is not perfect, but it is at least as free a nation as the USA.

I think he meant Australia.

I am perfectly happy to accept our current gun restrictions, in view of the reduction in gun deaths it brings, and so are the overwhelming majority of the population. Sporting shooters can still purchase and use bolt-action rifles of most types for hunting, and farmers have wider options still. No-one here is agitating for more gun freedoms, I can assure you...

[Jason]

No, I was not speaking of Australia. Australia wasn't even involved.

[Jason]

The UK is not perfect, but it is at least as free a nation as the USA.

Hardly. There is institutionalized observation and surveillance of the general public via their CCTV systems. Lawful armament is well nigh impossible for the common person. Speech 'offences' are rampant and they police who can say what, when, where, and how. Institutionalized censorship is gaining the beachhead beginning with things such as filtering search results of 'adult content'. The only category they'll fall short in is an English version of the Gestapo in the next 5-10 years.

But, I suppose you wouldn't recognize those points or their significance - from your villa on the ocean in New Zealand.

[Blind groper]

To Fakuname

From my villa on the sea?
Well, house rather than villa. Wonderful location, but a fairly ordinary house.

On the UK.
I have a certain fondness for Britain and the British, similar to my fondness for Australia and Australians. I have only been there the once, versus several times to the USA, and dozens of times to Oz. However, my visit to the UK was very, very enjoyable, with really nice people, and no sign of any oppression such as you describe.

There is definitely nastiness in the USA, over and above the silliness with guns. I do not know how any rational Americans can justify Guantanamo Bay, waterboarding, surveillance of personal phone calls, the death penalty (even when it has been proven that many of those executed were, in fact, innocent), and the invasion of overseas nations without justification.

I have visited Canada only once, and that was just Vancouver, Vancouver Island, and Victoria. So I cannot comment too much on how things are in Canada from personal experience. My superficial impression is of a pretty nice country, and good people.

[JimC]

The UK is not perfect, but it is at least as free a nation as the USA.

Hardly. There is institutionalized observation and surveillance of the general public via their CCTV systems. Lawful armament is well nigh impossible for the common person. Speech 'offences' are rampant and they police who can say what, when, where, and how. Institutionalized censorship is gaining the beachhead beginning with things such as filtering search results of 'adult content'. The only category they'll fall short in is an English version of the Gestapo in the next 5-10 years.

But, I suppose you wouldn't recognize those points or their significance - from your villa on the ocean in New Zealand.

Some of those things may be worrying trends. The use of laws against hate speech is potentially an issue, as is internet filtering, although the cameras don't worry me, nor does the gun issue. There is vocal and significant opposition to further erosion of individual rights, a free speech and an independent judiciary. To use the term police state is sheer hyperbole; the UK is nothing like the East Germany, Argentina, or any true example of a police state.