Is There A Sound Basis For Racial Profiling?

[Galaxian]

You have to remember that since 9/11 a lot of offenses have been reclassified to fall under the umbrage of 'acts of terrorism' so that almost anything can be responded to with the militarized force authorized to deal with real acts of terrorism.
Pretty clever really.

It's the "The Sky is Falling" mentality that Galaxian and Seth were implying that I was alluding to, not whether there are or are not some issues of police overreaction and inappropriate conflation of crime and terrorism that might need to be addressed.

Several years ago there was yet another documentary about Nazi Germany. It's lucky that I watched that one, because it was about the pre war years, from the early 1930's onwards.

It also covered Germany as seen by outsiders who had some connection with it. These were relatives of Germans, living in France or Britain & other European countries. Or they were traders & business people who had to make regular visits to Germany every 6 months or so.

They ALL mentioned that a surprising part of their visits was that the tone of newspapers & radio broadcasts became more strident & aggressive as time went on. Towards the late 30's it was decidedly hysterical & belligerent. The interviewees were surprised that whenever they mentioned this increasing anger to their contacts in Germany, the relatives, friends or associates were unaware of it, and said that nothing had really changed, and it was an illusion due to not living there.

But it was actually quite the reverse: When you see a society as an outsider, you can usually see more nuances than someone immersed in that culture. It is the frog in the slowly heating saucepan phenomenon. The forg will sit in a pan of cold water with a candle under it. As the water heats up the frog simply sits there, till it is eventually killed by hot water. But if you drop a frog into even warm water, it will promptly jump out.

The native Germans slowly became acclimatised to the changing social order & couldn't see anything amiss. The visitors remembered Germany as it had been 6 months or 12 months earlier & were startled, like the frog leaping out. That's why older citizens are often more revolutionary, because they remember how things used to be, when there was no surveillance or police with guns (Europe) or laws & documents for absolutely everything. Young people have been raised with that & so can't see anything unusual, they are enculturated. They have fully assimilated the new orthodoxy, the intended social engineering.

This is the USA. It's racing into full fascist tyranny. Americans can't see it, but outsiders can. Collapse is inevitable

[Svartalf]

Is saying I prefer pressed cheese to soft racial profiling of my dairy?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

But for the professional over-the-top reactionary posters like Seeth EVERY encounter might end in gunfire.

At least if they have anything to say about it.

[JimC]

You have to remember that since 9/11 a lot of offenses have been reclassified to fall under the umbrage of 'acts of terrorism' so that almost anything can be responded to with the militarized force authorized to deal with real acts of terrorism.
Pretty clever really.

It's the "The Sky is Falling" mentality that Galaxian and Seth were implying that I was alluding to, not whether there are or are not some issues of police overreaction and inappropriate conflation of crime and terrorism that might need to be addressed.

Several years ago there was yet another documentary about Nazi Germany. It's lucky that I watched that one, because it was about the pre war years, from the early 1930's onwards.

It also covered Germany as seen by outsiders who had some connection with it. These were relatives of Germans, living in France or Britain & other European countries. Or they were traders & business people who had to make regular visits to Germany every 6 months or so.

They ALL mentioned that a surprising part of their visits was that the tone of newspapers & radio broadcasts became more strident & aggressive as time went on. Towards the late 30's it was decidedly hysterical & belligerent. The interviewees were surprised that whenever they mentioned this increasing anger to their contacts in Germany, the relatives, friends or associates were unaware of it, and said that nothing had really changed, and it was an illusion due to not living there.

But it was actually quite the reverse: When you see a society as an outsider, you can usually see more nuances than someone immersed in that culture. It is the frog in the slowly heating saucepan phenomenon. The forg will sit in a pan of cold water with a candle under it. As the water heats up the frog simply sits there, till it is eventually killed by hot water. But if you drop a frog into even warm water, it will promptly jump out.

The native Germans slowly became acclimatised to the changing social order & couldn't see anything amiss. The visitors remembered Germany as it had been 6 months or 12 months earlier & were startled, like the frog leaping out. That's why older citizens are often more revolutionary, because they remember how things used to be, when there was no surveillance or police with guns (Europe) or laws & documents for absolutely everything. Young people have been raised with that & so can't see anything unusual, they are enculturated. They have fully assimilated the new orthodoxy, the intended social engineering.

This is the USA. It's racing into full fascist tyranny. Americans can't see it, but outsiders can. Collapse is inevitable

Some valid points there, sure, about how social change can creep up on you.. But I simply don't see the same level of hysterical militarism in current US or western politics as there was during the rise of the 3rd Reich. People then had no past experience of fascism - we do, and there should be at least some immune reaction from that knowledge.

[Hermit]

I can hear a sound basis for profiling, but not for racial profiling.

[Seth]

Galaxian wrote:

...The constant searches, surveillance cameras, drones, police checkpoints, lock-down of Boston, numerous false flags, some even involving shooting toddlers & children, etc, etc, they are ALL designed to make the population servile & compliant. It is a return to serfdom, but at a more severe level than it existed in the Dark Ages.

Seth wrote:

I was interested to see whether anyone would broach the Terrorism Theater aspect of Marxist reeducation. Thanks for doing so. You are absolutely, completely right. For example, about 150 perfectly innocent civilians are unlawfully killed by our militarized police in drug raids on the wrong house. These SWAT team members almost never face prosecution when they break into the wrong home and the homeowner, knowing he's an innocent person, responds just as he should when attacked by masked, armed thugs in the wee small hours of the morning...he shoots at them. Then they shoot back, usually killing him. And even if nobody shoots at the SWAT team, they terrorize, quite literally and intentionally, everyone in the house to "gain compliance." They will shoot your dog out of hand and toss flash-bangs into children's bedrooms, all because they were too interested in being warfighters in the "War on Some Drugs" than they are in protecting and serving their employers.

The examples you both quote should certainly be criticised and exposed, but you are both seeing some form of sinister conspiracy when more mundane faults in correct procedure can be ascribed.

And, amusingly, I suspect you are seeing your "grand conspiracy" from opposing political extremes, united only in being irrational at the core...

It's not "grand" in the meaning that someone at the top is pulling all those strings, but it's absolutely a conspiracy, and it's been driven by generations of Progressives and Marxists for more than 100 years now.

Since you don't understand police departments in the US and how they operate, you can't say that "correct procedure" is the solution. They already have a "correct procedure" set by the Constitution which boils down to "don't forcibly invade people's homes unless you have a VALID search warrant and don't shoot them unless you have a lawful reason to do so, and protecting yourself, as the initial unlawful aggressor invading a home for which you do NOT have a valid warrant does not constitute a lawful reason to use deadly force against an innocent occupant attempting to defend himself against an unlawful, unconstitutional armed invasion of his home."

The whole problem is that DA's when asked to prosecute lazy, inept, incompetent cops who wrongfully kill innocent citizens refuse to prosecute them saying that they are "innocent" because a "mistake" was made when what they should be doing is prosecuting every cop who wrongfully invades an innocent person's house and putting them in prison in order to encourage OTHER cops not to make fatal mistakes.

Sorry, but all the drug raids on earth are not worth the cost of one single innocent life taken in an incompetent wrongful SWAT raid.

The conspiracy part is more generalized by the overarching policies and procedures at all levels of government that authorize and sanction such activities regardless of how horrific the unintended consequences of making a mistake are. Today, such incidents are dismissed and covered up as "accidents" and "oversights" and cops are excused from homicide charges because a homeowner did what he had every legal right to do by shooting at vicious home invaders whom he KNOWS are not legally authorized to be there because he's not a criminal.

They should be prosecuted as criminally negligent manslaughter at the very least...each and every time. Police who burst into homes with machine guns cannot be allowed to make even one single mistake, ever. If they do, they must be punished just as any other citizen would be punished for committing an illegal armed invasion of a private home and killing the occupants.

[Svartalf]

I can hear a sound basis for profiling, but not for racial profiling.

but isn't race a sound basis for profiling?

[Seth]

I can hear a sound basis for profiling, but not for racial profiling.

but isn't race a sound basis for profiling?

I think race can be a valid basis for "profiling" because, well, race is part of a person's profile. Is it a sound basis for taking law enforcement action? No, not in and of itself, but it's certainly a valid reason to enhance scrutiny or take personal precautions.

The idea that "profiling" is so heinous that newspapers and TV stations won't even report the race of a suspect in a violent crime (as many don't) for whom the police are searching, for fear of being accused of "racial profiling.

As Ann Coulter says, "At some point it's no longer racial profiling, it's suspect identification."

[JimC]

I can hear a sound basis for profiling, but not for racial profiling.

but isn't race a sound basis for profiling?

Outward racial features are fine as part of a suspect's description or photofit, but not when linked to psychological profiling...

[Svartalf]

But isn't going about while brown a crime? or is it just in Arizona?

[Hermit]

I can hear a sound basis for profiling, but not for racial profiling.

but isn't race a sound basis for profiling?

If different races within homo sapiens sapiens existed, and differences of behaviour, such as a greater or lesser tendency in regard to murder, terrorism and other criminal acts between them could be proven to be of genetic origin, I would say "yes". In the absence of such proof the "racial" in "racial profiling" is simply an unnecessary, because useless, add-on.

[rainbow]

As Ann Coulter says, "At some point it's no longer racial profiling, it's suspect identification."

A stupid person says a stupid thing.

Why repeat it?

[Tyrannical]

I can hear a sound basis for profiling, but not for racial profiling.

but isn't race a sound basis for profiling?

Outward racial features are fine as part of a suspect's description or photofit, but not when linked to psychological profiling...

Behavior is linked to inheritance. Even our earliest civilized ancestors knew this ten thousand years ago when agriculture and animal domestication were first practiced.

[Seth]

I can hear a sound basis for profiling, but not for racial profiling.

but isn't race a sound basis for profiling?

Outward racial features are fine as part of a suspect's description or photofit, but not when linked to psychological profiling...

Behavior is linked to inheritance. Even our earliest civilized ancestors knew this ten thousand years ago when agriculture and animal domestication were first practiced.

That's observably true. Take dogs, for example. Some breeds are known for their passivity, and others for their aggressiveness.

[rainbow]

That's observably true. Take dogs, for example. Some breeds are known for their passivity, and others for their aggressiveness.

Humans are observably different from dogs.
Dogs have wet noses when healthy, while humans have wet noses when ill.
They also have a different taste.