The argument can be rephrased like this: Why do theists keep lauding God X for the allegedly miraculous saving of an individual after Y catastrophe, and not give him equal responsibility for killing several / dozens / hundreds /thousands and hundreds of thousands for allowing that catastrophe to happen in the first place? Or: If said God created everything, is he all he's cracked up to be, given the obvious design faults of what he has wrought?RiverF wrote:I never understood the logically inconsistent I don't believe in god because why does he let people suffer and die comment/argument.
The atheist tornado survivor..
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops. - Stephen J. Gould
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
Which is risky, because it leaves the logical possibility that you would worship a god that somehow stopped all those things...Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I always say "I wouldn't worship a god that allows such things to happen."RiverF wrote:Yep, she's responding frankly, but not imposing.
Also, mistermack .. I never understood the logically inconsistent I don't believe in god because why does he let people suffer and die comment/argument.
Nurse, where the fuck's my cardigan?
And my gin!
And my gin!
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
If there was a demonstrable god that did only good and made the universe a "better place", then I would possibly admire it, but still not worship it.JimC wrote:Which is risky, because it leaves the logical possibility that you would worship a god that somehow stopped all those things...Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I always say "I wouldn't worship a god that allows such things to happen."RiverF wrote:Yep, she's responding frankly, but not imposing.
Also, mistermack .. I never understood the logically inconsistent I don't believe in god because why does he let people suffer and die comment/argument.
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
Because one person surviving against tremendous odds is a miracle while a million deaths is a statistic.Hermit wrote:The argument can be rephrased like this: Why do theists keep lauding God X for the allegedly miraculous saving of an individual after Y catastrophe, and not give him equal responsibility for killing several / dozens / hundreds /thousands and hundreds of thousands for allowing that catastrophe to happen in the first place? Or: If said God created everything, is he all he's cracked up to be, given the obvious design faults of what he has wrought?RiverF wrote:I never understood the logically inconsistent I don't believe in god because why does he let people suffer and die comment/argument.

Never mind that we have a tremendous number of people around and that it isn't remarkable at al that an improbable event might happen from time to time.
If you're looking for god, there are enough dots in enough places that you'll be able to selectively connect them in some convenient way.
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
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The Net is best considered analogous to communication with disincarnate intelligences. As any neophyte would tell you. Do not invoke that which you have no facility to banish.
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
A nasty backlash has started anyway, as one can see by the comments on this article. Some of these comments are horrifying and chilling.Twoflower wrote:Agreed. If she had been in any way rude or aggressive there would have been a lot of nasty backlash. I think she handled it wonderfully.RiverF wrote:Sometimes an honest and gentle approach is effective enough .. if not more so.
(Interesting article - people are raising money for her, too.)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/2 ... r=Politics
I think that language has a lot to do with interfering in our relationship to direct experience. A simple thing like metaphor will allows you to go to a place and say 'this is like that'. Well, this isn't like that. This is like this.
—Richard Serra
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
Comment sections are always nasty, it could have been much much worse though. The part of the states that she lives in isn't know for being open minded.
I'm wild just like a rock, a stone, a tree
And I'm free, just like the wind the breeze that blows
And I flow, just like a brook, a stream, the rain
And I fly, just like a bird up in the sky
And I'll surely die, just like a flower plucked
And dragged away and thrown away
And then one day it turns to clay
It blows away, it finds a ray, it finds its way
And there it lays until the rain and sun
Then I breathe, just like the wind the breeze that blows
And I grow, just like a baby breastfeeding
And it's beautiful, that's life

And I'm free, just like the wind the breeze that blows
And I flow, just like a brook, a stream, the rain
And I fly, just like a bird up in the sky
And I'll surely die, just like a flower plucked
And dragged away and thrown away
And then one day it turns to clay
It blows away, it finds a ray, it finds its way
And there it lays until the rain and sun
Then I breathe, just like the wind the breeze that blows
And I grow, just like a baby breastfeeding
And it's beautiful, that's life

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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
Poor widdle Christians. How dare she shove her worldview down their throats like that.Twoflower wrote:Comment sections are always nasty, it could have been much much worse though. The part of the states that she lives in isn't know for being open minded.
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
-Mr P
The Net is best considered analogous to communication with disincarnate intelligences. As any neophyte would tell you. Do not invoke that which you have no facility to banish.
Audley Strange
-Mr P
The Net is best considered analogous to communication with disincarnate intelligences. As any neophyte would tell you. Do not invoke that which you have no facility to banish.
Audley Strange
Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
Where have I read that before?Robert_S wrote:Because one person surviving against tremendous odds is a miracle while a million deaths is a statistic.Hermit wrote:The argument can be rephrased like this: Why do theists keep lauding God X for the allegedly miraculous saving of an individual after Y catastrophe, and not give him equal responsibility for killing several / dozens / hundreds /thousands and hundreds of thousands for allowing that catastrophe to happen in the first place? Or: If said God created everything, is he all he's cracked up to be, given the obvious design faults of what he has wrought?RiverF wrote:I never understood the logically inconsistent I don't believe in god because why does he let people suffer and die comment/argument.![]()

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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
Keep Stalin and I'll go google it.Făkünamę wrote:Where have I read that before?Robert_S wrote:Because one person surviving against tremendous odds is a miracle while a million deaths is a statistic.Hermit wrote:The argument can be rephrased like this: Why do theists keep lauding God X for the allegedly miraculous saving of an individual after Y catastrophe, and not give him equal responsibility for killing several / dozens / hundreds /thousands and hundreds of thousands for allowing that catastrophe to happen in the first place? Or: If said God created everything, is he all he's cracked up to be, given the obvious design faults of what he has wrought?RiverF wrote:I never understood the logically inconsistent I don't believe in god because why does he let people suffer and die comment/argument.![]()
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
Not only do you not understand it, you even see it where it doesn't exist.RiverF wrote:Yep, she's responding frankly, but not imposing.
Also, mistermack .. I never understood the logically inconsistent I don't believe in god because why does he let people suffer and die comment/argument.
I recommend more careful reading, it might help with understanding.
I thought she replied well, but I was sorry that her body language was so apologetic.
That's not criticizing her, I just would have liked a bit of a put-down, because the prick deserved it.
She answered nicely, I would prefer a bit of aggro.
While there is a market for shit, there will be assholes to supply it.
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
"Body language" requires a fair amount of mind-reading to be accurate. I've not seen many people with that skill.
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
You wouldn't know it if you saw it.Gawdzilla Sama wrote:"Body language" requires a fair amount of mind-reading to be accurate. I've not seen many people with that skill.
While there is a market for shit, there will be assholes to supply it.
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
mistermack wrote:You wouldn't know it if you saw it.Gawdzilla Sama wrote:"Body language" requires a fair amount of mind-reading to be accurate. I've not seen many people with that skill.

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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
when she says, "actually we're atheists" she lays her head on one side, almost horizontally, in the typical pose of a little child asking for an ice-cream. A sort of begging, wheedling submissive pose.
Nothing wrong with it, she just didn't want to come across as aggressive.
It worked.
Nothing wrong with it, she just didn't want to come across as aggressive.
It worked.
While there is a market for shit, there will be assholes to supply it.
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Re: The atheist tornado survivor..
To me it looked like she was expecting an attack, not at all unlikely in that area.mistermack wrote:when she says, "actually we're atheists" she lays her head on one side, almost horizontally, in the typical pose of a little child asking for an ice-cream. A sort of begging, wheedling submissive pose.
Nothing wrong with it, she just didn't want to come across as aggressive.
It worked.
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