Why war? Freedom? Democracy? actually...profit.

[sandinista]

No, it was invented a lot earlier than that... see the fortunes Caesar made off his military endeavours... and I suspect earlier Roman leaders may have done the same.

for sure, this is nothing new. Of course, because its not new doesn't mean it should continue. Evolve.

No, I'm claiming that most people understand war can be and usually is a profitable endeavour for those who make the weapons used in them.

I don't think a lot of people even consider it.

I think most people are aware, but tune it out. So my point is that the kind of people who might be ignorant about this should be the people you are making aware of it, if it is such a big deal to you, since I don't think anyone here is remotely surprised by such obviousness.

So...basically your saying I'm preaching to the converted? Really? I could say the same thing for most postings here.

[Svartalf]

Evo what? Are you some kind of Darwinist or something?

[Audley Strange]

So...basically your saying I'm preaching to the converted? Really? I could say the same thing for most postings here.

Probably so, however I'm saying your entire position is a strawman, that most people are aware of this and that your assumption that they are not and that they should have this information brought to light depends on your low opinion of the general populace, whereas I think most adults are aware that war is profitable but lack the impetus to care.

[sandinista]

So...basically your saying I'm preaching to the converted? Really? I could say the same thing for most postings here.

Probably so, however I'm saying your entire position is a strawman, that most people are aware of this and that your assumption that they are not and that they should have this information brought to light depends on your low opinion of the general populace, whereas I think most adults are aware that war is profitable but lack the impetus to care.

So you have a differing opinion. That's fine, but it's no strawman. I would add that, if you believe that most people are aware but don't care, that would make your opinion of people lower than mine. Knowing and not caring is a hell of a lot worse than simply not knowing.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

So...basically your saying I'm preaching to the converted? Really? I could say the same thing for most postings here.

Probably so, however I'm saying your entire position is a strawman, that most people are aware of this and that your assumption that they are not and that they should have this information brought to light depends on your low opinion of the general populace, whereas I think most adults are aware that war is profitable but lack the impetus to care.

But ... but ... but Sandi has The Truth!

[klr]

In today's global economy, major wars are not really in the interests of arms manufacturers. They'd probably prefer a state of global paranoia where everyone is armed to the teeth, but also readily trade with each other.

[sandinista]

So...basically your saying I'm preaching to the converted? Really? I could say the same thing for most postings here.

Probably so, however I'm saying your entire position is a strawman, that most people are aware of this and that your assumption that they are not and that they should have this information brought to light depends on your low opinion of the general populace, whereas I think most adults are aware that war is profitable but lack the impetus to care.

But ... but ... but Sandi has The Truth!

But...but....but Audley Strange has the Truth. Only works one way for you zilla?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

You have mundane bullshit. Audley's okay.

[sandinista]

You have mundane bullshit. Audley's okay.

Which means what I'm saying is not mundane or bullshit. Although I already knew that, nice to get some verification. Ta.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

You are just repeating the party line. Nothing new.

[klr]

Does anyone imagine that tobacco manufacturers are in it for the good of humanity? Or McDonald's? Or Apple? Why then should we even be remotely surprised that arms manufacturers are not exactly saints? Or for that matter, that the world's largest arms exporters are also (by and large) the world's largest economies.

[Audley Strange]

Hey, my bullshit is Sublime, G.

Sandi you are a member of the general public, what makes you think that just because you know of something, others don't? What makes you think that if people do know about something they should care? The world is not a pleasant place for the majority and I think most people are too busy struggling to have and enjoy a life than to agonise about things which are, to them, trivial.

People tend to be apathetic regarding most things, not a slight, just a matter of necessity. So if some 22 year old single mother wants to feed her kids and the only job she can get is in a munitions factory, do you really think her priority is that those weapons are going to be used for war or do you think she's going to tune it out? Righteous indignation is a luxury for those with free time and their needs catered for and those who have neither. Most people in the West are in between.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Sublimely Strange.

[sandinista]

Does anyone imagine that tobacco manufacturers are in it for the good of humanity?

No, but they don't claim to be

Or McDonald's?

Yes, some probably do, cheap food, jobs etc.

Or Apple?

absolutely people think Apple in is it for the good of humanity. Absolutely. Some people made steve jobs out to be a god.

Why then should we even be remotely surprised that arms manufacturers are not exactly saints?

Haven't even said anyone should be surprised. It's more a pinpoint of WHAT corporations are profiting, not that they ARE profiting.

Sandi you are a member of the general public, what makes you think that just because you know of something, others don't?

Are you saying that everyone is equally informed? That some peopl don't spend more time than others researching and reading different topics. Sorry, that's a ridiculous statement. That's like saying just because a mechanic can fix a car everyone can.

What makes you think that if people do know about something they should care?

Not even sure what kind of question that is...sure don't give a shit about anything, carry on.

The world is not a pleasant place for the majority and I think most people are too busy struggling to have and enjoy a life than to agonise about things which are, to them, trivial.

...and companies profiting of off the mass killing of thousands is trivial. OK, yea, that sounds about right. At least now I know your opinion and why you are struggling with this thread.

So if some 22 year old single mother wants to feed her kids and the only job she can get is in a munitions factory, do you really think her priority is that those weapons are going to be used for war or do you think she's going to tune it out?

worst analogy EVER.

Righteous indignation is a luxury for those with free time and their needs catered for and those who have neither. Most people in the West are in between.

What are you even on about. With that attitude...why post anything at all? Most nonsense post I've read in a while. With the exception of anything zilla writes, but I guess that goes without saying.

[JimC]

That arms manufacturers are amoral capitalists who profit from armed conflict is pretty clear.

But to imply that this profit motive is the sole or even prime cause of armed conflict is stretching things. Armed conflicts arise from a variety of causes, not purely from any evils that may be inherent in capitalism.