27 dead at Connecticut school, including 14 kids

[Jason]

That's what I've been saying this entire time - get at the root of the problem. However, the anti-gun nuts cannot see past their irrational bias and continue to trumpet the war song 'guns ARE the problem'.

[cronus]

A quiet one. I knew it.

"Law enforcement officials said Mr. Lanza had grown up in Newtown, and he was remembered by high school classmates as smart, introverted and nervous. They said he had gone out of his way not to attract attention when he was younger." - NY Times

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/15/nyreg ... .html?_r=0

[Gallstones]

That's what I've been saying this entire time - get at the root of the problem. However, the anti-gun nuts cannot see past their irrational bias and continue to trumpet the war song 'guns ARE the problem'.

It is easier to focus on the means rather than the cause because causes are complex and cause brain pain.

[cronus]

That's what I've been saying this entire time - get at the root of the problem. However, the anti-gun nuts cannot see past their irrational bias and continue to trumpet the war song 'guns ARE the problem'.

It is easier to focus on the means rather than the cause because causes are complex and cause brain pain.

Seems likely he was seeing a shrink because that was one of his victims. Most likely prescribed heavy meds and suffered a med induced psychosis trying to come off of them?

[FBM]

That's what I've been saying this entire time - get at the root of the problem. However, the anti-gun nuts cannot see past their irrational bias and continue to trumpet the war song 'guns ARE the problem'.

It is easier to focus on the means rather than the cause because causes are complex and cause brain pain.

This is true, afaict. I'm not sure what could be done to address the real cause, though. What would be a good way to start? I'm thinking maybe making kids sit through films about gun accidents and incidents the same way we had to sit through drug films when I was a kid. Oh, wait. They didn't work on me. Well, anyway, I suggest something along the lines of effective childhood education to promote gun awareness and safety so that when they do grow up, if they get guns they will store and use them safely. Something like that would be a good start, anyway, I think.

[macdoc]

sensible

Firearms Regulation in Australia

In Australia, access to firearms is limited to persons with a genuine need. This includes government and police, sporting shooters with valid membership of an approved club, recreational shooters or hunters that produce proof of permission from a landowner, primary producers, pest controllers and bona fide collectors. All governments have agreed that self-protection is not a genuine need.

The key elements of Australia’s regulatory controls on firearms are:

* prohibitions on fully and semi automatic long arms, with their use restricted primarily to military, police or government purposes;
* prohibitions on sporting shooters possessing, owning, using, purchasing or importing high powered, concealable handguns;
* mandatory registration of all firearms on State and Territory firearms registry systems;
* mandatory licensing of all firearm owners; and
* strict licensing requirements, including age limitations, undertaking firearms safety training, and compliance with firearm storage standards.

start there......

This was a direct result of a shooting in Tasmania with an semi-automatic firearm

did it work....fucking right it did....

Guns killed more than 5000 people in Australia in the past decade. Nine out of 10 of the victims were male and most of them killed themselves.

The number of deaths caused by firearms dropped almost 50 per cent between 1991 and 2001, with the biggest yearly fall in deaths coming after the 1996 Port Arthur massacre.

so stop with the fucking nit picking shite about statistics and get behind a sensible control policy and give it teeth....

It's not like Aussies are milk toasts - the are rowdie they drink it's a hard driving sports and fishing culture....
and when common sense controls were put in place and enforced the death from firearms was cut in half.

[Jason]

Take it to the proper thread if you please.

[macdoc]

complain to the mods if you like ...I suspect they will leave it exactly where it is.

If the laws like the Australians have were in place those kids would not be killed.
He used his mother's own guns to kill her his father and twenty kids.
Time for a change not stupid arguments about statistics.

[cronus]

Says in this link he was suffering with the aspergers....explains the accurate shooting aspect? and body count. He'd have been methodical.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/12/14 ... her-adams/

[Jason]

I believe you presented the only argument about statistics, or at least the only one replete with graphs. This discussion is not about the statistical merits of increased gun regulation, but, where it relates to gun regulation, the question being issued is whether it is the cause of tragedies such as this, or a cause in them at all. Refrain, if you please, from diminishing what happened by making it a soap box you may stand upon to push you agenda to a larger audience. It is unseemly and inappropriate. Thank you.

[JimC]

It will be interesting at a political level to see whether this tragic event actually galvanises the US anti-gun movement, and creates a wave of support for greater restrictions on gun ownership.

Waiting for certain forum members to say "Over my dead body", whereupon I shall reply "yes, quite possibly..."

Unlikely in the extreme.

Probably true, given the gun lobby.

OK, which Elementary School is next?

[Blind groper]

Faku

Forum discussions, exactly like normal human conversations, tend to wander. There is nothing wrong with this, and it helps to keep a discussion interesting. People who try to stop this by telling people that this is not the theme are not doing anyone any favors.

This thread has wandered into gun politics. Fair enough. It is an interesting subject (at least, until Seth gets involved). Why not explore where it goes? (until Seth gets involved).

[JimC]

Faku

Forum discussions, exactly like normal human conversations, tend to wander. There is nothing wrong with this, and it helps to keep a discussion interesting. People who try to stop this by telling people that this is not the theme are not doing anyone any favors.

This thread has wandered into gun politics. Fair enough. It is an interesting subject (at least, until Seth gets involved). Why not explore where it goes? (until Seth gets involved).

And, it is 100% connected to the OP. How could it not be?

[cronus]

Faku

Forum discussions, exactly like normal human conversations, tend to wander. There is nothing wrong with this, and it helps to keep a discussion interesting. People who try to stop this by telling people that this is not the theme are not doing anyone any favors.

This thread has wandered into gun politics. Fair enough. It is an interesting subject (at least, until Seth gets involved). Why not explore where it goes? (until Seth gets involved).

And, it is 100% connected to the OP. How could it not be?

Yes, but it is a repetitive issue in the states and this will only harden opinions on both sides of the debate making the impasse even more concrete. It isn't resolvable without major social upheaval and until then the gnu debate itself is best left on the shelf....

[Jason]

Because 1) there is a thread to discuss gun politics 2) it distracts from the real issue and 3) it trivializes a true tragedy by reducing it to another plot on a graph your group can attempt to use for the nth time to prove once and for all that guns are the greatest evil the world has ever faced.

This isn't about gun crimes writ small on a chart we can squabble about, it's about a deranged and sick human being and others like him. It's about what caused 14 children to be murdered. I'm not about to let an important discussion be lost amidst the swill of a political agenda.