Guns Used.....cont

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Let's make war on violence!

[mozg]

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2012/11/30/cbs- ... y-gunfire/

Shots ring out as someone opens fire on a Dallas office building, and a window belonging to NewsRadio 1080 KRLD is hit.

The bullets went through the outside panes of glass on two floors of the 12-story CBS Radio building off Central Expressway at Fitzhugh Avenue.

tl;dr - Texas gun nut attacks freedom of the press.

I say we round them all up and apply thumb screws until they talk.

Also in Texas: Homeowner shoots knife wielding intruder.

New Jersey: Clerk shoots armed robber and ends crime spree.

South Carolina: Female store stops 3 armed robbers with her gun.

They should've just complied with the attackers, right?

[amused]

non sequitur

It's common knowledge that Texas gun nuts hate freedom, freedom of the press, and America in general.

FACT

[mozg]

non sequitur

It's common knowledge that Texas gun nuts hate freedom, freedom of the press, and America in general.

FACT

This is also a FACT. Jill Stucker, 64 of Lake City, FL used a firearm to defend herself.

And then there is Wisconsin where the surviving attacker will be charged with felony murder after a customer at the hair salon he and his partner tried to rob shot and killed the partner.

And what would 12 year old Kendra St. Clair have done if all of her family's firearms were locked in a safe she couldn't access? Before breaking into the St. Clairs' house, Stacey Adam Jones was also involved in the disappearance of a mentally handicapped 17 year-old girl.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

http://girlsguidetoguns.com/

[Blind groper]

List, please. I'm assuming these countries were democracies?

You can start with Britain which had very loose gun laws till roughly the end of the 19th century. My own country had loose gun laws, with anyone who wanted to own hand guns going out and buying them. Jim could probably tell you of the changes in Australia. That is just a start.

To mozg

"The plural of anecdote is not data."

it is a truism that anecdotes, such as you quoted, are not evidence for anything general.

You asked how you make a gun childproof?
The technology already exists. There are gun locks that cannot be released by a child. There is a trigger system that requires more force to pull the trigger than a child can apply.Here is another system. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/750506.stm

Evidence for gun safes saving lives?
The New England Journal of Medicine article I just recently quoted has the statement that suicides drop dramatically when the gun in the home is in secure storage.

[Jason]

Great? How is a drop in suicide rate a good thing, nevermind an argument against guns?

[Blind groper]

Great? How is a drop in suicide rate a good thing, nevermind an argument against guns?

Sadly this thread has now got to the stage where I am repeating the same thing the third or fourth time. People forget what has been said.

Suicides are usually impulsive and attempts that are survived mostly are not repeated. People who are depressed, leading to suicide attempts, recover and live long and reasonably happy lives. Personally, I believe that human lives matter, and people should, where possible, be given the chance to survive.

[Jason]

Probably not repeated because killing yourself takes a lot of motivation and nerve - the basic instinct for survival is strong. Surviving a suicide attempt often leaves the person incapacitated in one way or another, mentally or physically or both, and the thought of trying again is terrifying enough to overcome the motivation and nerve they have. It says nothing about the quality of life of these survivors or whether they still wish to die. I don't believe suicide attempts are impulsive in significant numbers - the signs are there long before the attempt. I also don't believe people that attempt suicide recover and live long and happy lives. That's bullshit.

I also don't believe that human life is more important than self-determination. If someone chooses to end their life then that's their decision and who has the right to deny them? This 'value of human life over personal freedom' is an oppressive imposition which is completely unjustifiable. It's their life, not yours.

[Blind groper]

Pord

I have been over that whole subject several times now, with back up references and evidence. It is depressing when people like you forget what has been posted.

[Jason]

I generally skim your posts. I see FBM has been arguing with you about it for some time with his own references and evidence.

[FBM]

List, please. I'm assuming these countries were democracies?

You can start with Britain which had very loose gun laws till roughly the end of the 19th century. My own country had loose gun laws, with anyone who wanted to own hand guns going out and buying them. Jim could probably tell you of the changes in Australia. That is just a start.

So, each of these countries had a frontier history of gun ownership for survival stretching back 500 years. In each of these countries, the majority of its citizens had kept firearms in their homes for hunting and protection. In each of these countries, the government either forcefully disarmed millions of its citizens or those majority of citizens willfully handed over their guns. I'm not sure the word "disarm" is an accurate description of what happened in any of those countries.

[Blind groper]

No. It was not forceful disarming. In fact, such a process would not really be needed in the USA either. It was a simple process of tightening the gun laws over a period of time, and permitting the people to adapt.

For example : if a new gun law requires a license, with the need to pass an exam, and undergo a police inspection, then the people are given time to prepare.

[FBM]

No. It was not forceful disarming. In fact, such a process would not really be needed in the USA either. It was a simple process of tightening the gun laws over a period of time, and permitting the people to adapt.

For example : if a new gun law requires a license, with the need to pass an exam, and undergo a police inspection, then the people are given time to prepare.

I had to do all those things to get a concealed carry permit, but only the background check to buy handguns. I mentioned some time ago that I'm all for obligatory education, training and testing, but I don't see that as a first step towards a gradual disarming of the public, just a reasonable measure to prevent accidents. As long as the majority don't want the Second Amendment changed, the gummit shouldn't violate it. There's already a debate on whether or not existing laws infringe upon the citizens' right to bear arms. District of Columbia v Heller should have cleared that up, but some local law enforcement agencies don't see it that way. Anyway, I imagine the next generation will be slightly less interested in guns than this one, and the one after that slightly less interested, etc.

[Seth]

Pord

I have been over that whole subject several times now, with back up references and evidence. It is depressing when people like you forget what has been posted.

We haven't forgotten it, we dismiss it as specious, obfuscatory nonsense.