Israel/Palestine; has the shit finally hit the fan?

[cronus]

I support Israel because they appear to have a edge here. Also Palestinians have the entire arab world to seek refuge but where can the Jewish people run? Obviously that'll make them vicious with their backs against the wall, but you get what you give? Seth is right again, supporting the good guys against the hamas terrorists.

The entire military episode is crumple approved by the way, in this overpopulated world undergoing social decline. Trees are saved everytime a human dies.

[Audley Strange]

It occurs that the last time the fuckholes escalated their bloody nonsense was just after the Last U.S. election.

[cronus]

It occurs that the last time the fuckholes escalated their bloody nonsense was just after the Last U.S. election.

The answer to Middle East peace might be to abolish democracy in the US then?

[pErvinalia]

It occurs that the last time the fuckholes escalated their bloody nonsense was just after the Last U.S. election.

Yep, the last invasion of Gaza was 4 years ago in the period between the election victory and the formal swearing in thingo in January. The theory being suggested is that that is the best time for this sort of thing to happen in regards to the US president. But when you throw in the Palestinian UN bid in a bit over a week, and the Israeli elections in January, all the planets seemed to be aligned for another massacre in Gaza.

[Coito ergo sum]

So Hamas in Gaza is firing rockets into "the occupied territories?" Got it. As I said, folks who talk like this include "Israel" as among the "occupied" territories.

[Coito ergo sum]

LOL "Palestime." Israel is in the region called "Palestine." It's part of Palestine.

[pErvinalia]

It's not supposed to be a literal thing. It's talking about Palestinian territories. It's an internet graphic. They can't write a fucking thesis on it.

[cronus]

Palestinans and Israelis are the same - this is a family blood feud. That's why it is ruthless and sadistic in nature. As well as having no end in sight.

"A study of high-resolution haplotypes demonstrated that a substantial portion of Y chromosomes of Israeli Jews (70%) and of Palestinian Muslim Arabs (82%) belonged to the same chromosome pool."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_people

[Coito ergo sum]

If the Arabs lay down their weapons, there will be no war. If the Israelis lay down their weapons, there will be no Israel.

Those are not the options. Neither will lay down their weapons.

I was most disapponted to see Obama saying that the USA will support Israel, since Israel is the greater offender. Israel's actions are not simple defense. While I do not support Hamas with its rocket attacks, it is worth remembering that those rocket attacks are almost ineffective. They harm the occasional home, but the death toll is miniscule. Israel, though, kills Palestinians by the dozens or by the hundreds.

That doesn't make them the greater offender. They're responding to Palestinian attacks. If the Palestinians would not fire the rockets into Israel, Israel wouldn't fire at them.

Bullshit. As I mentioned earlier, Israel kicked off this current conflagration. And they did it by killing kids, as is often the case. And there are a number of analyses out there on the web that show that it is actually Israel that start most of the flare ups. You follow the simplistic line that Israel is only defending itself. You ignore the internal politics of Israel, the UN vote coming up, and the actual end results of that "defence" - i.e. thousands of Palestinians citizens killed (including a significant number of women and children) for only a tiny number of Israeli's killed; more loss of Palestinian lands and independence; and more international war and humanitarian crimes from the Israelis.

Israel did not. Hamas kicked up the current conflagration by ramping up, among other things, their rocket attacks into Israel. The thing is, the daily grind that Israel faces is barely reported, so people think that Israel's actions come right out of the blue. From January of this year, 2012, to before Israel's current actions began, approximately 1,300 rockets and 400 mortar shells fired from Gaza have hit Israeli civilian areas. The 2012 total, so far, was about 3 times as many rockets as in 2011. So the escalation came from Hamas.

More than 1000 rockets fired into Israel this week.http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/2 ... 63259.html All at military targets, you think?

Hamas rocket attacks hit two Israeli schools: http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=50135488n

Israel's goal is to stop Palestinian rocket fire: http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/ ... WP20121119

What do you expect Israel to do? What would your country do if New Zealand started firing thousands of rockets into Australia, forcing your citizens into bomb shelters?

Where do you think Hams is getting the weaponry? They are manufacturing this stuff themselves?

November 10 to the 13th -- In distinct escalation, Palestinian terrorists in Gaza launched more than 150 rockets at Israel; at least 121 rocket hits were identified in Israeli territory. A total of 64 rockets hits were identified on November 11. A number of mortar shells were also fired. A number of Israeli civilians were wounded by the rocket fire, although not seriously; several were treated for shock and there was extensive property damage.

November 14 to 19th -- Following the barrage of rocket strikes from November 10-13, on November 14, Israel launched Operation "Pillar of Defense" to halt the incessent Palestinian rocket fire from Gaza. On the morning of November 15, three Israeli civilians were killed when a rocket directly struck their apartment building in the city of Kiryat Malachi. Three children, among them two young babies, were also wounded in the strike. Three IDF soldiers were wounded in a separate attack when mortar shells exploded inside their base near the Gaza border. On November 16, a rocket fired from Gaza landed outside Jerusalem. The Iron Dome Missile Shield has successfully intercepted another 310 rocket launches, including rockets targeting Tel Aviv.

Hamas was firing at schools in Israel in March, when about 175 rockets were fired into Israel. Another barrage in June had to be fended off. And, every month, the constant stream of rockets fired from Hamas continued to set off air raid sirens in Israel.

However, what happens is Hamas gets more and more active with the rockets - back up to 1,000 rockets this year -- 1,000 rockets into a country the size of New Jersey.

The vast majority of them land in uninhabited areas, and in areas that are legally Palestinian land. You are probably also unaware of the fact that Hamas has (or had) over a 1000 more advanced rockets capable of reaching Tel Aviv and Jerusalem, but until the current flare up (started by the Israelis), used virtually NONE of them. If they were so determined to bomb the shit out of Israel, why are they not using those rockets?

Some of them hit schools and apartment buildings.

And, you want me to give Hamas a medal for not firing everything it has?

I would say they're not using their biggest rockets because they don't want to give Israel political cover to finally kick the living shit out of them. Hamas wants to poke the Tiger, and then complain when he scratches.

Hamas are, of course, a bunch of blithering idiots. But do their amateurish attacks warrant hundreds of innocent Palestinians, who just want to make a reasonable life for themselves, being maimed or killed?

it's easy for us to say, not living there, how many "amateurish" rocket attacks we'd put up with before we'd want something done about them.

This is why the region needs an 'impartial' umpire policing them.[/quote]

Who says they do?

[pErvinalia]

I say it. Clearly it's a fucking disaster as it is now. Anyway, go and read the links I provided and stop parroting the bogus mainstream media line that the Gazan are to blame for this. Your simplistic analysis of rockets fired this year vs last year is just that, simplistic. Israel started this latest flare up, as the have started most of the flare ups in the past. The links point this out. Some dude has even done a statistical analysis to show that most of Gaza''s rocket attacks come AFTER Israel has launched an attack on them. FFS, open up your eyes.

[Coito ergo sum]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/mehdi-h ... 39356.html

Just stop firing rockets into Israel. That's all they have to do.

Look - the reason Hamas is attacking Israel is not because they want Gaza and the West Bank to be left alone. The reason they are attacking Israel is because they think Israel should be part of a Palestinian state.

That is the problem.

[pErvinalia]

And i've got to do a big facepalm about you going on about Palestinian rockets landing on or near schools in Israel (for which there has been zero deaths), all the while the Israeli's are slaughtering Palestinian children in shocking numbers. What the fuck is wrong with this picture, eh?

[pErvinalia]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/mehdi-h ... 39356.html

Just stop firing rockets into Israel. That's all they have to do.

Look - the reason Hamas is attacking Israel is not because they want Gaza and the West Bank to be left alone. The reason they are attacking Israel is because they think Israel should be part of a Palestinian state.

That is the problem.

The problem is is that the dominant force in the region commits war crimes and flouts UN resolutions and is slaughtering and greatly oppressing the Palestinians. Israel is the only one in a position to offer a solution. So far their only solution is to kill thousands of women and children. Fucking barbaric cunts. And fuck you and anyone else who apologises for such inhumane and evil cunts.

[pErvinalia]

Over and out.

[cronus]

Palestinians could stop mooning the giant...worth a try. I don't think they've tried that strategy yet?