An independent Scotland?

[Feck]

An "independent" Scotland would still need to keep sweet with England, considering that is where 60% of their exports go. We love shortbread in England.

An independent Scotland should open 'coffee shops' like Holland ...Every weekend every penny of disposable income north of Birmingham would be spent North of the border Throw in Legalised prostitution and the southerners will be up here too .

[Red Celt]

But If Scotland gets independence, it must apply to join the EU as a new country

That isn't true. Be wary of where you get your propaganda from. As an existing member, Scotland is already within the EU.

[Feck]

Even if Scotland had to Reapply so what ?

[klr]

But If Scotland gets independence, it must apply to join the EU as a new country

That isn't true. Be wary of where you get your propaganda from. As an existing member, Scotland is already within the EU.

That is not the way the EU works. An independent Scotland will not automatically remain in the EU. Either it will have to apply as a new country in the normal fashion, or it may be allowed to join in short order if the member states unanimously agree. "If" being the operative word, as it would almost certainly become a political football with some member states looking to get something back for themselves. It has ever been thus with EU politics.

By the same token, a Scotland-less UK will probably have to renegotiate its terms of membership, which is going to please certain people in England. How many of these would not be best pleased by Scottish independence is another matter.

[Red Celt]

But If Scotland gets independence, it must apply to join the EU as a new country

That isn't true. Be wary of where you get your propaganda from. As an existing member, Scotland is already within the EU.

That is not the way the EU works. An independent Scotland will not automatically remain in the EU.

Can you state the law/rules about that? I saw an EU official making a statement to the opposite... and (sorry) but (on that issue) I trust him more than you.

Scotland already is in the EU. The UK is effectively a country of countries. Scottish independence would mean that a member of the EU has had a level of governance removed. There would be no need whatsoever to re-apply. That claim has only been made by the pro-unionists... and nobody else.

[klr]

But If Scotland gets independence, it must apply to join the EU as a new country

That isn't true. Be wary of where you get your propaganda from. As an existing member, Scotland is already within the EU.

That is not the way the EU works. An independent Scotland will not automatically remain in the EU.

Can you state the law/rules about that? I saw an EU official making a statement to the opposite... and (sorry) but (on that issue) I trust him more than you.

Scotland already is in the EU. The UK is effectively a country of countries. Scottish independence would mean that a member of the EU has had a level of governance removed. There would be no need whatsoever to re-apply. That claim has only been made by the pro-unionists... and nobody else.

I'm Irish, and I don't have a horse in this race, despite my scepticism about Salmond's strategy.

I trust the preponderance of commentary and statements from EU officials, lawyers, and experienced pundits that I've heard over the years. As an Irish person, I am much more focused on the EU as an average British person would be. The EU affects us a lot more, for good or ill.

[Svartalf]

But If Scotland gets independence, it must apply to join the EU as a new country

That isn't true. Be wary of where you get your propaganda from. As an existing member, Scotland is already within the EU.

That is not the way the EU works. An independent Scotland will not automatically remain in the EU.

Can you state the law/rules about that? I saw an EU official making a statement to the opposite... and (sorry) but (on that issue) I trust him more than you.

Scotland already is in the EU. The UK is effectively a country of countries. Scottish independence would mean that a member of the EU has had a level of governance removed. There would be no need whatsoever to re-apply. That claim has only been made by the pro-unionists... and nobody else.

Simple : the EU does NOT have a member state called Scotland, since currently Scotland is an integral part of the UK.
Getting out of the UK means Scotland also gets out of the EU, until it is assessed to fulfill the criteria for membership, at least, and is accepted by all the rest.

[klr]

But If Scotland gets independence, it must apply to join the EU as a new country

That isn't true. Be wary of where you get your propaganda from. As an existing member, Scotland is already within the EU.

That is not the way the EU works. An independent Scotland will not automatically remain in the EU.

Can you state the law/rules about that? I saw an EU official making a statement to the opposite... and (sorry) but (on that issue) I trust him more than you.

Scotland already is in the EU. The UK is effectively a country of countries. Scottish independence would mean that a member of the EU has had a level of governance removed. There would be no need whatsoever to re-apply. That claim has only been made by the pro-unionists... and nobody else.

Simple : the EU does NOT have a member state called Scotland, since currently Scotland is an integral part of the UK.
Getting out of the UK means Scotland also gets out of the EU, until it is assessed to fulfill the criteria for membership, at least, and is accepted by all the rest.

Indeed, and that includes having all the details about voting rights, commissioners, laws, financing, etc. worked out and signed off on. Rome was not built in a day.

[redunderthebed]

After seeing spain portugal and greece and ireland brought to its knees because of the EU and its capitalist cronies does scotland really want to be apart of the EU or the Eurozone?.

[Red Celt]

After seeing spain portugal and greece and ireland brought to its knees because of the EU and its capitalist cronies does scotland really want to be apart of the EU or the Eurozone?.

The EU and the Euro are not the same thing.

[Red Celt]

Simple : the EU does NOT have a member state called Scotland, since currently Scotland is an integral part of the UK.
Getting out of the UK means Scotland also gets out of the EU, until it is assessed to fulfill the criteria for membership, at least, and is accepted by all the rest.

Can you quote some laws or something?

[klr]

Simple : the EU does NOT have a member state called Scotland, since currently Scotland is an integral part of the UK.
Getting out of the UK means Scotland also gets out of the EU, until it is assessed to fulfill the criteria for membership, at least, and is accepted by all the rest.

Can you quote some laws or something?

EU law, by its nature, is pretty verbose. But the President of the EU has had his say:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... rship.html

[Rum]

It is a a bit of a blow to the SNP, but it is logical after all. New democracy with new rules, new economics and tax system. Unproven human rights record (as an independent nation)..and so on. Of course they should have to apply.

One more hurdle for the YES campaign!

[Horwood Beer-Master]

...I do not trust the SNP .Still After independence they would be no SNP surely

Riiiight. Just like after the fall of apartheid there was no ANC.

Oh wait...

...If Scotland were to split the union, then 100% of the oil and gas in Scotland's waters would be Scottish...

100% of very nearly bugger-all is very nearly bugger-all.

The oil (except on the Norwegian side) is nearly out. It's only Hugo Salmond who's desperate to convince people otherwise.

...By the same token, a Scotland-less UK will probably have to renegotiate its terms of membership, which is going to please certain people in England. How many of these would not be best pleased by Scottish independence is another matter.

The kind of people you're talking about would be far more pissed off with Scotland negotiating itself some kind of "have cake and eat it" arrangement than they would with full Scottish independence.

...Losing Scotland would mean that the Conservatives have a better chance of winning a Westminster election...

At first this may be true. However I suspect the prospect of perpetual Tory government would serve to drastically ramp-up Labour support within England.
Hell, it would serve to drastically ramp-up Labour support within the sodding Cotswolds!

I reckon an independent Scotland stands a much better chance of having the same government in power in perpetuity. Certainly that's what Alex Chávez is banking on.

...It's the standard line of the the SNP that Scotland's woes are a result of being governed from London...

Whilst I feel the people of Scotland may be unpleasantly surprised at how not dissimilar the experience of being ruled by selfish incompetent pricks in Edinburgh is from the the experience of being ruled by selfish incompetent pricks in Westminster; I nonetheless have a certain degree of sympathy here; in that I believe many of England's woes are a result of being governed from fucking London.

[Svartalf]

Simple : the EU does NOT have a member state called Scotland, since currently Scotland is an integral part of the UK.
Getting out of the UK means Scotland also gets out of the EU, until it is assessed to fulfill the criteria for membership, at least, and is accepted by all the rest.

Can you quote some laws or something?

Do you have some evidence that a new entity without credentials arising from Balkanisation of a EU state would be a de facto member from day one? At best, once the independence is voted, you can arrange with the UK so that you have time to make sure all your laws, institutions and whatnot are in conformity and verified when you're let go, but you bet that if Bulgaria is afraid you're gonna siphon off THEIR developmenet funds, you're gonnat get to wait years at the door.

and if I could quote treaty and law, I'd be in Brussels, not Paris.