An independent Scotland?

[klr]

They want to stay with the Bank of England at the moment. Cake and eat it etc..

Exactly.

It will be interesting to see what happens if the Euro situation improves over the next couple of years. The logical move for the SNP would then be to propose to the Euro as the preferred currency of an independent Scotland, neatly solving the whole EU business. But I wonder if a lot of Scottish people just can't let the Pound Sterling go.

[John_fi_Skye]

In a lot of ways, a lot of the people north of the border feel pretty different from our friends in the south. For one thing, though there is the full spectrum of opinion, the vote in general elections in Scotland tends to be more to the left, and yet an awful lot of the time we're governed by right-wing Westminster governments, because the English vote tends to be further to the right. Being ruled by those we vote for will likely mean having a government that's more to the left, and it seems that will suit more Scots than having governments led by Tories - or, for that matter, pseudo-Tories like Blair.

The other thing is that independence would hopefully reduce the number of layers of government. At present in Scotland, we're all governed by four layers of government, and I'm totally at a loss to explain why we need so many. So, here in Highland, I'm governed by Highland Council in Inverness, by the Scottish Government in Edinburgh, by the Westminster government in London, and - now we're all in the developing United States of Europe - by Brussels. It's completely fucking mad. Because democracy's a good thing, we're just getting ridiculous amounts of it. Just think how many more hospitals we could have if we didn't have even one of those layers. So, dump Westminster.

Unless things change greatly in the next two years, or my inchoate dementia gallops on apace, I'll be voting "yes" in the referendum. Yes to looking after ourselves the way lots of countries do that are the same size and smaller; yes to seeing an end forever to privileged Old Etonians ruling people here of whose lives they've no understanding; yes to making better use of finite resources, with less money going on politicians, on their advisers, their under-secretaries, their spin-doctors, and their clerical support; and yes to having a legislature whose members are more in tune with the political predisposition of the electorate here.

[Horwood Beer-Master]

...They have always had equal representation in Parliament...

More than equal actually; measured by number of MPs relative to population.

[ronmcd]

In a lot of ways, a lot of the people north of the border feel pretty different from our friends in the south. For one thing, though there is the full spectrum of opinion, the vote in general elections in Scotland tends to be more to the left, and yet an awful lot of the time we're governed by right-wing Westminster governments, because the English vote tends to be further to the right. Being ruled by those we vote for will likely mean having a government that's more to the left, and it seems that will suit more Scots than having governments led by Tories - or, for that matter, pseudo-Tories like Blair.

The other thing is that independence would hopefully reduce the number of layers of government. At present in Scotland, we're all governed by four layers of government, and I'm totally at a loss to explain why we need so many. So, here in Highland, I'm governed by Highland Council in Inverness, by the Scottish Government in Edinburgh, by the Westminster government in London, and - now we're all in the developing United States of Europe - by Brussels. It's completely fucking mad. Because democracy's a good thing, we're just getting ridiculous amounts of it. Just think how many more hospitals we could have if we didn't have even one of those layers. So, dump Westminster.

Unless things change greatly in the next two years, or my inchoate dementia gallops on apace, I'll be voting "yes" in the referendum. Yes to looking after ourselves the way lots of countries do that are the same size and smaller; yes to seeing an end forever to privileged Old Etonians ruling people here of whose lives they've no understanding; yes to making better use of finite resources, with less money going on politicians, on their advisers, their under-secretaries, their spin-doctors, and their clerical support; and yes to having a legislature whose members are more in tune with the political predisposition of the electorate here.

Beat me to it!

[ronmcd]

The SNP doesn't want an independent Scotland to join the Euro, given its current troubles. But If Scotland gets independence, it must apply to join the EU as a new country, and it will have to use the Euro. It's a condition for any new country joining the EU. The SNP wants to retain the pound Sterling - have a fiscal union with what's left of the UK. That's an odd position for a party looking for independence. All in all, a right mess.

My understanding is this - a new accession state(*) in theory is agreeing to adopt the Euro at some point. But you cant adopt the Euro unless you first join the ERM Exchange Rate Mechanism, it controls convergence of economies prior to joining. And there is no REQUIREMENT to join the ERM!

So you are not forced to join the Euro.

Also, the Euro is hardly looking to expand within the next few years. Probably the opposite. So it's a red herring.


(*)and would Scotland even be a new accession state? I'm not sure there is any facility to expel a current EU member, and it's citizens, from the EU.

[Ian]

Has anybody mentioned that a good reason for the Scots' agreement with a 2014 referendum is because that will be the 700th anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn?

[Clinton Huxley]

Stay with the Union or be ruled from Berlin. That's the choice, Scotland.

[JimC]

What will happen to the Scottish regiments?

Be the backbone of a Scottish Army, I suppose...

Dividing up the Navy will be interesting...

[Clinton Huxley]

Re John-Fi, above. I guarantee that Scotland will not get one more hospital as a result of saving money by having one fewer layer of Government. I expect the expenditure of the new Scottish govt will expand to more than cover any money saved there. No doubt that oaf Salmond is already reading the brochures for top of the range armoured Mercedes.

[Clinton Huxley]

Stay with the Union or be ruled from Berlin. That's the choice, Scotland.

With 8% of the UKs populatio , I guess they get about half an Astute class sub.

[John_fi_Skye]

Stay with the Union or be ruled from Berlin. That's the choice, Scotland.

With 8% of the UKs populatio , I guess they get about half an Astute class sub.

It can be sold for scrap, then. Buy a couple of defibrillators.

[JimC]

Stay with the Union or be ruled from Berlin. That's the choice, Scotland.

With 8% of the UKs populatio , I guess they get about half an Astute class sub.

It can be sold for scrap, then. Buy a couple of defibrillators.

Good luck in repelling a new Danish invasion, then...

The Winged Hats will land...

(who will get the reference...?)

[JimC]

Stay with the Union or be ruled from Berlin. That's the choice, Scotland.

With 8% of the UKs populatio , I guess they get about half an Astute class sub.

Does the populatio enjoy fellatio?

[Rum]

In a lot of ways, a lot of the people north of the border feel pretty different from our friends in the south. For one thing, though there is the full spectrum of opinion, the vote in general elections in Scotland tends to be more to the left, and yet an awful lot of the time we're governed by right-wing Westminster governments, because the English vote tends to be further to the right. Being ruled by those we vote for will likely mean having a government that's more to the left, and it seems that will suit more Scots than having governments led by Tories - or, for that matter, pseudo-Tories like Blair.

The other thing is that independence would hopefully reduce the number of layers of government. At present in Scotland, we're all governed by four layers of government, and I'm totally at a loss to explain why we need so many. So, here in Highland, I'm governed by Highland Council in Inverness, by the Scottish Government in Edinburgh, by the Westminster government in London, and - now we're all in the developing United States of Europe - by Brussels. It's completely fucking mad. Because democracy's a good thing, we're just getting ridiculous amounts of it. Just think how many more hospitals we could have if we didn't have even one of those layers. So, dump Westminster.

Unless things change greatly in the next two years, or my inchoate dementia gallops on apace, I'll be voting "yes" in the referendum. Yes to looking after ourselves the way lots of countries do that are the same size and smaller; yes to seeing an end forever to privileged Old Etonians ruling people here of whose lives they've no understanding; yes to making better use of finite resources, with less money going on politicians, on their advisers, their under-secretaries, their spin-doctors, and their clerical support; and yes to having a legislature whose members are more in tune with the political predisposition of the electorate here.

Do you mind if England joins you?

[John_fi_Skye]

In a lot of ways, a lot of the people north of the border feel pretty different from our friends in the south. For one thing, though there is the full spectrum of opinion, the vote in general elections in Scotland tends to be more to the left, and yet an awful lot of the time we're governed by right-wing Westminster governments, because the English vote tends to be further to the right. Being ruled by those we vote for will likely mean having a government that's more to the left, and it seems that will suit more Scots than having governments led by Tories - or, for that matter, pseudo-Tories like Blair.

The other thing is that independence would hopefully reduce the number of layers of government. At present in Scotland, we're all governed by four layers of government, and I'm totally at a loss to explain why we need so many. So, here in Highland, I'm governed by Highland Council in Inverness, by the Scottish Government in Edinburgh, by the Westminster government in London, and - now we're all in the developing United States of Europe - by Brussels. It's completely fucking mad. Because democracy's a good thing, we're just getting ridiculous amounts of it. Just think how many more hospitals we could have if we didn't have even one of those layers. So, dump Westminster.

Unless things change greatly in the next two years, or my inchoate dementia gallops on apace, I'll be voting "yes" in the referendum. Yes to looking after ourselves the way lots of countries do that are the same size and smaller; yes to seeing an end forever to privileged Old Etonians ruling people here of whose lives they've no understanding; yes to making better use of finite resources, with less money going on politicians, on their advisers, their under-secretaries, their spin-doctors, and their clerical support; and yes to having a legislature whose members are more in tune with the political predisposition of the electorate here.

Do you mind if England joins you?

If only. For years, in the Foot and Kinnock times, I argued that independence wasn't the way: that the Labour Party just needed to move a bit to the right, get elected, and then implement the sort of policies we were hoping for. They did indeed move to the right, and we got Oor Tony. No, I've now come to the view that it has to be separation.

Those who wish to avoid the new, forever-Tory England (as it will be, without the English Labour Party getting supported by the Scottish vote) is welcome to emigrate north.