Unarmed teen shooting: the debate rages on...

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Let me know who wins this thread.

[amused]

Let me know who wins this thread.

I already won it, 'they' just won't admit it.

[Coito ergo sum]

Profiling is when you take general characteristics to determine likely suspects, irrespective of their behavior or specific facts related to that specific person -- profiling is like saying that the profile of a serial killer is a white, middle-aged, male, etc. That's profiling. Seeing someone walking around oddly in the rain, looking at houses, and looking like he's on drugs, and calling 911 because his behavior makes you suspicious is not profiling. By definition

pro·fil·ing  /ˈproʊfaɪlɪŋ/ Show Spelled[proh-fahy-ling] Show IPA
noun
the use of specific characteristics, as race or age, to make generalizations about a person, as whether he or she may be engaged in illegal activity.

Right, kiki. And the definition of profiling shows "race or age" as examples. You said it wasn't race. So what the fuck was he profiled with? Age? Weight? Height? Hat size? Shoe size?

You said that judging Martin's behavior as suspicious was profiling. It's not. FFS. It would be profiling if Zimmerman "used specific characteristics, as race or age, to make generalizations about a person, as whether he or she may be engaged in illegal activity." Thus, it is not profiling to judge Martin as suspicious because he looks like he's on drugs, is walking around strangely in the rain and looking at houses in a suspicious manner. You've proved my point.

[Coito ergo sum]

So "we dont need no stinking badges" ?

To look out for one's neighborhood and report suspicious behavior? Of course not.

[kiki5711]

It would be profiling if Zimmerman "used specific characteristics, as race or age, to make generalizations about a person, as whether he or she may be engaged in illegal activity."

Thus, it is not profiling to judge Martin as suspicious because he looks like he's on drugs, is walking around strangely in the rain and looking at houses in a suspicious manner

when he was describing martin and his behavior to the dispatcher he was profiling him.

[Coito ergo sum]

It would be profiling if Zimmerman "used specific characteristics, as race or age, to make generalizations about a person, as whether he or she may be engaged in illegal activity."

Thus, it is not profiling to judge Martin as suspicious because he looks like he's on drugs, is walking around strangely in the rain and looking at houses in a suspicious manner

when he was describing martin and his behavior to the dispatcher he was profiling him.

LOL -- no, he wasn't. Describing Martin and Martin's behavior to a dispatcher does not qualify as profiling -- you posted the definition -- he was not using specific characteristics, as race or age, to make generalizations about a person, as whether he or she may be engaged in illegal activity.

Describing what Martin was doing is not "profiling" him. I mean, this is just basic English, kiki. Are you fucking with me?

And, when the dispatcher ASKS Z to describe M, when he says "is he white, black, or what?" and, Zimmerman answers, that's answering the dispatcher's question, not "profiling" M.

[kiki5711]

Actually I agree with you now that I think about it. Zimm was plainly judging martin with his own prejudice eyes and paranoia.

He is in no way "professional" enough to "profile".

[Coito ergo sum]

Actually I agree with you now that I think about it. Zimm was plainly judging martin with his own prejudice eyes and paranoia.

He is in no way "professional" enough to "profile".

LOL -- you're a piece of work.

Maybe he was judging Martin with his prejudice and paranoia. Who knows? He could also have been accurately reporting what he saw.

Let's say it was prejudice and paranoia. How does that relate to your view that Zimmerman did not act in self defense?

[kiki5711]

He could also have been accurately reporting what he saw.

sometimes two people can be looking at something, an event, a person etc...and get a completely different opinion.
Why do you think that is.

How does that relate to your view that Zimmerman did not act in self defense?

It doesn't. The killing came later.

[Coito ergo sum]

He could also have been accurately reporting what he saw.

sometimes two people can be looking at something, an event, a person etc...and get a completely different opinion.
Why do you think that is.

Many reasons --- eyesight -- cognitive ability -- etc.

It can also be prejudice, which is reflected, by way of example, in your opinions expressed here. You have a knee-jerk prejudice against Zimmerman, which is quite obvious.

As I said, he may have been prejudiced, he may have been accurately reporting. We don't know. Although you assume it's prejudice and paranoia, although you don't have any evidence to support that. Your own prejudice comes through loud and clear there.

How does that relate to your view that Zimmerman did not act in self defense?

It doesn't. The killing came later.

Sure did. So, now that we've dispatched the argument that Zimmerman being suspicious of Martin from the things that cause you conclude that he wasn't acting in self defense...what does cause you to believe that? Other than things like "he was ordered to stay in his truck" (cuz he wasn't) and "he attacked Martin" (because you can't know that). ...

[kiki5711]

As I said, he may have been prejudiced, he may have been accurately reporting. We don't know

And yet you believe zimms perception, at least according to your posts.

So, now that we've dispatched the argument that Zimmerman being suspicious of Martin from the things that cause you conclude that he wasn't acting in self defense...what does cause you to believe that? Other than things like "he was ordered to stay in his truck" (cuz he wasn't) and "he attacked Martin" (because you can't know that). ...

This is a mix match of words that were used in different posts for different reasons and different stages of information, and cannot be used now as an argument.

[Coito ergo sum]

As I said, he may have been prejudiced, he may have been accurately reporting. We don't know

And yet you believe zimms perception, at least according to your posts.

Only if you don't read my posts. I've said he may be prejudiced and paranoid OR he may be reporting accurately. I don't know. I only know what he said to the 911 officer. The key point though is that that is all YOU know too. Right? So your constant haranguing about how he was predjudiced, paranoid and a psycho is just stuff you make up without knowing anything could rationally lead you to believe it.

So, now that we've dispatched the argument that Zimmerman being suspicious of Martin from the things that cause you conclude that he wasn't acting in self defense...what does cause you to believe that? Other than things like "he was ordered to stay in his truck" (cuz he wasn't) and "he attacked Martin" (because you can't know that). ...

This is a mix match of words that were used in different posts for different reasons and different stages of information, and cannot be used now as an argument.

I didn't make an argument there. I asked you a question.

What does cause you to believe that Zimmerman wasn't acting in self defense?

That's not an argument. It's a question.

[kiki5711]

I've said he may be prejudiced and paranoid OR he may be reporting accurately. I don't know. I only know what he said to the 911 officer. The key point though is that that is all YOU know too. Right?

You've never said that, until after I said it. And if that is the case, as you say that he might have been prejudiced and paranoid, then his version of (supposedly) reporting accurately may not be accurate at all, or at least swung towards his favor.

As I said. Regarding the other paragraph. You took words that were out of sinc and I can't answer based on that kind of line of questioning.

[tattuchu]

Kiki, is English not your primary language? I'm not being sarcastic. I remember you saying a while back that you weren't from this country? If my hazy recollection is correct, this may explain a lot.

[Seth]

I already stated, a hunch. Anyone who patrols for no pay, untrained but armed, is a gun nut in my book. We collect taxes for running a police unit. Keep a gun if the police are too far from you.

The police are ALWAYS too far from you, given the fact that when some thug attacks you don't have six minutes to wait for the police to show up (on average), you don't have 60 second to react to save your life, you're lucky if you have six seconds.

It's incredibly rare that the police are on scene and able to act to prevent a victim from being harmed by an armed criminal.

That's WHY I carry a gun, because the police aren't going to be there, just as they weren't there when Martin attacked Zimmerman.