Conscription: State sponsored slavery?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I think he was joking.

Tongue in cheek, yes, but with an underlying point: we're all speculating here.

You are right that the Germans didn't like the imposed political system much. But the fact that von Hindenburg was Prezzy for so many years says it all, I think. The Germans approved of him and his monarchist attitudes. He was contemptuous of the democracy that put him in power.

Germany never had a democracy, ever, before Weimar. The Versailles Treaty torpedoed (sorry) any chance of the republic succeeding, but (West) Germany became one with alacrity after the Marshall Plan. I still contend that the Weimar Republic would have stood an excellent chance of warding off would-be dictatorships, fascist, communist or monarchist alike, and notwithstanding Hindenburg's presidency, if Wilson had prevailed over Clemenceau. [/high speculation]

We're speculating here.

How would they have dealt with the various veterans' armies?

[MrJonno]

No democracy can function in a failing economy for long, it can function in a poor but improving one (India) but not one that is going down hill for long.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

No democracy can function in a failing economy for long, it can function in a poor but improving one (India) but not one that is going down hill for long.

US, Great Depression.

[Hermit]

We're speculating here.

How would they have dealt with the various veterans' armies?

They would have withered on the vine just like irregular right wing militias eventually in other countries have when circumstances changed. People don't tend to throw up barricades and mount them when they can lead a comfortable life at home with their family.

[MrJonno]

No democracy can function in a failing economy for long, it can function in a poor but improving one (India) but not one that is going down hill for long.

US, Great Depression.

Which is why is was dealt with pretty drastically in a mini-revolution in how society was run

[Gawdzilla Sama]

We're speculating here.

How would they have dealt with the various veterans' armies?

They would have withered on the vine just like irregular right wing militias eventually in other countries have when circumstances changed. People don't tend to throw up barricades and mount them when they can lead a comfortable life at home with their family.

You mean they'd go away, like the Communists?

[Hermit]

We're speculating here.

How would they have dealt with the various veterans' armies?

They would have withered on the vine just like irregular right wing militias eventually in other countries have when circumstances changed. People don't tend to throw up barricades and mount them when they can lead a comfortable life at home with their family.

You mean they'd go away, like the Communists?

Pretty much so, yes. When was the last time you heard of a major party calling for the nationalisation of the means of production or even activities by nutters akin to the Red Brigade?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

We're speculating here.

How would they have dealt with the various veterans' armies?

They would have withered on the vine just like irregular right wing militias eventually in other countries have when circumstances changed. People don't tend to throw up barricades and mount them when they can lead a comfortable life at home with their family.

You mean they'd go away, like the Communists?

Pretty much so, yes. When was the last time you heard of a major party calling for the nationalisation of the means of production or even activities by nutters akin to the Red Brigade?

Back to 1920s Germany, please.

[Hermit]

We're speculating here.

How would they have dealt with the various veterans' armies?

They would have withered on the vine just like irregular right wing militias eventually in other countries have when circumstances changed. People don't tend to throw up barricades and mount them when they can lead a comfortable life at home with their family.

You mean they'd go away, like the Communists?

Pretty much so, yes. When was the last time you heard of a major party calling for the nationalisation of the means of production or even activities by nutters akin to the Red Brigade?

Back to 1920s Germany, please.

The communists splintered, with the bulk turning right. The SDP was Germany's biggest pre-war party and Marxist. By 1914 it was so in name only. Not only had it abandoned revolutionary communism in favour of reformism, but it also voted in favour of Germany going to war. The split that followed, resulted in the formation of the KPD. Originally, the SPD stood for revolutionary Marxism. By the time of the November 1932 elections, however, it was essentially a bourgeois democratic party with a socialist hue instead of the revolutionary communism it started out with, and it got the second best result. In terms of votes: NSDAP: 11,737,395 SPD: 7,251,690 KPD: 5,980,614. During the 1920s "true" communism was definitely no longer the force it had been before the war.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Just one of the fringe groups that were not that much different from the NDSAP.

[Hermit]

Sorry. I don't get what you are angling at.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Sorry. I don't get what you are angling at.

I'm saying that the NDSAP got lucky in beating out all the other similar groups in gaining power. If it hadn't been them, it would have been a like-minded "party" that took over and eventually got the WWII ball rolling.

[Hermit]

Sorry. I don't get what you are angling at.

I'm saying that the NDSAP got lucky in beating out all the other similar groups in gaining power. If it hadn't been them, it would have been a like-minded "party" that took over and eventually got the WWII ball rolling.

Oh, I see now. And I agree. The Versailles Treaty pretty much assured such an outcome.

[Audley Strange]

Yes. I'm reading up on Rathnau of the Organisational Consul and his murder. Seems like one way or another Germany was heading for a bunch of extremists in charge. I don't think the economic situation helped, nor what was essentially a perception of moral ennui amongst the intelligentsia. However I maintain that it was only because the Nazis were so spectacularly crazy that we find so many people apologetic for the excesses of that war on the side of the victors. There are certain questions asked about things like Dresden and the dropping of the atomic bombs but usually we consider it a successful and necessary war.

Was it though?

I'm genuinely curious.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I think he was joking. You are right that the Germans didn't like the imposed political system much. But the fact that von Hindenburg was Prezzy for so many years says it all, I think. The Germans approved of him and his monarchist attitudes. He was contemptuous of the democracy that put him in power.

Heh, it wouldn't be the first time I've missed a subtlety.