Humans killed off Australia's giant beasts

[Ronja]

What I find telling is that the 'megafauna' die out in different continents and islands at different times, but always shortly after humans arrived. For example, in New Zealand the megafauna (multiple species of moa) died out only a thousand or less yeas ago, shortly after the Maori arrived. Interesting, there is one place where all the megafauna still thrive, Africa, where humans and the megafauna evolved together.

...and the African ones are the most easily spooked, enraged or just generally bitchy variants of their respective geni (sp?). For example, nobody in their right mind would try to domesticate a zebra - they're plain vicious.

In Australia, based on what I read on Wikipedia. the big predators were mostly reptiles - so neither their looks not their dangerous behavior resembled humans one bit. They likely hunted alone like similar species do today + moved fairly close to the ground on all fours. So the hypothesis that the herbivore megafauna could have been as unafraid and docile as the dodos does sound at least possible to me.

[klr]

What I find telling is that the 'megafauna' die out in different continents and islands at different times, but always shortly after humans arrived. For example, in New Zealand the megafauna (multiple species of moa) died out only a thousand or less yeas ago, shortly after the Maori arrived. Interesting, there is one place where all the megafauna still thrive, Africa, where humans and the megafauna evolved together.

...and the African ones are the most easily spooked, enraged or just generally bitchy variants of their respective geni (sp?). For example, nobody in their right mind would try to domesticate a zebra - they're plain vicious.

In Australia, based on what I read on Wikipedia. the big predators were mostly reptiles - so neither their looks not their dangerous behavior resembled humans one bit. They likely hunted alone like similar species do today + moved fairly close to the ground on all fours. So the hypothesis that the herbivore megafauna could have been as unafraid and docile as the dodos does sound at least possible to me.

Which is the point Jared Diamond makes in Guns, Germs and Steel, on why Africa never really managed to "get ahead" in terms of organised farming.

[JimC]

What I find telling is that the 'megafauna' die out in different continents and islands at different times, but always shortly after humans arrived. For example, in New Zealand the megafauna (multiple species of moa) died out only a thousand or less yeas ago, shortly after the Maori arrived. Interesting, there is one place where all the megafauna still thrive, Africa, where humans and the megafauna evolved together.

I agree 100% - it is telling indeed...

[Clinton Huxley]

Don't give the African megafauna much hope of surviving another 100 years.....

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Don't give the African megafauna much hope of surviving another 100 years.....

Some will struggle on, but probably not in Africa and with a very reduced gene pool. I live with this every day I go to the Center.

[Clinton Huxley]

Don't give the African megafauna much hope of surviving another 100 years.....

Some will struggle on, but probably not in Africa and with a very reduced gene pool. I live with this every day I go to the Center.

No more elephants in the wild. Sad.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Don't give the African megafauna much hope of surviving another 100 years.....

Some will struggle on, but probably not in Africa and with a very reduced gene pool. I live with this every day I go to the Center.

No more elephants in the wild. Sad.

No more wild. Sad.

[shiner]

Shiner

Our scientific tools are better than that.
We can pick up major climate changes no trouble at all. And the time of the extinctions was a time of minimal, if any, climate change. Since those large beasties had lived through 9 glacial and interglacial periods, we can assume they are not that sensitive to climate change.

That was kind of my point…We can't really know.
I'm not doubting science just pointing out, ancient history is assumptions. Granted, well supported with evidence, but we don't know (can't) exactly what happened.
"We can assume".

[Tyrannical]

What I find telling is that the 'megafauna' die out in different continents and islands at different times, but always shortly after humans arrived. For example, in New Zealand the megafauna (multiple species of moa) died out only a thousand or less yeas ago, shortly after the Maori arrived. Interesting, there is one place where all the megafauna still thrive, Africa, where humans and the megafauna evolved together.

One theory is that before the introduction of guns, Africans were not capable of hunting megafauna into extinction. The only reason they aren't extinct now is because of human intervention such as game preserves and laws.

The other theory is that megafauna extinction was primarily climate related and that Africa was spared the radical climate change thus saving it's megafauna. The climate change opened new areas for human colonization and that these newly encountered megafauna species were already severely stressed.

[Tyrannical]

What I find telling is that the 'megafauna' die out in different continents and islands at different times, but always shortly after humans arrived. For example, in New Zealand the megafauna (multiple species of moa) died out only a thousand or less yeas ago, shortly after the Maori arrived. Interesting, there is one place where all the megafauna still thrive, Africa, where humans and the megafauna evolved together.

...and the African ones are the most easily spooked, enraged or just generally bitchy variants of their respective geni (sp?). For example, nobody in their right mind would try to domesticate a zebra - they're plain vicious.

In Australia, based on what I read on Wikipedia. the big predators were mostly reptiles - so neither their looks not their dangerous behavior resembled humans one bit. They likely hunted alone like similar species do today + moved fairly close to the ground on all fours. So the hypothesis that the herbivore megafauna could have been as unafraid and docile as the dodos does sound at least possible to me.

Which is the point Jared Diamond makes in Guns, Germs and Steel, on why Africa never really managed to "get ahead" in terms of organised farming.

Diamond was a simpleton race apologist. The most parsimonious answer is some races were less intelligent, though the reason why some races evolved less intelligence is up for debate, though I suspect it is just natural selection at work. Some environments required more intelligence to survive, so the group average as a whole rose as the least intelligent members died off.

J.P. Rushton reviews Guns, Germs and Steel and points out all of Diamond's obvious errors.
http://www.lrainc.com/swtaboo/stalkers/jpr_ggs.html

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I think any "race" could go stupid in the right environment.

[Tyrannical]

I think any "race" could go stupid in the right environment.

I'd correct it by saying that any race could fail to evolve a high average intelligence due to environmental factors. However, this being 2012 we have all the scientific evidence needed to evaluate racial groups on intelligence factors. The fact is, some racial groups evolved significantly higher levels of intelligence than other groups. While IQ tests may not be the most accurate measurement, cultural "mile stones" could be.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I think any "race" could go stupid in the right environment.

I'd correct it by saying that any race could fail to evolve a high average intelligence due to environmental factors. However, this being 2012 we have all the scientific evidence needed to evaluate racial groups on intelligence factors. The fact is, some racial groups evolved significantly higher levels of intelligence than other groups. While IQ tests may not be the most accurate measurement, cultural "mile stones" could be.

Not my point. Tropical climes instill a lassitude in people regardless of their race.

[mistermack]

I think any "race" could go stupid in the right environment.

I'd correct it by saying that any race could fail to evolve a high average intelligence due to environmental factors. However, this being 2012 we have all the scientific evidence needed to evaluate racial groups on intelligence factors. The fact is, some racial groups evolved significantly higher levels of intelligence than other groups. While IQ tests may not be the most accurate measurement, cultural "mile stones" could be.

On that basis, black people have the fastest growing intelligence in the world.
Not only are their measured IQ levels rising extremely quickly, their position in society is rising all the time.
Absolute proof that their intelligence levels are soaring.

Don't laugh, but I wouldn't be surprised if one got elected president of the US one day!