US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

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US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Gawd » Sat Nov 26, 2011 7:41 pm

Pakistan demands U.S. vacate air base within 15 days
Demand issued Saturday after NATO helicopters and jet fighters allegedly attacked two Pakistan army posts along the Afghan border, killing 24 Pakistani soldiers.

The Pakistani government has demanded the U.S. vacate an air base within 15 days that the CIA is suspected of using for unmanned drones.

The government issued the demand Saturday after NATO helicopters and jet fighters allegedly attacked two Pakistan army posts along the Afghan border, killing 24 Pakistani soldiers.

Islamabad outlined the demand in a statement it sent to reporters following an emergency defense committee meeting chaired by Pakistani Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani.

Shamsi Air Base is located in southwestern Baluchistan province. The U.S. is suspected of using the facility in the past to launch armed drones and observation aircraft to keep pressure on Taliban and al-Qaida militants in Pakistan's tribal region.

The attack is the worst single incident of its kind since Pakistan uneasily allied itself with Washington in the days immediately following the Sept 11, 2001 attacks on U.S. targets
It comes as relations between the United States and Pakistan, its ally in the war on militancy, are already badly strained following the killing of al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden by U.S. special forces in a secret raid on the Pakistani garrison town of Abbottabad in May.

Pakistan called that raid a flagrant violation of its sovereignty.

The Foreign Office equally condemned Saturday's attack.

"Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani has condemned in the strongest terms the NATO/ISAF attack on the Pakistani post," ministry spokeswoman Tehmina Janjua said in a statement.

.....

Two military officials said that up to 28 troops had been killed and 11 wounded in the attack on the Salala checkpoint, about 2.5 km (1.5 miles) from the Afghan border.

The attack took place around 2 a.m. (2100 GMT) in the Baizai area of Mohmand, where Pakistani troops are fighting Taliban militants.

A senior Pakistani military officer said efforts were under way to bring the bodies of the slain soldiers to Ghalanai, the headquarters of Mohmand tribal region.

"The latest attack by NATO forces on our post will have serious repercussions as they without any reasons attacked on our post and killed soldiers asleep," he said, requesting
anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media.

......
The US can shove it up their own ass.
http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east ... s-1.397885

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Seth » Sat Nov 26, 2011 10:53 pm

My guess is that the Pakis were Al Quaeda sympathizers (or actual members) and were firing on NATO troops from the base, which under the ROE justifies retaliatory force.

Fuck the Pakis, they hardly have clean hands in this mess, so when they shoot at us, they get what they deserve.
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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Gawd » Sat Nov 26, 2011 10:55 pm

Sure, Seth. The sleeping Pakistani's were magically firing non-existent bullets at drones in the middle of the night while wearing their PJs.

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Seth » Sat Nov 26, 2011 10:58 pm

Gawd wrote:Sure, Seth. The sleeping Pakistani's were magically firing non-existent bullets at drones in the middle of the night while wearing their PJs.
We have only their word they were sleeping, and they are know liars, so I'll await some more credible investigatory results than your bigotry.
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"All that is required for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke

"Those who support denying anyone the right to keep and bear arms for personal defense are fully complicit in every crime that might have been prevented had the victim been effectively armed." Seth

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Gawd » Sat Nov 26, 2011 11:02 pm

Seth wrote:
Gawd wrote:Sure, Seth. The sleeping Pakistani's were magically firing non-existent bullets at drones in the middle of the night while wearing their PJs.
We have only their word they were sleeping, and they are know liars, so I'll await some more credible investigatory results than your bigotry.
Sure, Seth, "liars". Aren't you already embroiled in another thread about using that word? So these "liars" are within their own territory and in their own camp and just so happened to be shooting some wayward American troops, eh? Even with your "lies", that's self-defense by the sleeping Pakistani's who didn't even fire a single shot.

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Seth » Sun Nov 27, 2011 6:39 pm

Gawd wrote:
Seth wrote:
Gawd wrote:Sure, Seth. The sleeping Pakistani's were magically firing non-existent bullets at drones in the middle of the night while wearing their PJs.
We have only their word they were sleeping, and they are know liars, so I'll await some more credible investigatory results than your bigotry.
Sure, Seth, "liars".
Yup, magnitudinous liars.
Aren't you already embroiled in another thread about using that word?


Indeed, but not as it pertains to the Pakis.
So these "liars" are within their own territory and in their own camp and just so happened to be shooting some wayward American troops, eh?
Highly likely, since they've done it on numerous occasions before.
Even with your "lies", that's self-defense by the sleeping Pakistani's who didn't even fire a single shot.
Of course, you don't know that they were sleeping, or that the shooting was "self-defense." It was highly likely, based on prior events of the same kind, that they were sniping and shooting artillery at NATO troops on the Afghan side, which is why an airstrike was called. Unlike the Pakis, NATO does not generally send out random airstrikes (costing millions of dollars) in the night to bomb places they aren't receiving fire from or don't have credible intelligence the enemy is located at.

We have your analysis, and we have the truth. I'll reject your analysis in favor of the truth, thanks.
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"All that is required for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke

"Those who support denying anyone the right to keep and bear arms for personal defense are fully complicit in every crime that might have been prevented had the victim been effectively armed." Seth

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Gawd » Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:17 pm

Geez, Seth, you should synchronize your propaganda with your terrorist department:

Pakistan blocks NATO supply route to Afghanistan after raid kills 24
Pakistan called that raid a flagrant violation of its sovereignty.

The Foreign Office equally condemned Saturday's attack.

"Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani has condemned in the strongest terms the NATO/ISAF attack on the Pakistani post," ministry spokeswoman Tehmina Janjua said in a statement. "On his direction, the matter is being taken (up) by the foreign ministry in the strongest terms with NATO and the U.S."

In a statement released following the incident, U.S. envoy to Pakistan Cameron Munter said that he regretted "the loss of life of any Pakistani servicemen, and pledge that the United States will work closely with Pakistan to investigate this incident."

The commander of NATO-led forces in Afghanistan, General John R. Allen, said he had offered his condolences to the family of any Pakistani soldiers who "may have been killed or injured" during an "incident" on the border.
http://www.haaretz.com/news/internation ... 4-1.397806

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Seth » Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:28 pm

Gawd wrote:Geez, Seth, you should synchronize your propaganda with your terrorist department:

Pakistan blocks NATO supply route to Afghanistan after raid kills 24
Pakistan called that raid a flagrant violation of its sovereignty.

The Foreign Office equally condemned Saturday's attack.

"Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani has condemned in the strongest terms the NATO/ISAF attack on the Pakistani post," ministry spokeswoman Tehmina Janjua said in a statement. "On his direction, the matter is being taken (up) by the foreign ministry in the strongest terms with NATO and the U.S."

In a statement released following the incident, U.S. envoy to Pakistan Cameron Munter said that he regretted "the loss of life of any Pakistani servicemen, and pledge that the United States will work closely with Pakistan to investigate this incident."

The commander of NATO-led forces in Afghanistan, General John R. Allen, said he had offered his condolences to the family of any Pakistani soldiers who "may have been killed or injured" during an "incident" on the border.
Yeah, right. One-sided propaganda. As I suspected, NATO forces were receiving fire from Pakistan at the time the airstrike was ordered, according to the Wall Street Journal:
NATO and Afghan forces on a nighttime operation Saturday came under fire from across the Pakistan border before they called in a deadly airstrike on two Pakistani military posts, leaving U.S. relations with Pakistan in tatters, according to Afghan and Western officials' version of events...
Afghan and U.S. officials say their troops are increasingly facing fire from Pakistan's side of the border. Pakistan is angry over the increased incidence of cross-border raids by Afghan and NATO forces.

As U.S. military, Pakistani forces and Afghan officials sought to piece together the incident, three Afghan officials and one Western official said the attack took place in response to fire from the remote Pakistani posts in the Mohmand tribal region, a lawless border area that abuts Afghanistan's eastern Kunar province.

Two Afghan officials working in the border area where the attack took place said Sunday that the joint force was targeting Taliban forces in the area when it received fire from a Pakistan military outpost. That prompted the coalition force to call for an air attack on the Pakistani posts, said an Afghan Border Police official in the area. Pakistani officials were informed of the operation before it took place, he said....
"There was firing coming from the position against Afghan army soldiers who requested support and this is what happened," said a third Afghan official in Kabul, where Gen. Allen met with top government leaders for a special security meeting to discuss the incident. The Afghan official in Kabul said the government believes that the fire came from the Pakistan base—and not from insurgents operating nearby.

That view was bolstered by one Western official who discussed the attack with military officials in Kabul on Sunday.

"They were fired on from a Pakistani army base," the Western official in Kabul said. "It was a defensive action."

A U.S. official in Kabul said insurgents may have been firing into Afghanistan near the Pakistani border outpost Saturday morning, which prompted coalition forces to strike back. He pointed to an incident in September 2010, when a NATO helicopter fired on a Pakistan outpost, killing two soldiers.

"It was a situation where insurgent forces butted right up against a Pakistani border post and used that as a firing position. When we fired back, we hit Pakistani security forces. This is a possibility we're circulating here for Saturday's incident," the official said.

Military officials in Kabul said insurgents in Pakistan have also used empty Pakistan border bases to stage attacks, which may have been the working assumption of the coalition forces who called in the airstrike.

U.S. officials said the units believed they were responding to incoming fire from the Pakistan side of the border.

"They believed they were coming under attack from that side of the border," a senior U.S. official said, although investigators have yet to pinpoint the precise source of fire.
So, either Al Quaeda were bedded right up against the Paki post, and the Pakis ignored this fact and were tacitly allowing this to happen without contacting NATO and firing on the terrorists themselves, which they certainly had to be aware of, since sleeping during a firefight taking place on your perimeter or within a mile or two of it would be gross dereliction of duty on the part of the sentries, or the Pakis themselves were firing on NATO forces (highly likely), hoping their fire would be mistaken for Al Quaeda attacking and hoping that they would be immune from retaliation because they are Pakis.

In any event, it appears that the airstrike was justified because NATO forces were under attack from Pakistan.
"Seth is Grandmaster Zen Troll who trains his victims to troll themselves every time they think of him" Robert_S

"All that is required for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke

"Those who support denying anyone the right to keep and bear arms for personal defense are fully complicit in every crime that might have been prevented had the victim been effectively armed." Seth

© 2013/2014/2015/2016 Seth, all rights reserved. No reuse, republication, duplication, or derivative work is authorized.

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Schneibster » Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:35 am

Looks like the Pakistanis fired first.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 912964.cms
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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Schneibster » Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:57 am

Turns out there aren't any Americans at the base in Balochistan they've been ordered to vacate.

Oh, and we're still flying across their airspace and flying drone missions, too.

Just sayin'.
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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by JimC » Tue Nov 29, 2011 6:06 am

It would be absurd to allege that an airstrike was called on a cross-border position without any provocation.

What I suspect is Taliban insurgents getting close to a base full of sleeping (and probably incompetent) Pakistani militia, letting rip at an Afghan patrol, then bugging out before the inevitable airstrike. Win-win from their point of view...

Careless of allied forces, if that's the case; they should understand that possibility, and not push the automatic "retaliation by airstrike" button. If competent, they would have all Pakistani border posts plotted on their maps, and understand the political implications of their actions, instead of dancing to the Taliban's tune...
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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Schneibster » Tue Nov 29, 2011 6:22 am

They called the Pakistani command and they validated there were no soldiers in the vicinity.

Oopsie.
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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Gawd » Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:05 am

Schneibster wrote:They called the Pakistani command and they validated there were no soldiers in the vicinity.

Oopsie.
That's as believable as WMDs in Iraq. And I also suppose you believe in Sasquatch.

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Schneibster » Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:06 am

Gawd wrote:
Schneibster wrote:They called the Pakistani command and they validated there were no soldiers in the vicinity.

Oopsie.
That's as believable as WMDs in Iraq. And I also suppose you believe in Sasquatch.
Sasquatch != NATO.

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Re: US Murders 24 Sleeping Pakistani's, Maims Many Others

Post by Warren Dew » Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:14 am

Schneibster wrote:Looks like the Pakistanis fired first.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 912964.cms
Or at least, so the people who called in the air strike claim.

If Obama hadn't escalated the war in Afghanistan, we wouldn't be having these problems. It's ridiculous that we're even involved in that corner of the world any more.

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