Occupy Retailers!

[Coito ergo sum]

http://www.cnbc.com/id/45402815

Some demonstrators are planning to occupy retailers on Black Friday to protest "the business that are in the pockets of Wall Street."

Organizers are encouraging consumers to either occupy or boycott retailers that are publicly traded, according to the Stop Black Friday website.

The goal of the movement is to impact the profits of major corporations this holiday season.

That will get them arrested for sure.

[Svartalf]

Well, the movement seems to have evolved from the peaceful assembly to the 'actively seeking martyrs" stage.

[Coito ergo sum]

Well, the movement seems to have evolved from the peaceful assembly to the 'actively seeking martyrs" stage.

The goals of some of the more left-wing members of the group are not merely to correct some 1%-99% unfairness or disparity, but rather to end what they believe to be an inherently unfair capitalist system. However, what that means for the bulk of Americans, even most of the 99%, is a further reduction in standard of living, and that will be something the 99%-ers don't want. The 99%, for the most part, want things to be better for everyone. They aren't, in my view, after a situation where things get worse for everyone so that things can be equal. Equal misery is not what most people want.

[maiforpeace]

You better go shopping then CES, you might be mistaken for an OWS sympathizer.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/45402815

Some demonstrators are planning to occupy retailers on Black Friday to protest "the business that are in the pockets of Wall Street."

Organizers are encouraging consumers to either occupy or boycott retailers that are publicly traded, according to the Stop Black Friday website.

The goal of the movement is to impact the profits of major corporations this holiday season.

That will get them arrested for sure.

Well, the movement seems to have evolved from the peaceful assembly to the 'actively seeking martyrs" stage.

[Atheist-Lite]

They've been infiltrated by moast communists. They know the shops don't contain the 1% but rather those who are finding things a struggle and are desperate to save money at this time of year. They want to disrupt things so badly they are trampling on the very people they say they represent. What do you think would happen if they got any real power?

[PsychoSerenity]

...to end what they believe to be an inherently unfair capitalist system. However, what that means for the bulk of Americans, even most of the 99%, is a further reduction in standard of living,...

First, what do you mean by standard of living, and second, how do you know it would be reduced?

[Coito ergo sum]

You better go shopping then CES, you might be mistaken for an OWS sympathizer.

Nobody would mistake me for that.

But, I'm not much of a shopper. I have a certain minimalist tendency, and I don't feel that I need much. I much prefer to buy things for other people, so most of my "shopping" is limited to that sort of thing.

Me? I wear a pair of jeans until SWMBO'd refuses to let me go out in them. I put on a jacket the other day that I've owned for 15 years. Looks good still, actually. I can afford new everything, pretty much anytime.

I'm a northerner, born and raised, but this is more me than shopping:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4ujS1er1r0&ob=av3e[/youtube]

[Svartalf]

...to end what they believe to be an inherently unfair capitalist system. However, what that means for the bulk of Americans, even most of the 99%, is a further reduction in standard of living,...

First, what do you mean by standard of living, and second, how do you know it would be reduced?

Because he completely agrees with Seth on matters economical? [/slander]

[Coito ergo sum]

...to end what they believe to be an inherently unfair capitalist system. However, what that means for the bulk of Americans, even most of the 99%, is a further reduction in standard of living,...

First, what do you mean by standard of living, and second, how do you know it would be reduced?

"Standard of Living" (noun): The degree of wealth and material comfort available to a person or community.

I think that the standard of living for most people would be reduced if the far-leftists of the OWS movement got their way because:

1. That appears to be what they want, since they believe that western capitalist countries have exploited the rest of the world to develop their unfairly higher standard of living. They think that is unfair and that the west should not be better off than the rest of the world (South America, Africa, and most of Asia).

2. They voice a strong loathing for business and industry, and they want to increase the costs of doing business for most of them (including dramatically increasing taxes on them). Moreover, for industries like coal and oil, they want to put them out of business. Doing those sorts of things will dramatically increase the cost of heating people's homes and buying food, which will hit the poor and middle class folks much harder than the wealthy, and will result in a further reduction of discretionary income and a further reduction of standard of living. For most people, even the middle class, to raise electricity costs from $250 a month to $400 a month is a really big deal.

3. When I hear the OWS state that they want all college educations to be paid for out of federal taxes, and that everyone should be given a salary (even if they don't have a job), compel private lenders to refinance loans at 1% interest rates, and forgive all private debts (which those of the far left wing of the group are saying), it shows me that they aren't concerned about "fixing" a broken system, but rather they are looking to destroy a system they think is evil. The "system" they think should replace it is a system of centralized government control which tells every person how much they should make, how much they should pay for things, and otherwise controls most aspects of life such that everything is "fair and equal." That will, in my view, inevitably and inexorably produce a society that has a worse standard of living than the one we currently have in the US and western Europe. And, it the far left wants just that.

[Coito ergo sum]

...to end what they believe to be an inherently unfair capitalist system. However, what that means for the bulk of Americans, even most of the 99%, is a further reduction in standard of living,...

First, what do you mean by standard of living, and second, how do you know it would be reduced?

Because he completely agrees with Seth on matters economical? [/slander]

I don't think I do.

But, I run a business, so I know that if you raise my taxes by 25%, that's a big deal. And, I know that when I hire an employee, it's a big decision because contrary to popular belief, I have no access to a pool of money from which I can just soak up any additional costs and expenses.

It is no different than when you go to the store to buy beer. The higher the price of the beer, the less beer you can buy. The same is true for business. The higher the cost of doing business, the less business you can do. It's really that simple.

Somehow, some folks have gotten the idea that if you make people's taxes higher, it improves the economy. Like, somehow, taxes are economic stimulus. How that myth took hold, I have no idea.

[Geoff]

It is no different than when you go to the store to buy beer. The higher the price of the beer, the less beer food you can buy.

[Gallstones]

They've been infiltrated by moast communists. They know the shops don't contain the 1% but rather those who are finding things a struggle and are desperate to save money at this time of year. They want to disrupt things so badly they are trampling on the very people they say they represent. What do you think would happen if they got any real power?

Excellent point.

Real power? Socialism, or worse Sethialism.

[sandinista]

http://www.cnbc.com/id/45402815

Some demonstrators are planning to occupy retailers on Black Friday to protest "the business that are in the pockets of Wall Street."

Organizers are encouraging consumers to either occupy or boycott retailers that are publicly traded, according to the Stop Black Friday website.

The goal of the movement is to impact the profits of major corporations this holiday season.

That sounds like a step in the right direction. Boycotts are the best, most viable way of voting.

[maiforpeace]

The OWS in Santa Cruz are recommending to buy local.

[Ian]

Somehow, some folks have gotten the idea that if you make people's taxes higher, it improves the economy. Like, somehow, taxes are economic stimulus. How that myth took hold, I have no idea.

Ironically, the Tea Party can take some blame for this. They're the ones who have done the most to popularize a national hysteria over debt. Democrats don't like the idea of constantly running deficits either, but ultimately, their economics are Keynesian - they prefer an economy with high debt over one with high unemployment. The far right sees it the other way around. Sure, they want to close deficits with spending cuts only, but that isn't even close to realistic. People can differ on how best to draw down that debt, but bringing to popularity the goal of doing so -rather than the goal of bringing down unemployment- is something the far right has already done.