When is rape not rape?

[Atheist-Lite]

Gallstones

This qualifies as talking to yourself doesn't it?

[BrettA]

Geez... I've just scanned this thread and will get around to reading it later, but I'm stunned at some of the crap here. A dickhead Toronto cop recently gave out 'advice' about not dressing like a slut as a point to avoid rape and that in turn initiated a protest held last month called "SlutWalk Toronto". Since then there have been SlutWalks announced or done in 70 cities (last I heard) around the world and I know Cunt's been posting info about them on Ratz Facebook. For now, I'll just post this one vid as a reasonable summary:

FFS: No means no; Yes means yes; Responsibility lies completely with the rapist... com-fuckin-pletely!

[Seth]

No. the presumption should be that getting drunk isn't an excuse for having sex with someone who is passed out and can't give consent. Can't. Give. Consent.

Sure they can, right before they pass out. "Hey, baby, I'm really hammered and I'm about to pass out, but you can fuck me however you like because I really like you."

Sounds like consent to me.

[pErvinalia]

I'm glad everyone around here is starting to get a proper picture of the true Seth. I can let you in on a secret - it's not the most disgusting thing I have ever heard him say.

Fuck you too rEv.

I love you too, G.

[Jason]

How about when the drunk guy passes out I split his dick down the center? He didn't say I couldn't. He had to be giving consent by being intoxicated.

Fuckin' A Gallstones.

[Jason]

I've known Seth for a long time, I was the first person to get into it with him on RDF when he just joined up, and I think you might be selling him short. He often does this kind of thing - argues a point he doesn't believe to be true for reasons of his own. Most people just call him a troll or ignore him.

• 

What was the thread, what was it about, that first one?

Hah! Ever the curious one you were Gallstones.

Ask me over a beer sometime

[Gallstones]

I've known Seth for a long time, I was the first person to get into it with him on RDF when he just joined up, and I think you might be selling him short. He often does this kind of thing - argues a point he doesn't believe to be true for reasons of his own. Most people just call him a troll or ignore him.

• 

What was the thread, what was it about, that first one?

Hah! Ever the curious one you were Gallstones.

Ask me over a beer sometime

Yer on. I drink Whiskey.
And even if I end up intoxicated, just remember I'm not giving consent.
Well, I suppose we'd have to see how things went first anyway.

[Gallstones]

I'm glad everyone around here is starting to get a proper picture of the true Seth. I can let you in on a secret - it's not the most disgusting thing I have ever heard him say.

Fuck you too rEv.

I love you too, G.

Ours is a strange kind of love.

[Gallstones]

No. the presumption should be that getting drunk isn't an excuse for having sex with someone who is passed out and can't give consent. Can't. Give. Consent.

Sure they can, right before they pass out. "Hey, baby, I'm really hammered and I'm about to pass out, but you can fuck me however you like because I really like you."

Sounds like consent to me.

People don't talk like that.

And I already said that this scenerio is different from the one where a person is just hanging out with another person, is intoxicated to the point of passing out--did not give consent prior--and is taken advantage of when unconscious. Doing that is low and indefensible.

[MrJonno]

Women can want sex and man migfht not but a woman cannot physically force a man to have sex against his will in most normal circumstances. I suppose you knock a bloke out, inject him with drugs and screw him but this is hardly an ever day event

I'm not sure what the law says if the woman is using blackmail or other threats?. A woman can also be charged with the rape of another woman if she assists a man to do it (UK law).

A man is presumed to be innocent until proven otherwise, a women is assumed not to have given consent unless there is specific evidence to prove that she has. This can obviously be contradictory, but realistically if a woman is seen to go into a room voluntary with a man and there is no evidence of injury or sounds of a struggle the chances of a successful prosecution are zero. That doesnt mean there wasnt an attack but there is simply no way to proof it.

A rapist is infinitely more likely to get away with it , than an innocent man be convicted (far more than in other crimes). Accussing someone is a different matter the police just have to take accussations at least initially seriously

[Gallstones]

Geez... I've just scanned this thread and will get around to reading it later, but I'm stunned at some of the crap here. A dickhead Toronto cop recently gave out 'advice' about not dressing like a slut as a point to avoid rape and that in turn initiated a protest held last month called "SlutWalk Toronto". Since then there have been SlutWalks announced or done in 70 cities (last I heard) around the world and I know Cunt's been posting info about them on Ratz Facebook. For now, I'll just post this one vid as a reasonable summary:

FFS: No means no; Yes means yes; Responsibility lies completely with the rapist... com-fuckin-pletely!

I wonder if he'd consider accessorizing my slutty outfit with a handgun as an adequate deterrrent?

Thing is, a person doesn't have to dress "slutty" to be ogled, fondled, hit on, regaled with innuendo, told they shouldn't go out looking like that if they weren't goiong to put out....etc. I dress comfortably for me. It isn't my fault that I have breasts and child bearing hips.

[Warren Dew]

If I get drunk and wander into a bad part of town and get robbed or beaten up, should I blame someone else? Fuck no.

You should blame yourself, yes, but you should also press charges if the police catch the robbers or assaulters, which they should try to do.

[odysseus]

Ken Clarke is the media's chew toy now. He's asked for it really. He's a fat old windbag with outrageous attitudes belonging to the middle of another century. Deserves a long slow chew. It appears the media are well pleased to have a politician they can chew on after the last couple of months.

I wholeheartedly agree. The guy is an anachronism. Flush, please!

[BrettA]

Geez... I've just scanned this thread and will get around to reading it later, but I'm stunned at some of the crap here. A dickhead Toronto cop recently gave out 'advice' about not dressing like a slut as a point to avoid rape and that in turn initiated a protest held last month called "SlutWalk Toronto". Since then there have been SlutWalks announced or done in 70 cities (last I heard) around the world and I know Cunt's been posting info about them on Ratz Facebook. For now, I'll just post this one vid as a reasonable summary:
...
FFS: No means no; Yes means yes; Responsibility lies completely with the rapist... com-fuckin-pletely!

I wonder if he'd consider accessorizing my slutty outfit with a handgun as an adequate deterrrent?

Thing is, a person doesn't have to dress "slutty" to be ogled, fondled, hit on, regaled with innuendo, told they shouldn't go out looking like that if they weren't goiong to put out....etc. I dress comfortably for me. It isn't my fault that I have breasts and child bearing hips.

Absolutely!!! That's much the point of SlutWalks - though hardly all - the whole thing about dressing slutty or other crap that some people suggest being indicative of "asking for it" is completely bogus! They're all just overt and not-so-overt excuses to place blame on the woman - partly or wholly! It's all bullshit! I liked one protester's poster especially: "I'm not asking for it until I DO!"

[Gallstones]

Women can want sex and man migfht not but a woman cannot physically force a man to have sex against his will in most normal circumstances. I suppose you knock a bloke out, inject him with drugs and screw him but this is hardly an ever day event

I'm not sure what the law says if the woman is using blackmail or other threats?. A woman can also be charged with the rape of another woman if she assists a man to do it (UK law).

A man is presumed to be innocent until proven otherwise, a women is assumed not to have given consent unless there is specific evidence to prove that she has. This can obviously be contradictory, but realistically if a woman is seen to go into a room voluntary with a man and there is no evidence of injury or sounds of a struggle the chances of a successful prosecution are zero. That doesnt mean there wasnt an attack but there is simply no way to proof it.

A rapist is infinitely more likely to get away with it , than an innocent man be convicted (far more than in other crimes). Accussing someone is a different matter the police just have to take accussations at least initially seriously

In know a man who was raped by a woman. So it can happen and does.

Most sexual assaults are not reported. So most violators do get away with it.
Those who have been assaulted don't escape the personal consequences regardless of outcome. It isn't just the internal, emotionally based inhibitions borne by the violated person that keep them from reporting, the attitudes and messages from family and society act on such persons too. That is a lot to have to overcome. And that is before the ordeal of the prosecution.