US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Coito ergo sum » Tue May 15, 2012 5:04 pm

Seraph wrote:
Coito ergo sum wrote:
Robert_S wrote:Obama fucking wrote a book where he tells us what an immature stoned slacker he was in college. He's not trying to play goody two shoes church boy so we don't hold it against him so much.
Obama wrote a book is different than investigative journalists going up his ass to find out what happened when he was 14 and 15. This story about Romney goes back to his middle school days to find out his warts. I merely noted the simple fact that nobody bothered to do that with Obama. And, I strongly suspect that if they did, his supporters would cry "foul" that his actions as a school boy were being flyspecked to keep him from being President, particularly if the article went into how much of shit he was at age 15.
All the way back to his middle school days, you say? Wow! There are plenty of investigative reports published about Obama, going right back to his birth. They even gave rise to several court actions.
Really? You mean by the likes of the Washington Post? Or, the likes of some crackpot birther sitting in his basement looking at a printed copy of a birth certificaate with a microscope?

Well, if I missed the Wash Post, or the NYTimes or Chicago Tribunes expose' on Obama's adolescence, then I surely do need to be educated. I mean, now I know what a 14 year old Romney talked about to his post-pubescent pals, and I have learned the important fact that young teenage boys can and do sometimes behave badly to each other. Now that I know that about Romney, I surely must conclude that it permeates the core of his character. I'm sure Obama was never unjustifiably mean to anyone.

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Coito ergo sum » Tue May 15, 2012 5:41 pm

CBS - NYTimes Poll -- women now prefer The Stormin' Mormon to B.O. - http://washingtonexaminer.com/politics/ ... men/613771


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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Robert_S » Tue May 15, 2012 10:11 pm

He still has to pick a running-mate. I'm curious to see if the the Republicans have learned anything about that.
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Robert_S » Tue May 15, 2012 10:33 pm

http://www.politico.com/blogs/burns-hab ... 23343.html
The Obama campaign's 2-minute ad on Mitt Romney's Bain Capital is record is out, and it is brutal.

Targeting Romney's involvement in the acquistion of GST Steel, the commercial shows workers at a shuttered plant pinning Romney and Bain with the blame.

“They made as much money off it as they could and they closed it down, they filed for bankruptcy, without any concern for the families or the communities,” says Joe Soptic, a former steelworker. “It was like watching an old friend bleed to death.”

The spot directly contrasts the steelworkers' testimonials with Romney's words touting his business experience, showing the Republican saying "I know how business works. I know why jobs come and why they go" and "As I look around at the millions of Americans without work, it breaks my heart."

There's a longer version of the video at RomneyEconomics.com. Your move, Romney campaign ...
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Robert_S » Tue May 15, 2012 10:49 pm

Coito ergo sum wrote:
Robert_S wrote:Obama fucking wrote a book where he tells us what an immature stoned slacker he was in college. He's not trying to play goody two shoes church boy so we don't hold it against him so much.
Obama wrote a book is different than investigative journalists going up his ass to find out what happened when he was 14 and 15. This story about Romney goes back to his middle school days to find out his warts. I merely noted the simple fact that nobody bothered to do that with Obama. And, I strongly suspect that if they did, his supporters would cry "foul" that his actions as a school boy were being flyspecked to keep him from being President, particularly if the article went into how much of shit he was at age 15.
What's Mitt's stance on LGBT rights? Having seen what homophobia can lead to, has this experience changed him? He could spin this as a redemption story, but he has to confess his mistakes and renounce the evil that once possessed him.
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
-Mr P

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Warren Dew » Wed May 16, 2012 2:35 am

Robert_S wrote:What's Mitt's stance on LGBT rights? Having seen what homophobia can lead to, has this experience changed him? He could spin this as a redemption story, but he has to confess his mistakes and renounce the evil that once possessed him.
Romney's stance on gay rights seems never to have changed: he wants discrimination against them, such as in employment, to be prohibited, but he doesn't include the word "marriage" among those rights.

I don't see how the high school story could have changed that since no one knew the guy was gay then - assuming he was ever gay, which the family's "factually incorrect" statement throws some doubt on.

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Coito ergo sum » Wed May 16, 2012 1:59 pm

Romney pulling ahead in key state, North Carolina: http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_ ... _president 51% to 43%

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Warren Dew » Thu May 17, 2012 10:33 pm

maiforpeace wrote:So you are not part of the 56%. :biggrin:
Coito ergo sum wrote:No, he's part of the 57% -- http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162- ... ver-obama/
It's not inconsistent for the majority to think Obama will win, even if the majority would prefer a Romney win. Obama is a sitting president and can do things that a challenger cannot.

He could probably pick up quite a few warmonger votes by attacking Iran at just the right moment, for example.

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Robert_S » Thu May 17, 2012 11:58 pm

What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Tyrannical » Sat May 19, 2012 6:34 pm

Robert_S wrote:He still has to pick a running-mate. I'm curious to see if the the Republicans have learned anything about that.
Technically, Mittens doesn't get to pick. The delegates elect both president and VP.
They just usually elect the nominees choice for VP.
A rational skeptic should be able to discuss and debate anything, no matter how much they may personally disagree with that point of view. Discussing a subject is not agreeing with it, but understanding it.

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Robert_S » Mon May 21, 2012 12:34 am

Tyrannical wrote:
Robert_S wrote:He still has to pick a running-mate. I'm curious to see if the the Republicans have learned anything about that.
Technically, Mittens doesn't get to pick. The delegates elect both president and VP.
They just usually elect the nominees choice for VP.
So, will they chose a moderate to not scare off the undecideds, a more hardline case to shore up the base or a larval C-list celebrity?
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
-Mr P

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by trdsf » Wed May 23, 2012 1:27 am

Robert_S wrote:So, will they chose a moderate to not scare off the undecideds, a more hardline case to shore up the base or a larval C-list celebrity?
Given that the party wouldn't let McCain have his way in '08 (he wanted to pick Lieberman), I don't expect they'll let Romney have his way this year. Personally, I'm expecting a real knuckledragger -- most likely a southerner (even though they don't need to shore up their support there) and probably a religious extremist as well as a political one since the theocratic wing of the party isn't happy with Romney's Mormonism.

I'd be happy to see him pick Kasich, but only because it would get him out of my state, and it would be more likely to lose him Ohio than gain it.
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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Coito ergo sum » Wed May 23, 2012 1:16 pm

trdsf wrote:
Robert_S wrote:So, will they chose a moderate to not scare off the undecideds, a more hardline case to shore up the base or a larval C-list celebrity?
Given that the party wouldn't let McCain have his way in '08 (he wanted to pick Lieberman), I don't expect they'll let Romney have his way this year. Personally, I'm expecting a real knuckledragger -- most likely a southerner (even though they don't need to shore up their support there) and probably a religious extremist as well as a political one since the theocratic wing of the party isn't happy with Romney's Mormonism.

I'd be happy to see him pick Kasich, but only because it would get him out of my state, and it would be more likely to lose him Ohio than gain it.
It'll probably be Rubio. Cuban. Floridian. Conservative.

I would love it if he picked Chris Christie of New Jersey to really light things up. That would be bringing the battle to Obama's doorstep, with a Massachusetts and New Jersey Republican ticket. If they were to figure they had Florida reasonably in hand, they could battle for some northeastern States. And, for Chris Christie to have the popularity he has in Democratic New Jersey is pretty amazing.

I believe Christie when he says unequivocally he's not going to do it, thought.

After Rubio, I'm thinking Portman of Ohio. Ohio is another battleground state and a must win for Romney. So, picking Portman may help there.

I am wondering ,though, if Jeb Bush wouldn't be a good Veep candidate. He is still really popular in Florida, and was a very successful and very popular governor here. Whatever folks think of George W., Jeb was always my pick for which Bush should have been President. Professional. Intelligent. Common Sense. And, practical.

I'm going to throw out a possible long shot. Mary Fallin. Oklahoma. Very popular Republican governor of Oklahoma. Gives geographical diversity to the ticket, and puts a woman on the ticket for diversity there too. That would make it harder for Obama to run with his nonsense "war on women" divisive line.

But, I think the safe pick is Rubio. That gives a hispanic racial diversity to the ticket, and locks in the Cuban vote in Florida, and probably locks Florida. It gives him the tea party vote, and still leaves him the moderates, who tend not to have a problem with Rubio.

I think Jeb Bush has the name to contend with, and if another Bush comes near the white house, the anti-Bush fervor would get out of control. So, I think he's out of the picture. Nobody would risk it.

It'll either be Portman or Fallin, then, I think who gets the nod, if Rubio doesn't.

End ruminations.

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Re: US Prez Election 2012 Thread - Opinions and Discussions

Post by Tyrannical » Wed May 23, 2012 1:27 pm

Rubio's eligibility is questionable, being born to two non-citizens. Also, picking a Cuban might not win the Hispanic vote because of the way Cuban refugees versus all other Hispanics are treated via immigration.

Mittens might pick Paul, or he might not have much choice if he find he needs Paul's support to win.
A rational skeptic should be able to discuss and debate anything, no matter how much they may personally disagree with that point of view. Discussing a subject is not agreeing with it, but understanding it.

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