Scottish Catholics walk away from talks r.e. gay marriage

[Audley Strange]

I agree with you, but I can't see any reason at all why equal marriage will be affected by this noisy minority. Personally, I think they lose support with every bigotted pronouncement on the issue, and they are attacking SNP govt specifically in an attempt to scare them into changing course, but every party in Holyrood agrees with equal marriage. The only possible reason for pulling back would be if it were going to affect them in 2014, or in elections. I don't see why it would, there is no political party campaigning against it, and it will be yesterdays news by the time of the next elections.

Well I personally don't think its an issue for most Scots, but the old man of Hoy there seems to think the black brothers of Rome hold some influence in Scotland. While I admit that may well be the case, I don't think they hold as much influence as they once did, and that influence they have is amongst a small disparate group spread out so thinly as to be irrelevant.

If it was getting rid of Catholic Schools that might be a controversial issue, but this, I don't really see it, however John fae Skye might be right.

[ronmcd]

How on earth does putting a cardinal in his place equate to "insulting a religion" ?

If someone put Dawkins in his place, if he was trying to influence policy, I would hardly take it as "insulting atheism".

He should just have told them to stick to religion, and leave politics to the ELECTED politicians.
He just can't resist the temptation to creep around everybyody.

Weren't you the one who suggested Salmond should tell the Cardinal to "fuck off"? But regardless, you are correct, he might have been insulting a Cardinal rather than a whole religion. And I suspect you meant tell the Cardinal to keep out of politics rather than be rude to him.

But I go back to my original point - if Alex Salmond were to be anything other than calm and courteous in saying NO to the Cardinal, it would be presented by his political opponents as insulting "Catholics". Thats why he isn't going to do it, as no other political party leader or holder of a post such as First Minister would ever do in the same position.

It's a particular problem for Salmond, because he is target #1 for politicians of all the other major parties in Scotland, and will stay target #1 until the referendum. He isn't going to give his opponents any extra help by unnecessarily insulting the leader of the catholics in scotland. That wouldn't be brave, or principled - it would be stupid.

[Brian Peacock]

Cardinal O'Brien, who has described gay marriage as a "grotesque subversion of a universally accepted human right", said: "The Church's teaching on marriage is unequivocal, it is uniquely, the union of a man and a woman and it is wrong that governments, politicians or parliaments should seek to alter or destroy that reality."

Does this not highlight the heart of the issue; dogmatists like Cardinal Keith are not coneerned with referencing reality, the reality of contemporary society, but instead are concerned with bending reality to conform to their peculiar dogmatics.

What is this 'universally accepted human right' to deny equality to a section of the community based on an accident of their birth Keith? Is it not you who is trying to bend reality if you think that membership of your special club grants you a universal human right to limit the freedoms of others. And why does that self-declared 'universally accepted' human right grant the members of your special club the power to order reality so that marriage is unequivically and uniquely the preserve of heterosexuals even as you seek to deny its universal application to others? And why should politicians or parliaments represent your ideology above others and not alter the law in favour of equality for all - what make you so special Keith? Is it the frock? Or the hat? or any of the other talismans of your office?