Socialised Medicine Yaaaaaaaayyyy

[SnowLeopard]

That suggests Libertarians stand up for their values and have the balls to do something about what they believe in. I don't think Libertarians can be afforded that level of praise.

They're just little cry babies too cowardly to stand up for their convictions.

Not sure how someone can call themselves a man acting like that.

[MrJonno]

Seth's own private army with its own tank and artillery pieces

Army and libertarian are the ultimate contradictions in terms. Nothing reduces your personal freedom more than being in the military

[Seth]

The pragmatic point here is that Seth's absolutist views on tax morality have zero chance of affecting anything in the real world.

Seth's views on morality are remarkably similar to what you would expect from a paranoid self-obsessed psychopath.
For most people, morality is how you treat others. For Seth, it's all how they treat me, me, me.

Everybody is out to get at me, to take what's mine, they want to shit on me etc. etc.
The well-being of other people means fuck-all to him and never will. Some people are born that way .

This is the sort of mendacious ad hom attack that swinish, selfish, hypocritical socialist fucks who have no compunctions about robbing others for their own convenience use in lieu of reason to try to justify taking from others what the socialist fucks think they are entitled to. Socialists are the pathological sociopaths who think they have a right to enslave others to their service, and they aren't born that way, they are indoctrinated into it by other socialist sociopaths who don't understand the words "please," "thank you" and "no."

Libertarianism on the other hand is about respecting everyone's rights, particularly the right to benefit from and enjoy the fruits of one's labor free of thievery by lazy fucks who think everybody else owes them something. I'm sure you'll find this utterly incomprehensible, but that includes respecting YOUR right to benefit from YOUR labor without having ME stick my hand in your pocket on payday. I don't want your money enough to become a thief and take it from you, no matter how much I might need it. What's yours is yours. And what's mine is mine to dispose of as I see fit, not as you see fit.

If you want my help, then you can fucking well ask politely for it and show some gratitude if I decide to labor on your behalf because I find you worthy of my effort. Come at me with force to steal what's mine because you think you can make better use of it than I can and things will go very, very badly for you, or your proxy thugs.

[Seth]

Natural law says you don't own anything until you pay taxes (my version of natural law of course)

No, natural law says that if you try to exact taxes you'd better get my permission to do so. Otherwise I own it unless and until you can take it from me. Good luck with that, MrUnarmed.

[Seth]

Be a good little libertarian and shut up about things you don't understand... like humanity.

Thieves are not being humane. As I said, the difference between Libertarians and socialists is that socialists believe in using force to extract from individuals that which socialists believe others deserve more than those who labored to earn the property, whereas Libertarians respect the right of the individual to the fruits of his labor and ask nicely for those who do well to help and support those who are in need, and if the potential donor declines to assist by giving his property, Libertarians, unlike socialists, don't go after him with machine guns, kill him and take what they want, they move on to another, more charitable and altruistic potential donor and try to persuade that person to contribute.

In the comparison of moral conduct and immoral conduct, Libertarians are acting morally while socialists are acting immorally, which is why not one of you can support the socialist paradigm with a rational and logical argument. You all have to, as we see here, evade and avoid and engage in ad hominem rhetoric to avoid the inevitable destruction of your ideology that any sort of rational inspection would cause.

Well that's just Iridescent hyperbolic conduit.

Truth hurts, doesn't it?

Sorry, I thought it was standard practice to gloss over things people write with a short irrelevant collection of jibberish in an attempt to dismiss what they say as piss.

The problem is that you don't think. If you did, you'd see how wrong you are.

And then they die in the process. Because no person that is not a psychopath thinks a country can be run on random acts of kindness.

Strawman.

But as taxation isn't theft ... as you can't even understand that, that makes anything else you have to say on the matter moot and nonsense...

Depends on what the tax is used for.

And where exactly are these Western socialists that go hunting people with machine guns and kill them to collect taxes? Oh yeah, no where. Yet another figment of Seths over active and underdeveloped imagination. Basically nonsense invented to try and prop up a nonsense argument.

Then why do IRS agents carry machine guns?

I have given my rational logical argument. I have explained why in my opinion you and all other slimey scum sucking libertarians are immoral and unethical. And yet you choose to ignore this, skwak out the same debunked statement and act like the brain dead chess playing pigeon.

"blaaahhh no one can defeat me no one has a rational argument look at all the evasion!!!!"

You may think you've presented an argument, but you haven't.

'No wait you see I gave a rational and logical argument as you requested. You just don't want to acknowledge it. You're basically a petulant child, as all libertarians are, unable to accept that people are able to have different values from your own shitty ones. Because if you understood that and took time to read other peoples opinions you would run the risk of realizing that libertarians are actually just moral vacuums and psychopaths devoid of ethics.'

"BLEEEET I WIN"

Your attempt at an argument could be replaced with a track on iTunes set to repeat. That's pretty sad.

[/quote]
The quality of your so-called arguments needs nothing more youngster. Improve the quality of your argument and you might get a better response.

[Seth]

I don't know. Maybe I'm coming round. In this magical land with no government. What's to stop me buying a tank and driving it through the front door of Seths house...

My Javelin shoulder-fired anti-tank rocket combined with my strategic and tactical training. You might get my house (which isn't mine, it's a rental) but you won't long survive the victory.

Go look up Marvin Heemeyer.

Then just walking away giving a Nelson style Haa haa...

My .338 Lapua Magnum Sako TRG-42 will take care of that.

BTW, nothing stops you from buying a tank except your bank account. You can even buy one with an operable main gun if you like. All it takes is money. That's because the 2nd Amendment guarantees citizens the right to keep and bear tanks and artillery pieces, or Javelin shoulder-fired anti-tank rockets, RPG-7s and Sako TRG-42 sniper rifles...among other "arms."

So, if you want some, come get some.

[SnowLeopard]

Come at me with force to steal what's mine because you think you can make better use of it than I can and things will go very, very badly for you, or your proxy thugs.

Boy howdy that's some tough talk there cowboy.

So.. like.. what exactly are you doing to stand up for these beliefs in real terms?

You claim, wrongly, that tax is collected with force by proxy thugs. This is happening to you right now is it not? So what is going "very, very badly" for those people currently collecting tax from you?

You know, like, what are you actually doing to put all this hot air, bluster and postulating of yours in to action?

Are you like, scowling really hard at them over the phone? Do you rip open the letter from the IRS with a ferocious vigor? Do you weep in to your comfort blanket when you write the cheque?

What are you actually doing. To stand up for these opinions of yours?

For example in world war one you had conscientious objectors and people like the Quakers who stood up for their belief that fighting was wrong. Actually stood by their convictions of what they believed in and refused to fight, despite the almost complete ostracisation and contempt from other members of the comminity that came with it. That sort of conviction must take some balls, don't you agree?

Now it seems to me that with libertarians being so venomously anti-tax as they are, so sure of their righteousness over all other people, continue to roll over and pay that tax...? It must take a special kind of spineless, gutless, weak willed, lily liverd pussy. A person completely lacking in all testicular fortitude do not stand up for such, allegedly, strongly held beliefs...

[Rum]

Seth lives in an imaginary country called America circa 1830 when the space and available solitude meant the 'rugged individual' could go out there, find a patch of land, wrassle it to the ground, tame it, make it your own and keep the wolves off with the biggest fuck off guns around. It wasn't ever as 'free' as he thinks it was back then. His idea of liberty is freedom from collective social responsibility. It is just a smidgen to the right of psychopathology.

[SnowLeopard]

Natural law says you don't own anything until you pay taxes (my version of natural law of course)

No, natural law says that if you try to exact taxes you'd better get my permission to do so. Otherwise I own it unless and until you can take it from me. Good luck with that, MrUnarmed.

See my previous post for the majority of my reply to this.

Where can I find out more about this natural law? Is it.. written down somewhere, is there a definitive version? Is it in some stone tablets perhaps. Is it whispered on the wind by the fairies?

It's a stroke of luck that this apparent natural law is so specific about taxes isn't it? I wouldn't have thought taxes or any of our civilizations complex workings would have been predicted by mother nature?

Clever old nature!

What does natural law say about my toast always landing butter side down when it falls off the table, cus that's a bitch.

You give permission for those taxes to be extracted from you by virtue of you choosing to live in x country. You are capable of making yourself fully aware of exactly how much tax will be collected from you before you even earn a penny.

And I'd have thought that nature would have told you that you own the sum total of shit all without the government enabling it.

[SnowLeopard]

The problem is that you don't think. If you did, you'd see how wrong you are.

Nearly seven billion people that don't think. Seven billion that have got it all wrong. Every single country on the planet and not one of them thinking!

What a pickle eh.

It really is impressive work that you've managed to come along and put everyone straight Seth.

Strawman.

Evasion.

Pointing out the actual flaws and stupidity of your plans isn't a strawman.

Depends on what the tax is used for.

As long as you agree with what it's used for. So basically we need a country where every single one of the 300 million people all agree. Isn't that like... COMMUNISM!?!?"??"?34?21?£1?13?1

Then why do IRS agents carry machine guns?

To protect themselves from mentally unstable libertarian fuckwits Seth, why do you think. Your posts in like the last 3 pages alone give ample proof that IRS agents need to be able to protect themselves from deranged gun toting lunatics while doing their job.

You may think you've presented an argument, but you haven't.

Evasion.

You may think I haven't, but I have.

"blaaahhh no one can defeat me no one has a rational argument look at all the evasion!!!!"

'No wait you see I gave a rational and logical argument as you requested. You just don't want to acknowledge it. You're basically a petulant child, as all libertarians are, unable to accept that people are able to have different values from your own shitty ones. Because if you understood that and took time to read other peoples opinions you would run the risk of realizing that libertarians are actually just moral vacuums and psychopaths devoid of ethics.'

"BLEEEET I WIN"

Thanks for proving my point Seth. Couldn't have got you to do exactly what I predicted you would do more if I tried.

[SnowLeopard]

that's because the 2nd Amendment guarantees citizens the right to keep and bear tanks

That's stroke of good fortune for a 200 year old document!

So there were a lot tanks roaming around the American wilderness in 1791, were there?

Don't you think it would be more fitting that you are only allowed weapons that were available in 1791? I think that would be good sport.

Naturally you spend your free time sitting on your roof with the javelin armed and ready for my impending tank arrival.

Actually I wouldn't put that past you.

My Javelin shoulder-fired anti-tank rocket combined with my strategic and tactical training. You might get my house (which isn't mine, it's a rental) but you won't long survive the victory.

You really did learn to argue on xBox didn't you.

Of course your house is a rental. Rented in a fake name and paid for only with cash I'd wager. Isn't that right Seth. Or should I say.. MIGUEL HERNANDEZ!

I'll play along though, mainly because it's utterly hilarious to see someone type that Rambo nonsense while actually being serious. How do you plan on defeating me when I blow up your house with my tank when you're taking a dump on your throne? What safe guards have your strategic tactical training put in place for that scenario? Ooooh let me guess. Kevlar padded pooper of course how silly of me.

[Hermit]

Libertarianism on the other hand is about respecting everyone's rights, particularly the right

[FBM]

...That's because the 2nd Amendment guarantees citizens the right to keep and bear tanks and artillery pieces, or Javelin shoulder-fired anti-tank rockets, RPG-7s and Sako TRG-42 sniper rifles...among other "arms."

Fallacious appeal to common practice.

[pErvinalia]

Natural law says you don't own anything until you pay taxes (my version of natural law of course)

No, natural law says that if you try to exact taxes you'd better get my permission to do so. Otherwise I own it unless and until you can take it from me. Good luck with that, MrUnarmed.

No, natural law says that you owe me free beer. So pay up cunt!

[Seth]

Natural law says you don't own anything until you pay taxes (my version of natural law of course)

No, natural law says that if you try to exact taxes you'd better get my permission to do so. Otherwise I own it unless and until you can take it from me. Good luck with that, MrUnarmed.

No, natural law says that you owe me free beer. So pay up cunt!

Make me!