The Coronavirus Thread

[Cunt]

'Economic trouble' used to be called 'poverty'.

It also used to be pretty widely accepted that it was not good for people's health.

I will continue to think that poverty sucks though. You do you.

[NineBerry]

How many suicides and from ruined family businesses before you can acknowledge both kinds of deaths? Everyone seems to be firmly on one side of this, when the available data doesn't seem to support either extreme.

The suicide rate in Japan fell by 20% in April compared with the same time last year, the biggest drop in five years, despite fears the coronavirus pandemic would cause increased stress and many prevention helplines were either not operating or short-staffed.

People spending more time at home with their families, fewer people were commuting to work and delays to the start of the school year are seen as factors in the fall.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... ss-factors

[Cunt]

How many suicides and from ruined family businesses before you can acknowledge both kinds of deaths? Everyone seems to be firmly on one side of this, when the available data doesn't seem to support either extreme.

The suicide rate in Japan fell by 20% in April compared with the same time last year, the biggest drop in five years, despite fears the coronavirus pandemic would cause increased stress and many prevention helplines were either not operating or short-staffed.

People spending more time at home with their families, fewer people were commuting to work and delays to the start of the school year are seen as factors in the fall.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... ss-factors

Very German of you to take the Guardian article insisting that the Japanese are happier with more time at home. Sure be a shame if the poverty caused by this crisis was a bit later to affect people in Japan...

Deaths of despair are more than just suicide. Being wealthy, you might not have a feel for how bad it is. I hope your life allows you to continue this ignorance.

[NineBerry]

...

[Scot Dutchy]

Just a small point:

Quarter of Covid-19 deaths in English hospitals were of diabetics

NHS’s first breakdown of underlying health conditions also finds 18% had dementia

One in four people who have died in hospital with Covid-19 also had diabetes, the NHS’s first breakdown of underlying health conditions among the fatalities shows.

Of the 22,332 people who died in hospital in England between 31 March and 12 May, 5,873 (26%) suffered from either type 1 or type 2 diabetes, NHS England figures reveal.

That was the most common illness found in an analysis of what existing conditions patients had. The other commonest comorbidities were dementia (18%), serious breathing problems (15%) and chronic kidney disease (14%). One in ten (10%) suffered from ischaemic heart disease.

The finding about diabetes confirms anecdotal reports from intensive care doctors that many of the coronavirus patients they have been treating during the pandemic had underlying diabetes, as well as research by the UK’s Intensive Care National Audit and Research Centre.

More data confusion.

[JimC]

Scot, all it shows is what is already known, that people with pre-existing medical conditions are more likely to have severe reactions when infected by Covid-19, which is fairly unsurprising. If you are implying that these are not really deaths attributable to the virus, then you would need substantial medical evidence to justify that conclusion. In any case, there is already evidence (via death statistic comparisons from year to year) that the true death rate from the virus is higher than shown by the reported figures, in that deaths of the elderly and poor in many countries do not involve checking for Covid-19...

[Brian Peacock]

Just a small point:

Quarter of Covid-19 deaths in English hospitals were of diabetics

NHS’s first breakdown of underlying health conditions also finds 18% had dementia

One in four people who have died in hospital with Covid-19 also had diabetes, the NHS’s first breakdown of underlying health conditions among the fatalities shows.

Of the 22,332 people who died in hospital in England between 31 March and 12 May, 5,873 (26%) suffered from either type 1 or type 2 diabetes, NHS England figures reveal.

That was the most common illness found in an analysis of what existing conditions patients had. The other commonest comorbidities were dementia (18%), serious breathing problems (15%) and chronic kidney disease (14%). One in ten (10%) suffered from ischaemic heart disease.

The finding about diabetes confirms anecdotal reports from intensive care doctors that many of the coronavirus patients they have been treating during the pandemic had underlying diabetes, as well as research by the UK’s Intensive Care National Audit and Research Centre.

More data confusion.

Why post an article to dispute something you think is made up anyway? It seems that obesity and diabetes are risk factors, as well as being prevalent conditions in the elderly population, who are at a higher risk due to their age anyway. Seems pretty uncontroversial really. Do you have a point or are you just ragging the Libruls?

[pErvinalia]

You're wasting your breath you two.

[Hermit]

there is already evidence (via death statistic comparisons from year to year) that the true death rate from the virus is higher than shown by the reported figures, in that deaths of the elderly and poor in many countries do not involve checking for Covid-19...

The Dutch Ministry of Health, Welfare and Sport via its National Institute for Public Health and the Environment reported much the same late last month.

The actual number of deaths from the novel coronavirus in the Netherlands is higher than the reported numbers that RIVM National Institute for Public Health and the Environment publishes daily. RIVM and Statistics Netherlands (CBS) monitor the mortality rates in the Netherlands. Not all people who die in the Netherlands have been tested for COVID-19. The total number of deaths per week as reported to Statistics Netherlands - regardless of the cause of death - provides an overview of the situation in the Netherlands.

Since a few weeks, excess mortality is seen in the Netherlands. The rising higher mortality coincides with the start of the coronavirus epidemic in the Netherlands. A significant part of the excess mortality is expected to be related to COVID-19. Which part that is will become clear later on in the cause of death registration. In the third week of April, data from CBS and RIVM show that excess mortality is decreasing.

In the week from Thursday 9 April to Wednesday 15 April 2020 inclusive, total mortality in the Netherlands significantly increased (mortality reported within two weeks - around 97%). A total of 4,500 deaths were reported; this count is usually between 2,654 and 2,959 deaths. This is between 1,541 and 1,846 more deaths than the expected average this time of year. This count is about twice as high as the reported deaths from laboratory-confirmed COVID-19 patients in the same week (876). Mortality was slightly increased in the 55-64 age group and sharply increased in the 65-74 age group and 75 years and older.

[Hermit]

You're wasting your breath you two.

Make that three.

[Scot Dutchy]

Nevermind. Which deaths are due to the virus? We dont know. That is very much the discussion here. We dont know actual deaths. A Coronas death here is only when the patient has tested positive and then the virus is only a contributory factor and may not be the cause of death.
Hermit those figures have long been dismissed as inaccurate.

[LucidFlight]

They should adjust the death count by proportioning an amount based on the contributing factors. One person may have died 35% due to the virus and 65% due to being stabbed. That way, we get a more accurate figure. If we take out the 65% proportion due to stabbing, for example, that brings down the actual figure for Coronavirus significantly.

[rainbow]

Scot, all it shows is what is already known, that people with pre-existing medical conditions are more likely to have severe reactions when infected by Covid-19, which is fairly unsurprising. If you are implying that these are not really deaths attributable to the virus, then you would need substantial medical evidence to justify that conclusion. In any case, there is already evidence (via death statistic comparisons from year to year) that the true death rate from the virus is higher than shown by the reported figures, in that deaths of the elderly and poor in many countries do not involve checking for Covid-19...

There is that pesky 'excess' deaths number.
...maybe due to Netflix induced depression: https://www.her.ie/life/all-that-binge- ... ion-282952

In popular media, “binge-watching” is defined as watching television at a stretch over an extended period of time. Though some preliminary studies have showed negative health outcomes with excessive Television (TV) viewing, this new trending phenomenon of “binge-watching” has never been studied before using a large population from a socio-behavioral context.

https://apha.confex.com/apha/143am/webp ... 35049.html

[Hermit]

Nevermind. Which deaths are due to the virus?

According to the Dutch Ministry of Health, Welfare and Sport via its National Institute for Public Health and the Environment between 1,541 and 1,846 more deaths than the expected average in the week from Thursday 9 April to Wednesday 15 April 2020 inclusive.

[Scot Dutchy]

Still quoting data that has been disputed by other experts here. Once again; a Corona death is only recorded as such when the patient has tested positive. This is the crux of why the figures are disputed. It is only a contributory factor. Not all deaths have been tested for Corona and not all Corona deaths are caused by the virus. It far too sweeping to say otherwise which is why data on deaths in this situation is practically useless. Making guestimates has no value.