Joe wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2019 5:15 am
Forty Two wrote: ↑Wed May 15, 2019 12:10 pm
Joe wrote:
The Russians' goal was to "sow discord in the U.S. political system, including the 2016 U.S. presidential election," and the Trump volunteers unwittingly supported them.
The blurb you cite does not say any support was given to "sowing discord" or anything else.
It's funny you missed the quote. I put it at the end.
Joe wrote: ↑Wed May 15, 2019 1:57 am
Oh yeah, before I go do other stuff, there's one other citation I should share. Remember when I mentioned the Russians' goals? Here's the full quote.
Defendant ORGANIZATION had a strategic goal to sow discord in the U.S. political system, including the 2016 U.S. presidential election. Defendants posted derogatory information about a number of candidates, and by early to mid-2016, Defendants’ operations included supporting the presidential campaign of then-candidate Donald J. Trump (“Trump Campaign”) and disparaging Hillary Clinton. Defendants made various xpenditures to carry out those activities, including buying political advertisements on social media in the names of U.S. persons and entities. Defendants also staged political rallies inside the United States, and while posing as U.S. grassroots entities and U.S. persons, and without revealing their Russian identities and ORGANIZATION affiliation, solicited and compensated real U.S. persons to promote or disparage candidates. Some Defendants, posing as U.S. persons and without revealing their Russian association, communicated with unwitting individuals associated with the Trump Campaign and with other political activists to seek to coordinate political activities.
That's from
United States of America v A Pack of Russian Cunts.
Yes, and it's amazing that you can'd read English. Do you not understand that the Russians posting things, carrying signs, and calling a campaign office is not attributable to either the Trump campaign?
Defendants staged rallies????? Wow! That's evidence of Trump campaign coordination with the Russians, you think? They were posing as US grassroots entities and didn't reveal their identities???? My god! That's daming evidence! They posed as US persons?
And all this is "alleged" in an indictment? Geez... it's no wonder you say there was evidence that the Trump campaign coordinated with Russia to interfere with the election.
Joe wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2019 5:15 am
See, even the USA agrees with me. Kind of makes me proud to be "a True Believer in The Resistance or a Trump-Deranged person," being in such good company.
You realize that that paragraph proves you wrong, not right. That paragraph says that Russians rallied, carried signs, and posed as US persons and entities, etc., without revealing their Russian identities to favor and oppose candidates and sow discord in our society. And, you are trying to suggest that evidences "the Trump campaign coordinating with Russia to interfere with the US election?"
You can't be that stupid. You know you're full of shit.
Joe wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2019 5:15 am
It seems we outnumber you. Try not to flip your wig kid.
I know the MSNBC crowd outnumbers me. LOL. But, the prosecutors in the indictment you quoted did not state or even suggest that the Trump campaign coordinated with Russia to interfere with the election. You're pretending that Russian actions to sing songs, carry signs, and post shit on social media, while posing as US persons, constitutes evidence of the Trump campaign coordinating with the Russians to interfere with the election. Only, it just isn't. And, that's a good reason why neither the Mueller report nor that indictment suggested that anyone in the Trump campaign coordinated with Russia to interfere with the election.
Joe wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2019 5:15 am
Didn't read the whole thing, did you kid? I wonder where you left off.
From what you didn't address in your four posts, I'm guessing you stopped reading where I gave proof I read Mueller right, so I'll include it again.
I'm not alone calling it coordination. Here's what
Business Insider had to say
Later that summer, the Russians extended their operations into Florida, a critical battleground state in US elections.
Using tactics similar to those they employed in New York, the Russians bought ads on Facebook and Instagram to promote a series of pro-Trump rallies they dubbed "Florida Goes Trump."
They coordinated with Trump campaign staff, who were unaware they were working with Russians, to organize the rallies, and paid real Americans to perform specific tasks during the protests.
Business insider makes the same mistake you do - failing to read Mueller's report exactly how it is written. The Mueller report says Russians - posing as US persons and unknown to Trump campaign volunteers - asked for signs and to coordinate logistics with rallies. It does nto at all say that Trump campaign staff "organized rallies" for them. It doesn't say that. It says the Russians REQUESTED it. Mueller's report does not go farther than that. Now, even if the volunteers gave out signs and also "helped coordinate LOGISTICS" of a rally, that's not evidence of the Trump campaign coordinating with Russia to interfere with the election. And, neither Mueller nor any other government source says it is. Anywhere. Anyhow.
Joe wrote: ↑Thu May 16, 2019 5:15 am
CNBC
reported it as coordination too
The report clarifies that in the cases in which a pro-Trump, IRA-organized rally also coordinated with Trump’s campaign, the campaign was not aware of the origins of the organizers. “The IRA’s contacts included requests for signs and other materials to use at rallies, as well as requests to promote the rallies and help coordinate logistics.”
Again - that's the best you got - someone calls a campaign office and asks for signs and help with logistics on a rally. Nobody knows they're Russian.
And, you call that "coordination with the Trump campaign to interfere with the election. Note, how none of the articles you cite go that far. they do not say it's evidence of the Trump campaign coordinating with the Russians to interfere with the election.
Here you also skipped these questions:
If a Russian calls a campaign office, any campaign office, and asks for signs and help with logistics on a rally. They have an accent, but nobody knows they are Russian. Nobody asks for ID. They just say "o.k. here are a bunch of signs" and here's some instructional material on how to stage a rally. What should the campaign office worker do? Background check on the caller? Ask for ID? Reject anyone with an accent? What? And if they provide the signs and help with logistics, are they coordinating with a Russian to interfere with the election?
Is that "unwitting coordination" or "unintentional conspiracy" to interfere with the election?
The answer, of course, is simple and obvious, and you won't address these kinds of questions, because you know your suggestion that asking for signs and help with logistics isn't even wrong, much less "interference in an election" and it's certainly not THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN coordinating with Russians to interfere with the election.
The FEC says it flat out - -"Generally, an individual (including a foreign national) may volunteer personal services to a federal candidate or federal political committee without making a contribution. The Act provides this volunteer "exemption" as long as the individual performing the service is not compensated by anyone."
https://www.fec.gov/updates/foreign-nationals/ In other words ,a Russian, Canadian or Mexican, etc is perfectly free and legally entitled not only to call and ask campaigns for signs and such, but they may be and often are - THE VOLUNTEER at the campaign office! It's not only not wrong for Russians to OPENLY call campaign offices and ask for signs and help to organize rallies - Russians, Chinese, Canadians, Mexicans, Australians, Germans, Iranians, Saudis, Mexicans, Israelis Indians and Brazilians, by way of example - are perfectly free and entitled to take volunteer positions at any campaign and hand out the signs and help with the logistics. When such foreign persons do that, is that "evidence of coordination with [foreign persons] to interfere with the election?"
Here again - "An individual may volunteer personal services to a campaign without making a contribution as long as the individual is not compensated by anyone for the services. Volunteer activity is not reportable." That's not just Americans. Any individual.
https://www.fec.gov/help-candidates-and ... -activity/
How many foreign nationals (e.g. Mexicans, Cubans) do you think have called campaign offices asking for signs and help with rallies? How many do you think actually volunteered for political campaigns? Do you think that number is zero? Do you think there is anything wrong with doing so? If Mexican nationals volunteer for the Beto O'Rourke campaign in El Paso, and pass out signs to Mexicans, Hondurans and Guatemalans, and help with logistics with signs and slogans to tear down all barriers along the border and by the way vote for Beto! -- are they coordinating with foreign nationals to interfere with the election?
https://www.fec.gov/help-candidates-and ... -activity/
The FEC ruled that foreign nationals (which include the scary Russians) may work for campaigns to produce intellectual property, and there is nothing violative of the law. Would you say that if a political campaign hires such a volunteer foreign national to do that, that they are "coordinating with a foreign national to interfere with the election? Why or why not? Under what circumstances would it be that?
Of course not - your argument is ridiculous and juvenile. it doesn't even make sense. It's you just farting into the wind.