Global Climate Change Science News

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mistermack
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by mistermack » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:14 pm

Rum wrote:
mistermack wrote:
Hermit wrote:Even though non-fossil power generation cannot be used as a base-load supplier of electricity, it has chopped billions of dollars off the consumers' power bill in Australia. I have explained how that happens before, but you handwaved the fact away and now forgotten it altogether because
Because it was bollocks. :funny:
And bollocks back..

“Meanwhile these solar systems will also save consumers $1.5 billion off their electricity bills over the next 10 years.”

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... lian-homes
There is no data in that link. Just a quote. "Green Energy Markets analyst Tristan Edis said"
So happy you found a reliable source. :funny:

Of course, no mention of how much people have to spend, to "save" all that money on their bills.
Or, how much the rest of the bills have to rise, to compensate for the reduction of income from homes with Solar. ( who still need topping up from the grid and all of the infrastructure to enable that ).

And of course, no mention that Australia is exporting it's CO2 instead of producing it domestically.
So what the fuck? Burn it in China, and it doesn't count???? What bollocks. There's only one atmosphere.
wikipedia wrote:In 2015, Australia was the biggest net exporter of coal, with 33% of global exports (392 Mt out of 1,193 Mt total). It was still the fourth-highest anthracite producer with 6.6% of global production (509 Mt out of 7,709 Mt total). 77% of production was exported (392 Mt out of 509 Mt total).[10][11]
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Brian Peacock » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:20 pm

So you think it's impossible to have a mixed energy economy. I wonder where you get that idea from?
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by mistermack » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:36 pm

Brian Peacock wrote:So you think it's impossible to have a mixed energy economy. I wonder where you get that idea from?
It's not impossible, and I never said that. It just costs more. You have three or four lots of infrastructure, instead of one.
In Britain, it's not a bad idea to have a mixture. It avoids being potentially held to ransom by foreign suppliers, in the event of relations breaking down. Some wind, solar and nuclear is a good idea, to keep things running when the shit hits the fan.

But if we had huge domestic reserves of energy, like Australia, it wouldn't make any sense.
wikipedia wrote:From 2003 to 2013 real electric prices for households increased by an average of 72%. Much of this increase in price has been attributed to over-investment in increasing distribution networks and capacity, and environmental policy impacts.
Makes the "money off bills" claim look stupid, doesn't it?
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:39 pm

mistermack wrote:
Rum wrote:
mistermack wrote:
Hermit wrote:Even though non-fossil power generation cannot be used as a base-load supplier of electricity, it has chopped billions of dollars off the consumers' power bill in Australia. I have explained how that happens before, but you handwaved the fact away and now forgotten it altogether because
Because it was bollocks. :funny:
And bollocks back..

“Meanwhile these solar systems will also save consumers $1.5 billion off their electricity bills over the next 10 years.”

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... lian-homes
There is no data in that link. Just a quote. "Green Energy Markets analyst Tristan Edis said"
So happy you found a reliable source. :funny:

Of course, no mention of how much people have to spend, to "save" all that money on their bills.
Or, how much the rest of the bills have to rise, to compensate for the reduction of income from homes with Solar. ( who still need topping up from the grid and all of the infrastructure to enable that ).

And of course, no mention that Australia is exporting it's CO2 instead of producing it domestically.
So what the fuck? Burn it in China, and it doesn't count???? What bollocks. There's only one atmosphere.
wikipedia wrote:In 2015, Australia was the biggest net exporter of coal, with 33% of global exports (392 Mt out of 1,193 Mt total). It was still the fourth-highest anthracite producer with 6.6% of global production (509 Mt out of 7,709 Mt total). 77% of production was exported (392 Mt out of 509 Mt total).[10][11]
That's why we need a carbon tax or an emissions trading scheme. But dinosaurs like you didn't like that.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Rum » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:39 pm

From: https://theconversation.com/winds-of-ch ... coal-89598

"Just six years ago, more than 40% of Britain’s electricity was generated by burning coal. Today, that figure is just 7%. Yet if the story of 2016 was the dramatic demise of coal and its replacement by natural gas, then 2017 was most definitely about the growth of wind power.

Wind provided 15% of electricity in Britain last year (Northern Ireland shares an electricity system with the Republic and is calculated separately), up from 10% in 2016. This increase, a result of both more wind farms coming online and a windier year, helped further reduce coal use and also put a stop to the rise in natural gas generation."

---

...worth reading on if you are interested.

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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by mistermack » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:44 pm

It's also put bills up.

I think we need wind for diversity, but it should be made clear that it's costing the consumer more. Not necessarily because of the direct price of energy from wind turbines. It's because of the cost of being able to cover for no wind, on still days.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:17 pm

It's only costing more because fossil fuels are so heavily subsidised. :fp:
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by mistermack » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:49 pm

pErvinalia wrote:It's only costing more because fossil fuels are so heavily subsidised. :fp:
No, it's costing more because power is needed 24/7 and wind can't supply it.

It's like running two cars. Even though you can only drive one at a time, it costs more to keep both in running order.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:06 am

No, it's costing more because of subsidies. But people like you and Seth who don't believe in science will never accept this fact.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Animavore » Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:19 pm

NASA: Global surface temperatures in 2017 second-hottest on record despite no El Niño

According to scientists at NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies in New York City, global average temperatures in 2017 were 1.62 degrees Fahrenheit (or 0.90 degrees Celsius) warmer than the 1951 to 1980 average, which makes 2017 temperatures second only to 2016.

In their own analysis, scientists at the U.S. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) determined that 2017 was the third-warmest year on record, behind 2016 and 2015.

Despite the small discrepancy in rankings, which is due to the different methods each team employed for analyzing temperature data, both agencies’ analyses find that the five warmest years on record have all occurred since 2010 and that Earth’s long-term warming trend continued through 2017.
https://news.mongabay.com/2018/01/nasa- ... o-el-nino/
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Svartalf » Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:36 pm

pErvinalia wrote:
Hermit wrote:
mistermack wrote:Who is generating the power at night though? I'm all for solar, but it doesn't store.
Presumably, the people keeping the lights on at night need to turn a profit. If your power station isn't needed during the day, then you have to charge more at night to break even. They aren't charities.

You can combine wind and solar to bridge the gap a bit, but neither can be relied on. You HAVE to have a source of power that can fill the gaps, and people want to make a profit, otherwise they won't do it.

So either you subsidise them, or let them charge a huge amount for supplying intermittent power.
Either way, the consumer pays more.
Even though non-fossil power generation cannot be used as a base-load supplier of electricity,
It can with the right storage.
yeah, right, because the 'right storage' is already developed technically and that tech is readily available...
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by DRSB » Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:01 am

Pollution in the atmosphere is having an unexpected consequence, scientists say—it's helping to cool the climate, masking some of the global warming that's occurred so far.

That means efforts worldwide to clean up the air may cause an increase in warming, as well as other climate effects, as this pollution disappears.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... l-warming/

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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by cronus » Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:11 am

DRSB wrote:
Pollution in the atmosphere is having an unexpected consequence, scientists say—it's helping to cool the climate, masking some of the global warming that's occurred so far.

That means efforts worldwide to clean up the air may cause an increase in warming, as well as other climate effects, as this pollution disappears.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... l-warming/
I'd already factored that into my own model. Gonna need to do something. Or the world is gonna be uninhabitable within a century. Exponential positive feedbacks and the atmosphere will be super-heated steam.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by pErvinalia » Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:37 am

Svartalf wrote:
pErvinalia wrote:
Hermit wrote:
mistermack wrote:Who is generating the power at night though? I'm all for solar, but it doesn't store.
Presumably, the people keeping the lights on at night need to turn a profit. If your power station isn't needed during the day, then you have to charge more at night to break even. They aren't charities.

You can combine wind and solar to bridge the gap a bit, but neither can be relied on. You HAVE to have a source of power that can fill the gaps, and people want to make a profit, otherwise they won't do it.

So either you subsidise them, or let them charge a huge amount for supplying intermittent power.
Either way, the consumer pays more.
Even though non-fossil power generation cannot be used as a base-load supplier of electricity,
It can with the right storage.
yeah, right, because the 'right storage' is already developed technically and that tech is readily available...
Well it actually is for battery and pumped hydro, and presumably for solar thermal using molten salt. Pumped hydro isn't going to work everywhere, as you need a couple of hundred vertical metres of terrain.
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Re: Global Climate Change Science News

Post by Tero » Thu Mar 29, 2018 8:46 pm

I Ani still around? I need a rebuttal to this that my FRIEND is taking as truth
https://realclimatescience.com/2018/03/ ... 5-degrees/
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