Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post Reply
User avatar
Blind groper
Posts: 3997
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:10 am
About me: From New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Blind groper » Sat Aug 11, 2012 1:44 am

mistermack

I understand what you are saying, but cannot agree. While indirect measures of temperature change are less precise than direct, they are not so inaccurate as to make them meaningless. They just have bigger error bars. There is no doubt that the temperature rise of the past 60 odd years is extraordinarily rapid compared to any other time period that we have looked at.
For every human action, there is a rationalisation and a reason. Only sometimes do they coincide.

User avatar
macdoc
Twitcher
Posts: 9074
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 3:20 pm
Location: BirdWing Home FNQ
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by macdoc » Sat Aug 11, 2012 2:05 am

What he doesn't get is that the atmosphere is transient and it says little about the real energy increase which is embedded in the ocean and cryosphere.
Both of those geo-systems shelter us from the full effects of the fossil C02 effect.

Image

There is hysteresis even in the rise in the atmospheric temps over time as there is a lag - so even if we stopped increasing the carbon load the earth would continue to retain more energy until a new radiative balance is reached....about 1.6 C above the base line - we are just half way through what we have already created.

Bogging in details is useless - MM denies the physics of GHG which is just flat out plain stupid.
Ignorance or willful ignorance take your pick.
The C02 is well understood and easy to demonstrates......until he gets past that denial - arguing anything else is a waste of time.

The dwindling coterie of deniers are past pathetic into bathos now.....
Resident in Cairns Australia • Current ride> 2014 Honda CB500F • Travel photos https://500px.com/p/macdoc?view=galleries

User avatar
mistermack
Posts: 15093
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:57 am
About me: Never rong.
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by mistermack » Sat Aug 11, 2012 2:29 pm

Blind groper wrote:mistermack

I understand what you are saying, but cannot agree. While indirect measures of temperature change are less precise than direct, they are not so inaccurate as to make them meaningless. They just have bigger error bars. There is no doubt that the temperature rise of the past 60 odd years is extraordinarily rapid compared to any other time period that we have looked at.
It is, but I repeat, it's actually the ONLY period that we've looked at, accurately.
Even today, there is still a lot of argument and debate about the accuracy of surface temperature figures.
If there had been a similar 1 deg rise in the years 1250 to 1312, there is no way that we could know that for sure.
So we simply can't be sure that there wasn't.
While there is a market for shit, there will be assholes to supply it.

User avatar
Warren Dew
Posts: 3781
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:41 pm
Location: Somerville, MA, USA
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Warren Dew » Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:03 am

mistermack wrote:So what the fuck is he claiming? Humans caused warming over 200 years, but it wasn't CO2?
Just for the record, there's quite a bit of evidence that the albedo effects of soot on global warming are stronger than the CO2 greenhouse effects. People who like to pretend they're doing the world good by using diesels hate that fact, though.

User avatar
Warren Dew
Posts: 3781
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:41 pm
Location: Somerville, MA, USA
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Warren Dew » Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:27 am

macdoc wrote:The C02 is well understood and easy to demonstrates......until he gets past that denial - arguing anything else is a waste of time.
"Well understood"? Can you point me to a peer reviewed source which provide quantitative data on carbon sequestration as calcium carbonate as a function of carbon in the atmosphere?

No? I guess it's not all that well understood, then.

User avatar
Gawdzilla Sama
Stabsobermaschinist
Posts: 151265
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:24 am
About me: My posts are related to the thread in the same way Gliese 651b is related to your mother's underwear drawer.
Location: Sitting next to Ayaan in Domus Draconis, and communicating via PMs.
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:58 am

Warren Dew wrote:
macdoc wrote:The C02 is well understood and easy to demonstrates......until he gets past that denial - arguing anything else is a waste of time.
"Well understood"? Can you point me to a peer reviewed source which provide quantitative data on carbon sequestration as calcium carbonate as a function of carbon in the atmosphere?

No? I guess it's not all that well understood, then.
Even Jon Stewart is better at this than you are.
Image
Ein Ubootsoldat wrote:“Ich melde mich ab. Grüssen Sie bitte meine Kameraden.”

User avatar
macdoc
Twitcher
Posts: 9074
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 3:20 pm
Location: BirdWing Home FNQ
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by macdoc » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:26 am

I love guys that use big words and don't understand squat - just more right wing garbage from the likes of WD.
I thought libbies encouraged responsibility for the consequences of one's actions....guess that's another right wing lie.

First the calcium carbonate is liquid derived dufus so any impact on the atmosphere is indirect.

Here's your paper on sequestration.
Fish as major carbonate mud producers and missing components of the tropical carbonate factory
Chris T. Perrya,1, Michael A. Saltera, Alastair R. Harborneb, Stephen F. Crowleyc, Howard L. Jelksd, and Rod W. Wilsonb,1
+ Author Affiliations

aSchool of Science and the Environment, Manchester Metropolitan University, Chester Street, Manchester M1 5GD, United Kingdom;
bBiosciences, College of Life and Environmental Sciences, University of Exeter, Exeter EX4 4PS, United Kingdom;
cDepartment of Earth and Ocean Sciences, University of Liverpool, 4 Brownlow Street, Liverpool L69 3GP, United Kingdom; and
dUS Geological Survey, 7920 North West 71st Street, Gainesville, FL 32653
Edited* by George N. Somero, Stanford University, Pacific Grove, CA, and approved January 6, 2011 (received for review November 2, 2010)
http://www.pnas.org/content/108/10/3865

It's impact on uptake of fossil carbon is encouraging doesn't change the physics of the optical properties of C02 in the atmosphere one iota.

That being
It's getting warmer
We're responsible primarily due to the release of fossil carbon by burning fossil fuels .......


Get over your denial crap.....is way passed best by date. Even the scientists employed by the fossil fuel companies knew this was "incontrovertible" back in the mid 90s, and you're still denying it.... :funny: :funny:
Industry Ignored Its Scientists on Climate

By ANDREW C. REVKINPublished: April 23, 2009

For more than a decade the Global Climate Coalition, a group representing industries with profits tied to fossil fuels, led an aggressive lobbying and public relations campaign against the idea that emissions of heat-trapping gases could lead to global warming.

“The role of greenhouse gases in climate change is not well understood,” the coalition said in a scientific “backgrounder” provided to lawmakers and journalists through the early 1990s, adding that “scientists differ” on the issue.

But a document filed in a federal lawsuit demonstrates that even as the coalition worked to sway opinion, its own scientific and technical experts were advising that the science backing the role of greenhouse gases in global warming could not be refuted.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/24/scien ... .html?_r=2

......speaking of AGW denial crap.....fish poo is your friend..
http://scienceblogs.com/authority/2009/ ... rbon-cycl/
..at least it's ameliorating the impact of fossil fuel release to a degree.

We don't fully understand all aspects of aerodynamic theory either but you get on the planes designed around what we do know....or perhaps your irrational worldview includes fear of flying.

Now head back to the dark cave of scientific ignorance until you're ready to admit to the reality of AGW and take some responsibility like the upstanding citizen you would picture yourself being..... :coffee:
Resident in Cairns Australia • Current ride> 2014 Honda CB500F • Travel photos https://500px.com/p/macdoc?view=galleries

User avatar
Gawdzilla Sama
Stabsobermaschinist
Posts: 151265
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:24 am
About me: My posts are related to the thread in the same way Gliese 651b is related to your mother's underwear drawer.
Location: Sitting next to Ayaan in Domus Draconis, and communicating via PMs.
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sat Aug 18, 2012 11:59 am

Image
Ein Ubootsoldat wrote:“Ich melde mich ab. Grüssen Sie bitte meine Kameraden.”

User avatar
Warren Dew
Posts: 3781
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:41 pm
Location: Somerville, MA, USA
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Warren Dew » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:34 pm

macdoc wrote:The C02 is well understood and easy to demonstrates
macdoc wrote:We don't fully understand all aspects of aerodynamic theory either
Ah, so it's not well understood, after all. Thanks for admitting your error.

User avatar
macdoc
Twitcher
Posts: 9074
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 3:20 pm
Location: BirdWing Home FNQ
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by macdoc » Sun Aug 19, 2012 4:52 am

What a joke deniers have become - - what the fuck don't you comprehend about "all aspects"......??/

The major action of Co2 role in the atmosphere has been well understood for over a century - or are you arguing that the fossil fuel company's own scientists were also wrong. Wouldn't surprise in the whacko world of the Repuglies.

Filling in details of the carbon cycle in no way brings into question the basic science. You are reduced to grade 2 responses since you have not one iota of science to contradict .....

it's getting warmer
we're responsible.


why not be an adult - own up to it get on with dealing with it in responsible manner .....or perhaps you just think using the atmosphere as a sewer with no consequences to the companies do so is completely ethical.??
Remind me not be downstream when you shit in the river......I suppose that's okay too..why do you even support taxes for sewer plants??? or maybe you don't......

Unfortunately I live downwind of Ohio and while we've sued once for health costs due to coal pollution - haven't seen much reduction.
Ugly American writ large on the planet.......not changing much. :nono:

Mine you even your candidate is on anti-coal bandwagon....
Romney goes on offensive on coal in Ohio - Political Hotsheet - CBS ...
http://www.cbsnews.com/.../romney-goes- ... -in-ohio/4 days ago – Cardinal Plant, a coal-fired power station near Brilliant, Ohio. ... up to 11000 early deaths each year and save billions in health care costs.
Why is that Warren if it's all so cloudy and not well understood???

or is the easier explanation .....you don't know what the fuck you are talking about when it comes to AGW and it's consequences and choose willful ignorance and denial of the obvious for whatever personal gain it brings to you. Very sustainable position that is....pardon my disgust :coffee:
Resident in Cairns Australia • Current ride> 2014 Honda CB500F • Travel photos https://500px.com/p/macdoc?view=galleries

User avatar
mistermack
Posts: 15093
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:57 am
About me: Never rong.
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by mistermack » Sun Aug 19, 2012 8:48 pm

macdoc wrote:The major action of Co2 role in the atmosphere has been well understood for over a century -
Yeh right. EXCEPT that rising CO2 has never caused a rise in temperatures, as illustrated by the ice cores.

Rising temperatures cause raised CO2. Not the reverse. Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha !!

The role is understood, but doesn't happen in real life. How very strange !
While there is a market for shit, there will be assholes to supply it.

User avatar
SteveB
Nibbler
Posts: 7506
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2011 6:38 am
About me: The more you change the less you feel
Location: Potsville, BC, Canada
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by SteveB » Sun Aug 19, 2012 8:55 pm

mistermack wrote:
macdoc wrote:The major action of Co2 role in the atmosphere has been well understood for over a century -
Yeh right. EXCEPT that rising CO2 has never caused a rise in temperatures, as illustrated by the ice cores.

Rising temperatures cause raised CO2. Not the reverse. Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha !!

The role is understood, but doesn't happen in real life. How very strange !
:think: :what:
Twit, twat, twaddle.
hadespussercats wrote:I've been de-sigged! :(

User avatar
Blind groper
Posts: 3997
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 3:10 am
About me: From New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Blind groper » Sun Aug 19, 2012 9:39 pm

mistermack wrote:
Rising temperatures cause raised CO2. Not the reverse.
Actually it does both.

An increase in temperature, as happened due to orbital changes over the past 3 million years from time to time, will lead to release of CO2.

However, an extreme release of CO2, as is happening right now leads to temperature rise. So, even though you find it strange that both are true, both are true.
For every human action, there is a rationalisation and a reason. Only sometimes do they coincide.

User avatar
Gawdzilla Sama
Stabsobermaschinist
Posts: 151265
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:24 am
About me: My posts are related to the thread in the same way Gliese 651b is related to your mother's underwear drawer.
Location: Sitting next to Ayaan in Domus Draconis, and communicating via PMs.
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Aug 19, 2012 9:49 pm

Blind groper wrote:However, an extreme release of CO2, as is happening right now leads to temperature rise. So, even though you find it strange that both are true, both are true.
True. Previous events didn't involve human-sourced CO2.
Image
Ein Ubootsoldat wrote:“Ich melde mich ab. Grüssen Sie bitte meine Kameraden.”

User avatar
macdoc
Twitcher
Posts: 9074
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 3:20 pm
Location: BirdWing Home FNQ
Contact:

Re: Why Global Warming does not bother me.

Post by macdoc » Mon Aug 20, 2012 1:50 am

Rising temperatures do not cause the release of entombed FOSSIL CO2.

It does cause the release of C02 from the oceans - one is a forcing, the other a feedback.
CO2 as a Feedback and Forcing in the Climate System
Zeke Hausfather October 25, 2007

A fundamental misconception about the role that carbon dioxide plays in glacial transitions has helped fuel the argument that the lag time between temperature and CO2 in the paleoclimate record casts doubt on carbon dioxide as an important greenhouse gas.

It’s crucial that media reporting on climate change understand an important distinction between the dual roles of greenhouse gases as both forcings and feedbacks.

In the geologic past, carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases acted primarily as feedbacks to external climate forcings. Our current and basically unprecedented experience is that we as humans are directly emitting carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases that affect climate change.
That distinction – greenhouse gases as both forcings and feedbacks – is critical in understanding the behavior of these gases in the paleoclimatic and present periods.
http://www.yaleclimatemediaforum.org/20 ... te-system/

If you truly wish to learn about climate science - we can help....if you are looking for a way out of your responsibility for the current rising temps.......ain't gonna happen.......deny all you want. :coffee:
Resident in Cairns Australia • Current ride> 2014 Honda CB500F • Travel photos https://500px.com/p/macdoc?view=galleries

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 9 guests