Announcement about RDF

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ficklefiend
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by ficklefiend » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:25 pm

MCJ wrote:I just logged on there, picked up a pm and sent one back.

It is my feeling that this was bound to happen after the purge of autumn 2008. I also believe that RD knows exactly what is going on and that actually, he wants rid of the forum altogether, that it is too big a monkey on his back. Let's be honest, he's not a man of the people (I'm with Mrs CJ on this one) and some of us are just not the right kind of person; intellectual snobbery always existed on the site from some parties, which is why Dawks came into being.

It's just a shame nobody there had the balls to come clean about it nor the manners to deal with people in a civilised way.

The way I see it, Richard has always posted more on the front page than in the forums, which he uses more as a resource when he wants some ideas, to ask something or to set something right. (wonder where those will fit in their pre-judged topics?) It is a bit odd to have two such separate things going on under one banner- quite often people on the front page didn't post to the forum and vice-versa. These "new" discussion boards seem to me to be in keeping with the front page way of doing things, except the content to be commented on can be added by anyone.. so long as it passes their judgement.

Sticking on topic is actually very hard, it's not the way our brains work or the way normal human conversation goes. It stifles debate because it stops new people adding new information. On very strict "on-topic" forums I have been in it often seems like people run out of things to say, because they must stick to such a narrow way of exploring the issue.

On the other hand, the front pages were always better when people were succinct and on-topic, because the comments were directly below articles I wanted to see what other people were saying about that, and not witness some silly argument between members or over things like spelling. For that very limited kind of discussion this format does work, it is easier to read and it is cleaner. It is also boring. It is also useless at building relationships between members and building discussion. It is also rampantly open to hit-and-runs and people not being taken to account for their views, because you can't challenge certain remarks and expand on them because you're "off-topic".

It's a miserable way to run a forum. :(
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by natselrox » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:25 pm

hackenslash wrote:
natselrox wrote:
hackenslash wrote:Nope. I thought it would strengthen the forum and bring in new members.
Are you still game with it?
I don't know. I'm going to give it some thought and, of course, much will depend on how successful we are in archiving the content.
But the copyright of those posts technically belonged to RD.net and if Josh is not willing to co-operate... :dono:

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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by Strontium Dog » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:26 pm

MCJ wrote:It is my feeling that this was bound to happen after the purge of autumn 2008. I also believe that RD knows exactly what is going on and that actually, he wants rid of the forum altogether, that it is too big a monkey on his back. Let's be honest, he's not a man of the people (I'm with Mrs CJ on this one) and some of us are just not the right kind of person; intellectual snobbery always existed on the site from some parties, which is why Dawks came into being.
See, if it was just that, you could understand it to some extent. Richard Dawkins doesn't owe anybody a place to debate stuff, and if it's becoming an embarrassment to him, then he has every right to say he wants nothing more to do with it.

But it's so much more: there has been a clear and sustained attempt to actively destroy the community. How hard would it have been to divorce the forum from Dawkins and let someone else host it? How hard would it have been to give people time to establish a new location away from RD.net? Why were all attempts to alert people to an alternative discussion area so vigorously stamped upon, to the extent that the forum itself has been locked and the accounts of the "ringleaders" deleted altogether?

It's as if Dawkins and his henchmen think they own the people who posted on that forum, clearly evidenced by their instruction not to attempt to "'relocate' groups of users to a separate forum".
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by laklak » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:26 pm

Well goddamnit, I go to bed and all is fine, then I get up, get my coffee, do my morning RDF run and KERBLAM, we've been fucking nuked. And I was REALLY confused until I changed this board style, I couldn't bloody read the pro-ubantu thingy. Tan on brown is just too much for these old eyes.

Looks like most of us made it onto the lifeboat, thanks for the avatar change Hack, I wouldn't have known to come here otherwise. And I'm seeing old RDFers I haven't seen in ages. HEY BELLA! HOW YOU DOING, GORGEOUS?

Ah well, boards come and boards go. Now I have to go do all the setup things and avatar stuff and sigs all over again.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by hackenslash » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:26 pm

natselrox wrote:But the copyright of those posts technically belonged to RD.net and if Josh is not willing to co-operate... :dono:
Indeed. It may have to take a slightly different form. We'll see.
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by I'm With Stupid » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:26 pm

Flora wrote:
MCJ wrote:I just logged on there, picked up a pm and sent one back.

It is my feeling that this was bound to happen after the purge of autumn 2008. I also believe that RD knows exactly what is going on and that actually, he wants rid of the forum altogether, that it is too big a monkey on his back. Let's be honest, he's not a man of the people (I'm with Mrs CJ on this one) and some of us are just not the right kind of person; intellectual snobbery always existed on the site from some parties, which is why Dawks came into being.

It's just a shame nobody there had the balls to come clean about it nor the manners to deal with people in a civilised way.
I think it comes down to 2 main things:

* not really knowing how to fix the forum problems (something to do with the backend) although I've been told by others that it could have been done
* not being willing to spend any more money on it to patch it up (which is always a useless solution anyway)

I don't think RD wanted to get rid of the forum at all but he'd take advice (as would the Foundation) from the tech people. If they said it can't be fixed and is draining the resources then they are going to approve the new system that's presented to them.

That's my hunch anyway.
Yep, that's my hunch too. They couldn't handle the size of the forum, and so "recommended" a solution that would allow them to keep their jobs rather than handing the project to a company that could handle it.

Morning everyone btw. Or afternoon. I just got up though, so that counts as morning.
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by ozewiezeloose » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:27 pm

Mazille wrote:Well, that and CJ and me telling the fuckers that we hope that this will hurt their chances with future employers, as well as some rather outspoken criticism by pretty much everyone.
Err... somehow I missed out on all the excitement! That's quite a feat for someone who visited the forum every day, innit? :what:

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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by Apollonius » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:27 pm

I changed my avatar over there to the one on the previous page here. Everyone should do it!
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by Heresiarch » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:28 pm

Flora wrote:The forum already focuses on the Foundation's goals in the core areas of Dawkins, Science & Reason. We had 2000+ posts per day in those core areas whereas the front page only gets a tenth of that. The other posts on the forum weren't all unrelated either eg the welcome forum is a joy to read as people tell their tales of escaping various religions or religious environments. The new discussion area may provide some of that but why replace something so worthwhile and successful at meeting RDFRS goals?
The front page is nothing but an astonishingly ineptly designed news source where you can get the latest information 3-4 days after it's been done to death elsewhere in the blogosphere. If it wasn't for the once every two tothree months that they post an interview with RD or one of his speeches, it wouldn't make it into my feed reader.
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by Taryn » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:29 pm

Warning: Unknown: failed to open stream: Permission denied in Unknown on line 0

Fatal error: Unknown: Failed opening required '/var/www/forum.richarddawkins.net/public_html/posting.php' (include_path='.:/usr/share/php:/usr/share/pear') in Unknown on line 0

:pissed:

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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by natselrox » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:29 pm

What kind of a sick bastard denies people the right to access the General Science Discussion and Evolution and Natural Selection sub-forums at RD.net? :lay:

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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by Witticism » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:30 pm

Blip wrote:
Witticism wrote: :nono: :nono: ... the game ... I'm getting the gang together ... we are going to finish that game FFS ... I want to be in one game where I last for more than one night! :biggrin:
And one more player arrives unscathed :td:
Hooray! :td:

Hey, are you packing heat in your Zimmer frame? (Given your age is 99 :ask: )
Jimmy Lee Farnsworth: Erwin, admit that you are a sinner.
Fletch: Uh. Well, I've sinned. I didn't take any Polaroids or anything. But, yeah, I've sinned.
Jimmy Lee Farnsworth: The Lord forgives ya!
Fletch: Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Amen. What? Other sins? Uh, I parked in a handicap spot on my way up here. Actually, on a handicap person. I told him I'd be back in five minutes, so that's not such a big deal.

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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by I'm With Stupid » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:30 pm

ficklefiend wrote:The way I see it, Richard has always posted more on the front page than in the forums, which he uses more as a resource when he wants some ideas, to ask something or to set something right.
Indeed. Does anyone remember a thread where he'd written a letter to the Times (I think) about Islam, and someone had replied with a refutation of what he said, and he came on the forum asking for evidence to back up the opinion he'd already given? I must admit, I lost a bit of respect for his intellectual integrity there, and I think several members called him out on it.
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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by Witticism » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:31 pm

natselrox wrote:What kind of a sick bastard denies people the right to access the General Science Discussion and Evolution and Natural Selection sub-forums at RD.net? :lay:
Maybe a fundie is holding a gun to his head ... literally ... that is the only logical explanation :think:
Jimmy Lee Farnsworth: Erwin, admit that you are a sinner.
Fletch: Uh. Well, I've sinned. I didn't take any Polaroids or anything. But, yeah, I've sinned.
Jimmy Lee Farnsworth: The Lord forgives ya!
Fletch: Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Amen. What? Other sins? Uh, I parked in a handicap spot on my way up here. Actually, on a handicap person. I told him I'd be back in five minutes, so that's not such a big deal.

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Re: Announcement about RDF

Post by I'm With Stupid » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:32 pm

natselrox wrote:
hackenslash wrote:
natselrox wrote:
hackenslash wrote:Nope. I thought it would strengthen the forum and bring in new members.
Are you still game with it?
I don't know. I'm going to give it some thought and, of course, much will depend on how successful we are in archiving the content.
But the copyright of those posts technically belonged to RD.net and if Josh is not willing to co-operate... :dono:
Then we'll have to threaten them over the copyright of our pictures, which aren't. ;)
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