"shall" vs "will"?

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MiM
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by MiM » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:11 pm

Tyrannical wrote:It also seems unnatural to say "Shall you pass your test tomorrow?" instead of "Will you pass your test tomorrow?". But both "I shall" and "I will" seem to work as responses.
"I shall" implies the intention, "I will" predicts the outcome...:ask:
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:13 pm

Bella Fortuna wrote:Bending someone to one's shall just doesn't have the same ring...
It shall if you give it a chance.
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Tyrannical » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:14 pm

Bella Fortuna wrote:Bending someone to one's shall just doesn't have the same ring...
But that is another meaning of the word "will" that does not have an equivalent in the definition of "shall".
A rational skeptic should be able to discuss and debate anything, no matter how much they may personally disagree with that point of view. Discussing a subject is not agreeing with it, but understanding it.
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Bella Fortuna » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:36 pm

Tyrannical wrote:
Bella Fortuna wrote:Bending someone to one's shall just doesn't have the same ring...
But that is another meaning of the word "will" that does not have an equivalent in the definition of "shall".
I'm writing you out of my shall! :lay:
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:38 pm

Bella Fortuna wrote:
Tyrannical wrote:
Bella Fortuna wrote:Bending someone to one's shall just doesn't have the same ring...
But that is another meaning of the word "will" that does not have an equivalent in the definition of "shall".
I'm writing you out of my shall! :lay:
I shan't be posting in this thread again.
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Jason » Sun Apr 28, 2013 8:28 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:
Azathoth wrote:Shall is archaic and rarely used. That is all your students need to know
Shall we discuss that?
Precisely. Shall is still used in more rarefied discussion in the presumptive subjunctive form and, most commonly, in the inquisitive subjunctive.

'Shall we discuss that?' could be translated to common English as 'Should we discuss that?' or 'Do we really want to discuss that?'* depending on the tone and inflection with which it is spoken.

*Actually 'We should not be discussing that.' would be more appropriate. In that sense it changes an interrogative into a presumptive subjunctive. :teef:
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by tattuchu » Sun Apr 28, 2013 8:45 pm

You use "shall" if you want to sound posh, British, or gay. All the same thing, actually :tea:
People think "queue" is just "q" followed by 4 silent letters.

But those letters are not silent.

They're just waiting their turn.
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Cormac » Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:10 pm

Bella Fortuna wrote:Bending someone to one's shall just doesn't have the same ring...

...although it has a certain ring to it...


:naughty:
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by John_fi_Skye » Sun Apr 28, 2013 11:04 pm

When it's the "normal" future tense ("future indicative active"), "shall" is first person, while "will" is second and third.

"I shall try it tomorrow."
"You will find this the best way to do it."
"He will start painting the house on Tuesday."

When it's implying determination that something must (or must not) happen, it's the other way round.

"I will never allow it."
"You shall do as I say."
"They shall not pass."

Having said all that, it's true that "shall" is indeed fading out, and becoming archaic.
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Apr 28, 2013 11:27 pm

I shall never stop using shall, e'en if the gates of Will yawn open before me.
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by John_fi_Skye » Sun Apr 28, 2013 11:29 pm

Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I shall never stop using shall, e'en if the gates of Will yawn open before me.
:tup: Sometimes you sound so BRITISH! :td:
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Sun Apr 28, 2013 11:32 pm

John_fi_Skye wrote:
Gawdzilla Sama wrote:I shall never stop using shall, e'en if the gates of Will yawn open before me.
:tup: Sometimes you sound so BRITISH! :td:
There's a lotr of Brit in me mind.
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by JacksSmirkingRevenge » Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:16 am

I'm rapidly losing the shall to live. :sigh:
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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by FBM » Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:21 am

I shon't ask this kind of question again...
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken

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Re: "shall" vs "will"?

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:22 am

Thread's turned into a shanty town.
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