Motorcycles

[FBM]

Loud pipes save lives.

[The_Metatron]

Loud pipes save lives.

You know, I've heard this for decades. I've never once seen or heard of any study to demonstrate it.

[macdoc]

KLR650 had a varient for the military with a diesel engine and huge tank. KLR does a good job for me in Australia - hopefully this year with a new seat and larger windscreen some longer trips in order .....mind you a couple were 400k plus with a good junk on dirt and tracks.

[FBM]

Loud pipes save lives.

You know, I've heard this for decades. I've never once seen or heard of any study to demonstrate it.

I admit that it'd be hard to do a study on accidents that were prevented. But as a cage driver, I know when a Harley or something with loud pipes is nearby, and to the best of my memory I've never even come close to changing lanes and inadvertently pushing one off into a ditch. The quiet bikes, however, fit quite well into the blind spots in my mirrors and I've nearly run a few off the road. It's anecdotal and subjective, but that's all I've got to work with on this one. Also, back when I used to drive loud bikes, I knew I could just rev the enginge if it looked like someone was unaware of me and about to do something dangerous. The pipes overcome a stereo system better than a horn. Again, just in my experience.

[The_Metatron]

I'd think you could analyze crashes, if you could get data on aftermarket exhausts on the crashed bikes. If the claim of loud pipes save lives is true, bikes with loud exhausts should be underrepresented in crashes. Getting to that data is the trick.

[FBM]

I'd think you could analyze crashes, if you could get data on aftermarket exhausts on the crashed bikes. If the claim of loud pipes save lives is true, bikes with loud exhausts should be underrepresented in crashes. Getting to that data is the trick.

Yeah, it's a tough one. I don't know of anyone who's done any work on that. That's why I fall back on direct experience. Not much choice.

[The_Metatron]

Macdoc asked me what motorcycle I ride. Better than that, here's my motorcycle owning history:









I was thinking of selling that BMW, as I'm not riding it so much. But, no one was interested at the price I was asking, and I'm not about to give it away for less than its worth. So, it remains in my stable.

[The_Metatron]

I'd think you could analyze crashes, if you could get data on aftermarket exhausts on the crashed bikes. If the claim of loud pipes save lives is true, bikes with loud exhausts should be underrepresented in crashes. Getting to that data is the trick.

Yeah, it's a tough one. I don't know of anyone who's done any work on that. That's why I fall back on direct experience. Not much choice.

I think about the acoustics of the situation. The huge majority of the sound pressure from these loud exhaust systems is to the rear of the bike. Everyone knows this effect when one of these things passes you at speed. You don't know its there until it goes by, and it startles you. That effect is precisely why I am dubious about the claim.

I'd think the gigantic majority of bike crashes involving cars are with the impact on the front of the bike. You just don't see a lot of crashes with bikes backing into things at any sort of speeds.

[JacksSmirkingRevenge]

The faster you go, the more noise you make.
Making lots of noise saves lives.
Therefore, driving really fast is the safest thing to do.
It's obvious.







Edit - Disclaimer:- Logic may be flawed.

[The_Metatron]

You know, there certainly exist those who will believe that.

[JacksSmirkingRevenge]

Sorted.

[FBM]

Well, sometimes you can hear things you can't see, sometimes you can see things you can't hear. Seems to me that the more input of both increases your chances of detecting them. Flashing lights help, so do sirens. Seems that that's the rationale behind emergency vehicles using both to the extreme.

[Kristie]

Hubby just drove his to our new house! It's been parked at his parents' place all summer nearly! I think I'm more excited than he is.

[Cormac]

The problem is compounded by the fact that quite a few modern sportsbikes are serious combat weapons speed wise. Take a look, for example, at the new BMW S1000RR. This is a beast. Even with anti-lock brakes and traction control aids, it takes a skilled rider to explore anything other than a fraction of the envelope of that machine. The road going version is somewhat detuned with respect to the racing machine it's based on, but even so, 179 BHP at the back wheel is a huge amount of power for a road bike. This is a machine that can propel a rider from 0 to 125 mph in about 5½ seconds. The reaction time needed to handle that on the road is right up there with the reaction time needed to handle an F-15 in combat, and F-15 pilots receive a hell of a lot more training. Plus, an F-15 usually has a lot more space between it and other traffic even in a dogfight, and the advantage of being able to operate in three dimensions. Trouble is, how many people buying one of these will possess the level of skill and the reaction time required to stay out of trouble on crowded roads?

Even some smaller bikes can place heavy demands upon skill and reaction time. Back in the days when Aprilia was producing the RS250, this was a 250cc bike capable of nearly 140 mph. You had to have awesome riding skills to make full use of the ridiculously revvy engine, and if you slipped just 1rpm out of the powerband, it bogged like crazy, but it was seriously maniacal fun for those who could live with it. Of course, it could get you into a lot of trouble if you behaved like a hooligan, and unfortunately, it was the weapon of choice for quite a few UK hooligans. Many of whom bitterly regretted skimping on the need for expensive synthetic oil for the powerplant, when they were faced with a hefty bill for new pistons after less than 6000 miles, though Putoline TTX (the recommended oil for the bike back in the late 90s) cost a king's ransom. If you tried running an RS250 on cheap oil, you could find yourself going "Earth, sky, Earth, sky, Earth, ambulance" as a result of an engine seizure when trying to be a knee-slider hero on a roundabout, and strictly speaking, any remaining RS250s are becoming collector's items. Trouble with RS250s was that they were knife-edge thin, and correspondingly about as visible in car rear view mirrors as a gnat a kilometre away.

Then you have those weird Japanese 400s, scaled down versions of bigger 750cc and 1,000cc bikes that were grey imports here in the UK. Again, revvy little buggers, small, hard to see despite lairy paint schemes, known as 'pocket rockets' to those in the know, and which acquired a reputation for ending up in the wrong hands. Not a happy mix on a rainy motorway.

Cali - is there a limit to your knowledge and expertise?

[SteveB]

He doesn't know much about lederhosen. Don't bring it up around him, though. It only makes him sad.