Fantasy Series

[JimC]

This thread is meant to be a serious discussion about the merits or otherwise of fantasy novels, but particularly fantasy series. This initial post of mine will be fairly massive – it will list and perhaps describe some of the series I have read over the years, divided (with some trepidation) into first and second ranks. One of the main criteria for putting series into one or the other is how compelled I am to re-read a given series, an admittedly subjective measure, but I hope that some universal literary merits are also a part of my judgment. I have compiled this post off line, over some time…

There is a particular and interesting genre of fantasy novels which basically posit some form of magical world operating in parallel to our current, mundane world, mostly invisibly but with mutual impact. I will term such series “Potter Worlds”, for obvious reasons…

Series that I have put into the first ranking are not without their faults, which I may describe in future posts. Series in the second rank are not without their charms. There is no particular order involved…

First Rank

Lord of the Rings and associated works, by JRR Tolkien. The standard by which all are judged…

The Wizard of Earthsea, by Ursula LeGuin. Simply magnificent, quite unique in its treatment of magic, with jewel like writing.

The First, Second and Final Chronicles of Thomas Covenant, by Stephen Donaldson. This series is extraordinary in the scope of its imagined world. The writing can be a little verbose, and he loves to use extremely rare words. A little obsessive about the psychological torments of his leprosy-affected protagonist, as well…

The Wheel of Time series, by Robert Jordan, completed by Brandon Sanderson after Jordan’s death. Again, a brilliantly imagined world, with a detailed back-story and an interesting take on the mechanics of its version of magical powers, channeling… Arguably too long…

The Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser series by Fritz Lieber. Clever, funny, and refreshingly roguish heroes.

The Harry Potter books, by JK Rowling (the eponymous example of a ‘Potter World”)

Various novels by Michael Moorcock centered on Elric of Melnibone. Classics in their genre…

The Riftwar Saga (Magician et al) by Raymond Feist. The first 3 books are excellent. He continued with many follow-up books, all of which seemed tired in comparison to the original trilogy.

The Soul Drinker Trilogy by Jo Clayton (plus many others by this talented and underappreciated author). All of her writings have an interesting left-wing twist, unusual in fantasy writing. A very talented writer…

The Black Company novels by Glen Cook, which took fantasy into the sensibility of an amoral Vietnam vet… (and other series by this excellent author)

The War God series by David Weber (one of my favorite hard SF authors, who also writes a mean fantasy novel)

The Saga of the Exiles by Julian May (some would argue this is SF rather than fantasy – I see it as fitting the boundary). Very different, strong focus on mental powers.

The Dark is Rising series by Susan Cooper (often seen as children’s books, but more universal than that)

The Discworld novels by Terry Pratchett. I know that many in the forum are fans… So much humour, so many brilliantly sly digs at social norms…

The Laundry Files by Charles Stross This a fairly dark example of a Potter World, set in Britain, with an MI5 style agency charged with dealing with paranormal threats.

The Rivers of London series, by Ben Aaronovitch. Another modern British take on the Potter World sub-genre, well worth a read.

The Witch World saga, by Andre Norton. These are old favorites of mine, which I must re-read soon

Dragonflight and subsequent books set on Pern, by Anne McCaffrey. Another series on the boundary between SF and fantasy. The nature of the partnership between man and dragon is the warm heart of this series.

Second Rank

The Shannara Series, by Terry Brooks. As I commented in another thread, this is a highly derivative series, mainly using tropes from LOTR. However, it has some interesting touches in its imagined world, amongst the fairly pedestrian writing.

The Fionavar Tapestry, by Guy Gavriel Kay. An interesting trilogy, which uses one of the classic tropes of the genre, people from our world being transported by magical means to a fantasy world. The writing is a little flowery and over-blown at times, but still generally good.

A trilogy beginning with “The Riddle-Master of Hed” by Patricia McKillip. An interesting, but very quirky series.

The Xanth novels by Piers Anthony. Very, very corny, but sometimes quite amusing.

Various books such as Waylander and Legend, set in various historical points of the same imagined world, by David Gemmel. Lots and lots of blood, gore and battle scenes.

The Darwth Trilogy by Barbara Hambly. Another example of the trope where humans from our world are transported to a world of magic.

A series of books starting with “The Wizard of 4th Street” by Simon Hawke. A classic example of a Potter World. Somewhat lightweight, but with a good leavening of humour.

The Magician’s Law trilogy by Michael Scott. A fantasy world with warring gods, heavily influenced by Irish folk law. Worth a read.

[JimC]

How could I have forgotten "Conan the Barbarian" and subsequent books by Robert Jordan? Classics of the genre! For all that they are the pulps of the fantasy world, I'm tempted to put them in first rank.

As for what many will see as a yawning gap in my lists, I cannot bring myself to read Game of Thrones.

So shoot me...

Edit - Of course, the original Conan was by Robert E Howard, but Robert Jordan added to the series after Howard's death.

[Brian Peacock]

I'd forgotten The Saga Of The Exiles. I loved those and devoured them during the mid-late 80s. And I had a collection of a few of Howard's novellas, Conan and Jiral Meets Magic among them. I used to enjoy the form, but got a bit board by second rate knock offs perhaps. I prefer my fantasy to be of the engineering variety these days.

[Animavore]

Not a fan of LOTR at all. It's far too black and white in its portrayal of good and evil.

Reading The Kingkiller Chronicles right now, a yarn spun properly. Also slowly tipping through Malazan.

No mention of A Song of Ice and Fire? Seriously?!

[JimC]

In my second post I mentioned that Game of Thrones is not one I want to read, although funnily enough I enjoyed some of Martin's SF stories in his early days as a writer...

[Animavore]

[pErvinalia]

As I've said before I'm a massive fan of Feist, particularly the Magician and Riftwar series, and any books featuring Jimmy the Hand. Interestingly, with the latter, there's very little fantasy going on from memory. They are more like adventure novels. Like a Wilbur Smith set in a fantasy world where magic and dragons pop up occasionally. Having said that, Wilbur Smith blends legend, perception, and outright magic in his series of books involving Taita the Warlock. If you like adventure with a bit of magic and mystery thrown in, hunt them down. You have to use a bit of imaginative thinking in working out which order to read them. I chose chronological in terms of the story setting (as opposed to the chronological order that Smith wrote them).

I couldn't get into the Thomas Covenant books. I can't remember why, but they didn't do it for me. Same with David Eddings' stuff.

I've also mentioned a few times that I don't like the Wheel of Time books (I think I've got as far as about book 5 or so). I know why I don't like them, but my mind is too fuzzy these days to explain it properly. In it's most basic sense, the characters are all horribly cliched. I can't stand any of them.

I also hated the Harry Potter books (I think I could only read the first 2 or 3), but love the movies. I really hate "accidental hero" narratives, and if Pug didn't turn into a fucking magician legend destroyer of worlds in the Magician series by Feist (and if Thomas didn't turn into a darkly troubled dragon riding sex lord), I would have not enjoyed that series either. Pug's accidental hero schtick in the first (and maybe second too?) book was really annoying to me. But didn't he fucking come good in the end!! Regarding the Potter movies, I think the other characters and the broader stories and of course the fantastic visuals reduce the "accidental hero" narrative to a minor side show for me. And he did of course become a real legend in the end. I just couldn't read 9 books (or however many there were) waiting for that to happen.

I picked up the Game of Thrones book one in a second hand bookshop in Shepparton a few years ago when they were really hard to find. But I've never got around to reading it. I got sick of the TV series, and it's kind of soured the whole thing for me. I will read it eventually.

I'm not a fantasy aficionado, so I'm not into this stuff for the sake of it. It's got to be a good read for me to stick with it. I've picked up a fair bit of random fantasy stuff from charity shops and second hand book shops over the years, but still haven't read a lot of it. One pick I read last year was actually really good. Never heard of the author before (she's Australian), but I enjoyed the book. Not just because of the fantasy and readability aspects, but it's refreshing to read a fantasy novel that doesn't involve kings and princes etc hooking up with hot 14 year old girls (which seems to be a common old man fantasy of a lot of the male authors of fantasy and adventure I've read over the years). I think women have a lot to contribute to this genre to take away some of the sexist tropes that infect books of this ilk.

Oh, and that last book was "The Whisper of Leaves" by K.S.Nikakis. It's a series, but I've only ever found book 1. One day I might actually have to pay real money to get the rest of the series delivered to me.

[laklak]

A Song of Ice and Fire is definitely first rank, don't let the hubbub about the HBO series (which is also great) spoil it. I just hope the miserable cunt finishes it.

Mazalan is a looong read, but not as long and MUCH better written than Wheel of Time. I never finished WoT, got too tired of wading through all the birchings and braid-tugging, not to mention Rand's interminable struggle against the taint of saidin. Reminds me of fucking Frodo in the movies. Just let the hate flow through you, goddamnit. I do intend to eventually finish it, but don't think I can manage the whole series again.

The Dark Tower is one of my favorites, but I generally like King. I know some don't.

[pErvinalia]

[pErvinalia]

The Dark Tower is one of my favorites, but I generally like King. I know some don't.

I want to read Dark Tower again. I picked up a copy in a charity shop a while ago with a view to rereading it. The first time I read it I wasn't really into any fantasy other than LOTR, and as it was a King book, I don't think I was quite expecting what it was. So I didn't really enjoy it, but I think i was probably in the wrong frame of mind at the time. I want to reread it and just accept it solely for what it is, not what it isn't.

I also forgot to mention probably my favourite fantasy series behind Feist's stuff. It's by Brian Lumley and it's his Necroscope series. It's not highbrow in the slightest and it's an entirely hollywoodesque mix of Jason Bourne, vampires, and wormholes and other worlds. I fucking love it. A martial artist butt-kicking spy vampire fantasy! What more could you want?!

[pErvinalia]

And the vampires are bad ass. Not like the ridiculous pussies in the Twilight saga.

[JimC]

rEv, you mentioned Eddings, who I'd forgotten to include. The Belgariad (and 2 other series) are definitely in the second rank, and are a bit corny, but at the same time quite inventive.

I'll expand a bit on what I called the "Potter World" sub-genre, where a mostly hidden magical world co-incides with our current time and place. Perhaps the "Potter World" name is misleading, because most of them are not children's books (although of course, towards the end, the Potter series got fairly dark too...)

Here are two good examples of this sub-genre:

The Harry Dresden files, a dozen books starting with "Storm Front", centred on a modern wizard in the US called Harry Dresden. He acts as a sort of wizard P.I. for hire, and the unseen world he inhabits has many weird and dangerous creatures. Fairly gritty and well written.

A similar series from England by Benedict Jacka features a wizard named Alex Verus. An interesting dissection of a magical world into many different specialities...

As for Wheel of Time, it seems that you are either a fan (and it has a fanatical fan base) or you dislike it. I'm not unaware of its failings, particularly a tendency to go on and on about relatively minor details, but it is a remarkably well fleshed-out fantasy world, with probably the biggest range of characters ever... I can enjoy a wide range of books, while still understanding their flaws...

[JimC]

pErvinalia wrote:

Not just because of the fantasy and readability aspects, but it's refreshing to read a fantasy novel that doesn't involve kings and princes etc hooking up with hot 14 year old girls (which seems to be a common old man fantasy of a lot of the male authors of fantasy and adventure I've read over the years). I think women have a lot to contribute to this genre to take away some of the sexist tropes that infect books of this ilk.

Two great examples of switching the roles, and producing strong female leads are the various series by Jo Clayton. She has written both SF and fantasy, and (as I mentioned in the OP) has a lefty bias, unusual in the genre.

Then there are the Telzey Amberdon books by American author James H. Schmitz. They are SF rather than fantasy, and focus on "Psionic" mind powers. They were written by a man in the early 70's, but he convincingly shows a feisty young female protagonist.

[pErvinalia]

The Harry Dresden files, a dozen books starting with "Storm Front", centred on a modern wizard in the US called Harry Dresden. He acts as a sort of wizard P.I. for hire, and the unseen world he inhabits has many weird and dangerous creatures. Fairly gritty and well written.

This sounds really interesting. Someone send me the book for my birthday! (Tatt, you listening to this?)

[Scot Dutchy]

Definitely not my genre. Tried reading the Hobbit once. Boring was not the word. Mind numbing would be nearer.