Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies courses?

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Brian Peacock » Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:50 pm

It's a cross we both have to bear.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by JimC » Sat Jan 06, 2018 8:40 pm

I really miss him...

You know, Gladly, my cross-eyed bear...
Nurse, where the fuck's my cardigan?
And my gin!

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by laklak » Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:59 am

:lol:
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Forty Two » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:03 pm

Brian Peacock wrote:
Forty Two wrote:
NineBerry wrote:I didn't say you ignored the question. I said you failed at answering it. http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... 9#p1735179

And you were the one who brought up the topic of whether there are male bodies. While I was discussing the question that there must be genes that determine gender.
Well, if you think there are genes that determine gender (a social construction) then it would be incumbent upon you to present the evidence for that in the genome. My understanding to genetics is that there is not a gene or set of genes that determines a person's gender.
NineBerry wrote: So, do you have any evidence or logical argument why there are no gender genes. And further: Will you take the time necessary to understand that science does indeed say that there are love genes?
Well, yeah, the absence of evidence of there being genes that determine gender.

Well, I'm willing to consider this love gene assertion. However, you'll need to perhaps tell me more detail about what you mean by a "love gene." I suspect I know what you're on about, and it's half pop-science. But, I'll let you provide the support for your assertion.

What is advanced without evidence can be rejected without evidence. So far, you've said that there are genes that determine your gender, and a "love gene." Well, present your evidence. Until then, rejecting your claim is as simple as saying you've not proved it.
What is gender?
Ask Nineberry, he's the one who is sure there's a gene for it.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Forty Two » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:03 pm

Brian Peacock wrote:
Forty Two wrote:
NineBerry wrote:I didn't say you ignored the question. I said you failed at answering it. http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... 9#p1735179

And you were the one who brought up the topic of whether there are male bodies. While I was discussing the question that there must be genes that determine gender.
Well, if you think there are genes that determine gender (a social construction) then it would be incumbent upon you to present the evidence for that in the genome. My understanding to genetics is that there is not a gene or set of genes that determines a person's gender.
NineBerry wrote: So, do you have any evidence or logical argument why there are no gender genes. And further: Will you take the time necessary to understand that science does indeed say that there are love genes?
Well, yeah, the absence of evidence of there being genes that determine gender.

Well, I'm willing to consider this love gene assertion. However, you'll need to perhaps tell me more detail about what you mean by a "love gene." I suspect I know what you're on about, and it's half pop-science. But, I'll let you provide the support for your assertion.

What is advanced without evidence can be rejected without evidence. So far, you've said that there are genes that determine your gender, and a "love gene." Well, present your evidence. Until then, rejecting your claim is as simple as saying you've not proved it.
What is gender?
Ask Nineberry, he's the one who is sure there's a gene for it.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Forty Two » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:05 pm

laklak wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:
laklak wrote: I wear socks with flip flops in the winter.
Oo, you saucy minx you. :swoon:
Don't hate me because I'm beautiful.
It's Florida. We wear winter clothing when the temperature dips below 22 celsius.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by NineBerry » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:11 pm

Not a gene. Genes!

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Forty Two » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:20 pm

LOL - go ahead and present the evidence. Link? Citation? Which genes are you referring to?
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by NineBerry » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:29 pm

It's a hypothesis. It is based on the same logical path that says there are probably genes that control sexual orientation. The case for genes that control sexual orientation (love genes) is very good actually.

What would be the alternative? The only alternative I can think of would be that either the genes that control gender are either the exact same ones that control sex (which seems unlikely) or that gender is actually not controlled by genes at all which is a blank slate hypothesis of gender whereby gender is only made by society. Men only behave like men because that's what is expected of them. I would be very surprised if you followed this hypothesis because you are usually opposed to the idea that anything is "a social construct"

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Brian Peacock » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:37 pm

Forty Two wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:
Forty Two wrote:
NineBerry wrote:I didn't say you ignored the question. I said you failed at answering it. http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... 9#p1735179

And you were the one who brought up the topic of whether there are male bodies. While I was discussing the question that there must be genes that determine gender.
Well, if you think there are genes that determine gender (a social construction) then it would be incumbent upon you to present the evidence for that in the genome. My understanding to genetics is that there is not a gene or set of genes that determines a person's gender.
NineBerry wrote: So, do you have any evidence or logical argument why there are no gender genes. And further: Will you take the time necessary to understand that science does indeed say that there are love genes?
Well, yeah, the absence of evidence of there being genes that determine gender.

Well, I'm willing to consider this love gene assertion. However, you'll need to perhaps tell me more detail about what you mean by a "love gene." I suspect I know what you're on about, and it's half pop-science. But, I'll let you provide the support for your assertion.

What is advanced without evidence can be rejected without evidence. So far, you've said that there are genes that determine your gender, and a "love gene." Well, present your evidence. Until then, rejecting your claim is as simple as saying you've not proved it.
What is gender?
Ask Nineberry, he's the one who is sure there's a gene for it.
A definition is necessary to your point, as quoted.
Rationalia relies on voluntary donations. There is no obligation of course, but if you value this place and want to see it continue please consider making a small donation towards the forum's running costs.
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There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

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"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Forty Two » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:42 pm

Oh, so you called me a homophobe based on my unwillingness to accept your hypothesis without evidence.

Where is your case for the "love genes?"

I'm never opposed to things being a "social construct." There are many social constructs. What I oppose is the arguemnt that because something is a social construct, it is bad and must be ignored or defeated, as if we ought not have any social constructs, or that some new social construct is better/worse than the previous social construct. Social constructs serve vital functions in human interactions.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Forty Two » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:43 pm

Brian Peacock wrote:
Forty Two wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:
Forty Two wrote:
NineBerry wrote:I didn't say you ignored the question. I said you failed at answering it. http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... 9#p1735179

And you were the one who brought up the topic of whether there are male bodies. While I was discussing the question that there must be genes that determine gender.
Well, if you think there are genes that determine gender (a social construction) then it would be incumbent upon you to present the evidence for that in the genome. My understanding to genetics is that there is not a gene or set of genes that determines a person's gender.
NineBerry wrote: So, do you have any evidence or logical argument why there are no gender genes. And further: Will you take the time necessary to understand that science does indeed say that there are love genes?
Well, yeah, the absence of evidence of there being genes that determine gender.

Well, I'm willing to consider this love gene assertion. However, you'll need to perhaps tell me more detail about what you mean by a "love gene." I suspect I know what you're on about, and it's half pop-science. But, I'll let you provide the support for your assertion.

What is advanced without evidence can be rejected without evidence. So far, you've said that there are genes that determine your gender, and a "love gene." Well, present your evidence. Until then, rejecting your claim is as simple as saying you've not proved it.
What is gender?
Ask Nineberry, he's the one who is sure there's a gene for it.
A definition is necessary to your point, as quoted.
A definition is necessary for Nineberry's point. Mine point was only that Nineberry provided no evidence for his point, and he also provided no definition for gender.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by laklak » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:45 pm

Not pissing in the streets downtown is a social construct around these parts, but not in Swaziland. Over there you can drain the lizard wherever you want.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Brian Peacock » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:46 pm

Forty Two wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:
Forty Two wrote: ...

Ask Nineberry, he's the one who is sure there's a gene for it.
A definition is necessary to your point, as quoted.
A definition is necessary for Nineberry's point. Mine point was only that Nineberry provided no evidence for his point, and he also provided no definition for gender.
So neither of you know what you're arguing for/against. OK. Nonetheless, you're forwarding a point that stands regardless of NineBerry's - so what is gender, as you see it?
Rationalia relies on voluntary donations. There is no obligation of course, but if you value this place and want to see it continue please consider making a small donation towards the forum's running costs.
Details on how to do that can be found here.

.

"It isn't necessary to imagine the world ending in fire or ice.
There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

Frank Zappa

"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
.

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Re: Gender Studies - what is taught in gender studies course

Post by Forty Two » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:56 pm

That's not accurate. I know what I'm arguing against. I'm arguing against a proposition offered without evidence, which may be rejected without evidence.

I'm not answering until Nineberry provides a definition. That gambit is typical. Someone advances a position, then refuses to define their terms and it's left to someone arguing against the point to define the terms. That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.

I have not "forwarded a point that stands regardless of Nineberry's." My position is that Nineberry doesn't have any evidence for his proposition, and he confirmed that. He confirmed he was simply advancing a hypothesis. The other day, my failure to accpet that hypothesis made me a "homophobe" in his mind.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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