The horrors of MTV Cribs

[charlou]

wouldn't it be wonderful if we could transfer such outrage and dynamic social change to the most important problems facing humanity today?

Yes, of course!

It would help if we could all agree what that dynamic social change should entail ...

[devogue]

wouldn't it be wonderful if we could transfer such outrage and dynamic social change to the most important problems facing humanity today?

Yes, of course!

It would help if we could all agree what that dynamic social change should entail ...

I think the collapse of needless consumerism for a start - the amount of useless shit I ahve bought over the past fifteen years scares the hell out of me. Our society is built on throw-away consumerism, the need to have the newest, the shiniest toys and crap.

You've opened up a very interesting area for discussion, Charlou.

[Animavore]

I absolutely hate that show Cribs and every other show MTV puts out. It is the most superficial shite I've seen. Not that I'm a snob or anything, its just superficial shit bores the shit out of my. Why would I want to watch a flashy tour of someone's house when I could watch a BBC documentary and listen to David Attenborough's sobering voice or watch The Mythbusters blow shit up? I'm not sure what type of person watches Cribs. I'm guessing teenage girls, probably cheerleaders and gays.

[devogue]

I absolutely hate that show Cribs and every other show MTV puts out. It is the most superficial shite I've seen. Not that I'm a snob or anything, its just superficial shit bores the shit out of my. Why would I want to watch a flashy tour of someone's house when I could watch a BBC documentary and listen to David Attenborough's sobering voice or watch The Mythbusters blow shit up? I'm not sure what type of person watches Cribs. I'm guessing teenage girls, probably cheerleaders and gays.

[/shakes his pom poms]

[Animavore]

I absolutely hate that show Cribs and every other show MTV puts out. It is the most superficial shite I've seen. Not that I'm a snob or anything, its just superficial shit bores the shit out of my. Why would I want to watch a flashy tour of someone's house when I could watch a BBC documentary and listen to David Attenborough's sobering voice or watch The Mythbusters blow shit up? I'm not sure what type of person watches Cribs. I'm guessing teenage girls, probably cheerleaders and gays.

[/shakes his pom poms]

You're gay!? And I thought I was safe.

[charlou]

You've opened up a very interesting area for discussion, Charlou.

You're talking about the "Dev, you're gorgeous" comment, right?

But really, I think it's you who has raised (down boy!) something very important here, and I thank you for it.





It was my son's eleventh birthday the other day. He got a nice lego set, a ps3 game and a few other things, and some money. He went shopping with his father, who added some more money to what he had. He came home with this (don't be fooled by the little picture - it's almost a metre in length):



You fucking beauty! No doubt he's been seeing this thing advertised during the children's cartoons on Saturday mornings, looking really exciting and cool fun, colour and movement employed to the max ...

He brought it home and wanted six D batteries to operate the automatic firing. We didn't have any and I didn't feel happy about buying them. For a while now I've avoided toys that cannot use AA rechargable batteries. So, he'd had it less than 24 hours and regretted buying it (this is one for all of us to learn from, methinks). One hundred dollars to whoever the fuck sells that thing and we have a useless piece of plastic crap.

I'm already getting thoroughly cheesed off with Christmas and the obligation of it. Birthday obligations are similarly stressful. It's all just so absurd.

And that's just scratching the surface.

[devogue]

You've opened up a very interesting area for discussion, Charlou.

You're talking about the "Dev, you're gorgeous" comment, right?

On that subject there is no requirement for discussion.

But really, I think it's you who has raised (down boy!) something very important here, and I thank you for it.





It was my son's eleventh birthday the other day. He got a nice lego set, a ps3 game and a few other things, and some money. He went shopping with his father, who added some more money to what he had. He came home with this (don't be fooled by the little picture - it's almost a metre in length):



You fucking beauty!

It is beautiful, and while I will denigrate it I will also accept that it blows a hole in my argument - where did he get it so I can get one for myself the Devlet?

No doubt he's been seeing this thing advertised during the children's cartoons on Saturday mornings, looking really exciting and cool fun, colour and movement employed to the max ...

Rule number one in our new world order is a very simple one. Ban ALL advertising. Ban ALL marketing. Big corporate globalisation instantly dies...

He brought it home and wanted six D batteries to operate the automatic firing. We didn't have any and I didn't feel happy about buying them. For a while now I've avoided toys that cannot use AA rechargable batteries. So, he'd had it less that 24 hours and regretted buying it (this is one for all of us to learn from, methinks). One hundred dollars to whoever the fuck sells that thing and we have a useless piece of plastic crap.

Dispose of it on ebay - while consumerism still exists we can make it small via the internet, selling to a global market on an individual basis.

I'm already getting thoroughly cheesed off with Christmas and the obligation of it. Birthday obligations are similarly stressful. It's all just so absurd.

Absolutely agreed. This Christmas everyone here has been tightening their belts and it's been wonderfully refreshing. Lucy got a bike from Santa, Jordan got an MP3...apart from a few small things from us that was it. We forbade grandparents, aunts and uncles from buying them anything. I bought a beautiful little necklace from a local artisan for Mrs Dev, she bought me a lovely Aran jumper. That was it.

On Christmas Day we had a nice meal and we shared one bottle of wine. We walked and played in the snow - we even played charades. I read for Mrs Dev when the kids were asleep, her legs lay across mine. It was lovely, and it beat the shit out of mountains and mountains of wrapping paper, dozens of bottles of wine and grams of coke (well, maybe not the coke).

We have forgotten the joys of simplicity and companionship and love.

And that's just scratching the surface.

Damn right.

[Bella Fortuna]

I could not agree more with both of you (and, coincidentally, my son got something very similar to that, Charlou, from his dad... he was always sensitive to my hatred of guns and things gun-like ). Every year Christmas and birthdays completely stress me out because I never know what to get for everyone, and there are so many family members to buy for (we've never done anything sensible like select one person to exchange with) that it's a huge overall expense, AND 90% of the time what's given is nothing needed, it's all superfluous crap...

[maiforpeace]

I was poking around on the wiki page for natural disasters by death toll. Famine is responsible for the some of the largest numbers. How is famine a natural disaster today? Of all the natural disasters that were listed on the page isn't starvation something we could intervene with and reduce or prevent?

Recent famines:

26,000-1,000,000 Bangladesh famine of 1974—Official records claim 26,000. However, various sources claim about 1,000,000. Bangladesh 1974
1,000,000 1984–1985 famine in Ethiopia Ethiopia 1984
1,200,000 North Korean famine North Korea 1996–1998

[Chinaski]

We've solved it by resorting to books, films and cash. We're all intellectuals, so books and films cover that, and any divergence in personal taste is safeguarded by the versatility of cash. (I used mine to buy a hip flask, a pipe, a bottle of Jameson, and some clothes )

[devogue]

"The protection of creation is not principally a response to an aesthetic need, but much more to a moral need, inasmuch as nature expresses a plan of love and truth which is prior to us and which comes from God," he said.

To illustrate his point, the German-born pope pointed to the experiences of eastern Europe under the "materialistic and atheistic regimes" of the former Soviet bloc.

"Was it not easy to see the great harm which an economic system lacking any reference to the truth about man had done not only to the dignity and freedom of individuals and peoples, but to nature itself, by polluting soil, water and air?" he asked.

"The denial of God distorts the freedom of the human person, yet it also devastates creation."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... copenhagen

I know he began by discussing "atheistic regimes" but by inference it also seems that the man presiding over $15,000,000,000 of assets will keep insisting that my willful (wrong) denial of the existance of an imaginary being has not only distorted (perverted?) my freedom, but it has also devastated my environment - you may safely assume that my atheistic tears in this thread, and my frustrated cries, were mere lies summoned from a well of pure evil.

[Lozzer]

Yes well, life is dramatically unfair. But would you rather the toughness of life boil down to income disparity or having to fight for existence in a natural world which couldn't care even if it wanted to? I'm on the lower scale of income. My family subsists on my mother's £10,000 income and state benefits. It ain't no fun most of time, and we get into a lot of trouble when we give in to greed. Credit card companies have a way of getting you back in the worst ways imaginable Count yourself lucky Devogue and keep every penny for yourself. If I had money then I probably would too.

[devogue]

Yes well, life is dramatically unfair. But would you rather the toughness of life boil down to income disparity or having to fight for existence in a natural world which couldn't care even if it wanted to? I'm on the lower scale of income. My family subsists on my mother's £10,000 income and state benefits. It ain't no fun most of time, and we get into a lot of trouble when we give in to greed. Credit card companies have a way of getting you back in the worst ways imaginable Count yourself lucky Devogue and keep every penny for yourself. If I had money then I probably would too.

I know what you mean Lozzer.

Ten years ago I had money which I pumped in to my own business - it did really well, but I could only afford to pay myself £12,000 per year. That was okay, though, because I was a single man and as long as I had a packet of smokes and a beer at the end of the day I was happy.

When I met Mrs Dev she was on benefits and working cash in hand for a pittance - we rented a house and spent our money on cheap booze cigarettes and having a good time. I couldn't drive, she had a clapped out Nissan Sunny. We were extremely happy.

Ten years later and my earning power has increased vastly, we own two houses, we have ISAs and pensions, money in the bank and over £20,000 worth of wine investment. While I drive a Totota Corolla back and forward to work Mrs Dev drives the main car, which is a very swish MPV.

We own both of the cars outright, we have no loans or credit card debt, our three children want for nothing, we can splurge at Christmas without dreading the bills in January. Ten years ago I would drink wine at no more than £7 a bottle - now I regularly splurge out £100 or more.

In other words, we are fucking laughing, living the dream - but here's the thing...

I know that I will sound like an unbelievably spoilt and sickeningly disingenuous twat, but we aren't as happy as we were ten years ago. Nowhere near.

I've thought long and hard about why that is, especially because ten years ago I would be amazed and delighted if someone told me how "well" I would be doing.

I think the answer is that we are now on a very nasty treadmill - we have to keep working harder, keep pushing, keep hoping the wheels don't fall off our mortgaged existance, we worry about losing face, losing what we have worked for even though we have to keep working harder to hold on to it. While we mindlessly enjoy our material trappings...oh, I've just got the meaning of that word...we are genuinely trapped.

When we rented a two bedroom house ten years ago it was a wonderful little home - we felt safe, happy and pretty carefree.

Now we live in a four bedroom detached house with all the mod cons, beautiful furniture and fittings (we've spent a fortune in the past two years renovating it) and do you know what we think about whenever we do any of this work? - how impressed a potential buyer will be when we eventually come to sell the house...

Money, assets, money, assets... be careful what you wish for...

[charlou]

"Full fathom five thy father lies,
Of his bones are coral made,
Those are pearls that were his eyes,
Nothing of him that doth fade,
But doth suffer a sea-change,
into something rich and strange,
Sea-nymphs hourly ring his knell,
Ding-dong.
Hark! now I hear them, ding-dong, bell."

[Hermit]

When we rented a two bedroom house ten years ago it was a wonderful little home - we felt safe, happy and pretty carefree.

Devogue, I have that sneaking suspicion that if you were renting a two bedroom house and living on the smell of an oily rag, like you were ten years ago, you'd be a damn sight unhappier just now than you already are, especially with three children in tow.

Speaking for myself, I lead a carefree hand-to-mouth existence until my early thirties. Sex, surf, drugs, food and shelter was all I wanted, and I lacked not. Happy days. Nothing fazed me. Even getting told to move out of a house because the new owner wanted to move in was just another adventure.

By the time I reached the mid thirties the lack of spare readies had somehow become a bit of a nuisance. I found permanent employment, then a sub-contracting opportunity, and before I knew it I was under 290,000 of non-current liabilities (excluding the truck lease). 18 years later I became a bum again, but with a difference this time: I own a spacious house outright and I have money to spare. Best of all I have a partner who is a soul mate like I never had before, and she is a... I won't bore you with more gloating, I think, except to say that I feel no need whatsoever to keep up with the Jones' either.

Material comfort does not cause unhappiness. Lack of it at least encourages it, though.