Why Johnny can't code

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Coito ergo sum
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Coito ergo sum » Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:40 pm

klr wrote:I came across this last week. It's is a few years old, but just as relevant now as when it was written, if not more so. Ostensibly, it's about a narrow area of technology (computer programming), but it has wider implications IMHO ...
Why Johnny can't code

BASIC used to be on every computer a child touched -- but today there's no easy way for kids to get hooked on programming.
For three years -- ever since my son Ben was in fifth grade -- he and I have engaged in a quixotic but determined quest: We've searched for a simple and straightforward way to get the introductory programming language BASIC to run on either my Mac or my PC.

Why on Earth would we want to do that, in an era of glossy animation-rendering engines, game-design ogres and sophisticated avatar worlds? Because if you want to give young students a grounding in how computers actually work, there's still nothing better than a little experience at line-by-line programming.
I guess, but when I was learning BASIC, PASCAL and COBOL, the mantra was that "there's still nothing better than a little experience with punch cards and paper-tape readout machines..."

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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Pappa » Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:14 am

Clinton Huxley wrote:I signed up with CodeAcademy the other day.

Those coding muscles are condiserably atrophied.....
If you like the way CodeAcademy do it, you might also like this: http://tryruby.org/
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Clinton Huxley » Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:43 am

Pappa wrote:
Clinton Huxley wrote:I signed up with CodeAcademy the other day.

Those coding muscles are condiserably atrophied.....
If you like the way CodeAcademy do it, you might also like this: http://tryruby.org/
Cheers, Pappa, will have a look.
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:01 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:Detect end of scanning cycle.
Confirm scan is acceptable and pages are in proper order.
Open scanner cover.
Remove Page 1 and invert.
Displace and invert Page 2.
Rename Page 2 "Page 1"
Select Page 2 from source stack and invert.
Place Page 2 on scanner glass in proper position.
Adjust Page 1 to adjoin Page 2 in scanning area.
Close scanner cover.
Start scanning cycle.
Repeat until source stack pages = 0.
Forgot a few steps. Did this 3,000+ times over the past six days. When a computer can do that, I'll start to be impressed.

And, there are ways to automate that whole process, but that kind of system is well beyond my means, I'd rather buy a second car.
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Clinton Huxley » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:03 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:Detect end of scanning cycle.
Confirm scan is acceptable and pages are in proper order.
Open scanner cover.
Remove Page 1 and invert.
Displace and invert Page 2.
Rename Page 2 "Page 1"
Select Page 2 from source stack and invert.
Place Page 2 on scanner glass in proper position.
Adjust Page 1 to adjoin Page 2 in scanning area.
Close scanner cover.
Start scanning cycle.
Repeat until source stack pages = 0.
Forgot a few steps. Did this 3,000+ times over the past six days. When a computer can do that, I'll start to be impressed.

And, there are ways to automate that whole process, but that kind of system is well beyond my means, I'd rather buy a second car.
Apparently, in the next James Bond film, 007 has to break into the HQ of the Chinese Secret Service and spend 6 days incognito in the photocopier room, copying plans for some Doomsday Device or other.
"I grow old … I grow old …
I shall wear the bottoms of my trousers rolled"

AND MERRY XMAS TO ONE AND All!

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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Ronja » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:06 pm

Pappa wrote:Interesting changes planned to the curriculum in England:
School ICT to be replaced by computer science programme
By Judith Burns Education reporter, BBC News

The current programme of information and communications technology (ICT) study in England's schools will be scrapped from September, the education secretary has announced.

It will be replaced by an "open source" curriculum in computer science and programming designed with the help of universities and industry. ...
Interesting indeed! I wonder what they mean with "open source"? :ask:
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:06 pm

Clinton Huxley wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:Detect end of scanning cycle.
Confirm scan is acceptable and pages are in proper order.
Open scanner cover.
Remove Page 1 and invert.
Displace and invert Page 2.
Rename Page 2 "Page 1"
Select Page 2 from source stack and invert.
Place Page 2 on scanner glass in proper position.
Adjust Page 1 to adjoin Page 2 in scanning area.
Close scanner cover.
Start scanning cycle.
Repeat until source stack pages = 0.
Forgot a few steps. Did this 3,000+ times over the past six days. When a computer can do that, I'll start to be impressed.

And, there are ways to automate that whole process, but that kind of system is well beyond my means, I'd rather buy a second car.
Apparently, in the next James Bond film, 007 has to break into the HQ of the Chinese Secret Service and spend 6 days incognito in the photocopier room, copying plans for some Doomsday Device or other.
Tell me about it. When I hit some place like DC I could spend the entire trip at their archives, looting and pillaging. I'm trying to figure out how to get my camera stand to DC this year so I can copy things straight to a chip. :drool:
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:08 pm

Ronja wrote:
Pappa wrote:Interesting changes planned to the curriculum in England:
School ICT to be replaced by computer science programme
By Judith Burns Education reporter, BBC News

The current programme of information and communications technology (ICT) study in England's schools will be scrapped from September, the education secretary has announced.

It will be replaced by an "open source" curriculum in computer science and programming designed with the help of universities and industry. ...
Interesting indeed! I wonder what they mean with "open source"? :ask:
It means the code is available to anyone, developers can see how it's written so they can create apps to work with it. Micky Soft is not open source, and this makes it harder to design "helper" programs for Word, Excel, etc.
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Ronja » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:10 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:When I hit some place like DC I could spend the entire trip at their archives, looting and pillaging. I'm trying to figure out how to get my camera stand to DC this year so I can copy things straight to a chip. :drool:
Incorrect usage of %s and %s :coffee:

"The internet is made of people. People matter. This includes you. Stop trying to sell everything about yourself to everyone. Don’t just hammer away and repeat and talk at people—talk TO people. It’s organic. Make stuff for the internet that matters to you, even if it seems stupid. Do it because it’s good and feels important. Put up more cat pictures. Make more songs. Show your doodles. Give things away and take things that are free." - Maureen J

"...anyone who says it’s “just the Internet” can :pawiz: . And then when they come back, they can :pawiz: again." - Tigger

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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by rachelbean » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:10 pm

I think Ronja is more than familiar with the definition of open source in general, I think she was wondering more specifically what they mean by open source curriculum :ask:
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:14 pm

Ronja wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:When I hit some place like DC I could spend the entire trip at their archives, looting and pillaging. I'm trying to figure out how to get my camera stand to DC this year so I can copy things straight to a chip. :drool:
Incorrect usage of %s and %s :coffee:

Not when I do it. The archive staff are usually very happy to see me go. :hehe: (Library of Congress once gave me a staffer full time for two days. :ab: )
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Ronja » Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:38 pm

rachelbean wrote:I think Ronja is more than familiar with the definition of open source in general, I think she was wondering more specifically what they mean by open source curriculum :ask:
...and whether those responsible for education planning do understand the differences between e.g. the Apache License, the GNU General Public License and the Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike License and can transfer that understanding into a clear enough required curriculum content definition. Because such differences matter for the future of information and communication systems, and they matter a lot.

Wikipedia is pretty appalling on this specific topic, BTW. I would have thought they would have a decent comparison table, but it is puny. These were the only about OK articles I found:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_software_license
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permissive ... re_licence

The basic concept-n-history articles are better, though:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_software
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_source_software
"The internet is made of people. People matter. This includes you. Stop trying to sell everything about yourself to everyone. Don’t just hammer away and repeat and talk at people—talk TO people. It’s organic. Make stuff for the internet that matters to you, even if it seems stupid. Do it because it’s good and feels important. Put up more cat pictures. Make more songs. Show your doodles. Give things away and take things that are free." - Maureen J

"...anyone who says it’s “just the Internet” can :pawiz: . And then when they come back, they can :pawiz: again." - Tigger

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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Jesus_of_Nazareth » Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:16 pm

The stuff that youngsters use nowadays, just for fun / as simply a part of the modern world would probably have got many of 'em a Degree in IT 20 years ago.

FWIW, I see folk who code as like folks who build wheels - the good ones will come up with something circular, others will build something square - it will still be a wheel of course...........but the money is made from what the Wheel is used for, not the building of. Same with Computer Mumbo Jumbo - in the old days (80's & 90's) senior management could be easily bamboozled, nowadays not so easy to get funding for inventing the wheel (yet again!).
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:20 pm

I quit Computer Technology (what would be called "Business Computing" or something these days) back 1993 because of COBOL. It was such an utter shit of a language that I shuddered at the thought of having to deal with it every workday. Then Y2K comes along and they're begging for COBOL programmers. The profs that taught me were all Reserve Navy officers and they were given leaves of absence to go to DC and help sort out the Navy's programs.
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Re: Why Johnny can't code

Post by Drewish » Thu Jan 12, 2012 3:53 pm

Javascript. Just teach them javascript. What's so hard about that?
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