Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by L'Emmerdeur » Sun Dec 10, 2017 4:06 pm

Rum wrote:Thanks guys - keep it up!

I have my work cut out. Googling a definition for post modernism comes up with multiple definitions . There's a theme there but there is no definitive..er..definition. I suppose that will make it easier to make it as as one goes along!
It will be easier to get useful material if you ignore post-modernism in the whole and focus on discussions of post-modernist design. Though the design element is underpinned by the philosophical maundering, it of necessity is more grounded and tangible.

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by Rum » Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:18 pm

Well it is specific to ceramics. Trickier than I thought having done some interesting and enlightening reading this afternoon. Some art theorists really do spout poo. One describes museum and/or gallery exhibitions as ‘interventions'. Tempted to email the twat and tell her to fuck off.

However an interesting element of the ceramics case regarding any sort of 'school' is the utilitarian every day use of ceramics versus ceramic objects specifically made as art or ‘high craft'. Nice to get my teeth into anyway. I’ll probably end up writing the whole essay! Only 2000 words.

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by JimC » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:13 pm

So, another parent who does their child's homework! The bane of our life as teachers! :nono:

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by Forty Two » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:31 pm

"Seriously, what are the principles of [the Post Modernists'] theories, on what evidence are they based, what do they explain that wasn't already obvious, etc? These are fair requests for anyone to make. If they can't be met, then I'd suggest recourse to Hume's advice in similar circumstances: to the flames." - Noam Chomsky

"The Postmodernists' tyranny wears people down by boredom and semi-literate prose." - Christopher Hitchens.

"Suppose you are an intellectual impostor with nothing to say, but with strong ambitions to succeed in academic life, collect a coterie of reverent disciples and have students around the world anoint your pages with respectful yellow highlighter. What kind of literary style would you cultivate? Not a lucid one, surely, for clarity would expose your lack of content." Richard Dawkins on Postmodernism

In other words, Postmodernism is incoherent, internally inconsistent, and pointless.
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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by Rum » Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:52 pm

Not really.

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by Pappa » Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:47 pm

Having studied art at university I can confirm that postmodernism is utter bollocks. It's basically rhetorical sleight of hand and intellectual masturbation with no substance whatsoever.

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Dec 10, 2017 11:13 pm

Pappa wrote:Having studied art at university I can confirm that postmodernism is utter bollocks. It's basically rhetorical sleight of hand and intellectual masturbation with no substance whatsoever.
Actually, I think what you meant to say was that in pursuance of developing narratives of expressive significance within an reactive institutional setting you were led towards critical interpretations of the semantic and semiotic relationships that interdict upon both the discrete realm of one's personal sensual associations and the ephemeral nature of communicative configurations which, as Olafson put it, would otherwise confound the perspicacity of the intellectually well-equipped.

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by pErvinalia » Sun Dec 10, 2017 11:49 pm

Rum wrote:One describes museum and/or gallery exhibitions as ‘interventions'. Tempted to email the twat and tell her to fuck off.
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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by Hermit » Mon Dec 11, 2017 3:31 am

Pappa wrote:Having studied art at university I can confirm that postmodernism is utter bollocks. It's basically rhetorical sleight of hand and intellectual masturbation with no substance whatsoever.
In so far as postmodernism questions, then rejects, the notions of moral universalism, absolute truth, and objective reality I have no problem with it. Applying postmodernism to art, though, would have to involve a considerable amount of bullshit. It'll be interesting to see if Rum can find a connection between pm and ceramics that does not. Quite a challenge, in fact. Good luck, Rum.
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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by rainbow » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:46 am

Forty Two wrote: In other words, Postmodernism is incoherent, internally inconsistent, and pointless.
In your reality perhaps.
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by rainbow » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:48 am

Pappa wrote:Having studied art at university I can confirm that postmodernism is utter bollocks. It's basically rhetorical sleight of hand and intellectual masturbation with no substance whatsoever.
...yet can you say that intellectual masturbation and lack of substance are not valid paradigms?
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by JimC » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:23 am

rainbow wrote:
Pappa wrote:Having studied art at university I can confirm that postmodernism is utter bollocks. It's basically rhetorical sleight of hand and intellectual masturbation with no substance whatsoever.
...yet can you say that intellectual masturbation and lack of substance are not valid paradigms?
Real masturbation has no lack of substance... :tea:
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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by JimC » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:24 am

Hermit wrote:
Pappa wrote:Having studied art at university I can confirm that postmodernism is utter bollocks. It's basically rhetorical sleight of hand and intellectual masturbation with no substance whatsoever.
In so far as postmodernism questions, then rejects, the notions of moral universalism, absolute truth, and objective reality I have no problem with it. Applying postmodernism to art, though, would have to involve a considerable amount of bullshit. It'll be interesting to see if Rum can find a connection between pm and ceramics that does not. Quite a challenge, in fact. Good luck, Rum.
I'm sure he'll find a connection if he potters around enough...

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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by rainbow » Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:15 am

JimC wrote:
rainbow wrote:
Pappa wrote:Having studied art at university I can confirm that postmodernism is utter bollocks. It's basically rhetorical sleight of hand and intellectual masturbation with no substance whatsoever.
...yet can you say that intellectual masturbation and lack of substance are not valid paradigms?
Real masturbation has no lack of substance... :tea:
Some might say a loss of substance, but what is your point?
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
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Re: Does Post-Modernism Objectively Exist?

Post by Rum » Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:21 am

Clearly there is such a thing. Here is a widely accepted definition:

"A late 20th-century style and concept in the arts, architecture, and criticism, which represents a departure from modernism and is characterized by the self-conscious use of earlier styles and conventions, a mixing of different artistic styles and media, and a general distrust of theories".

Whether one chooses to take any notice of it or for that matter wishes to discard general analytical discussion around the subject of the arts generally is another matter.

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