The Good Man Jesus and The Scoundrel Christ

[charlou]

http://www.rationalia.com/forum/viewtop ... =23&t=4561

Threads merged.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Next up: Mohammed was a nutcase / liar / whacked out of his gourd / all of the above ...

:pissed:

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Next up: Mohammed was a nutcase / liar / whacked out of his gourd / all of the above ...

:pissed2:

That smiley needs a little movement, methinks...

[Lion IRC]

The Golden Compass promotes atheism? WOW. You gotta be kidding.

I saw that movie and loved it. It has magic, souls, good and evil, unseen worlds beyond, talking animals.

I wonder what the author of The Magicians Nephew would have thought..."hey you forgot to include the evil uncle Andrew and the colored rings which transport you between worlds"

Of course the Magisterium is a dystopian religious bogey man full of hypocrits who want to control the rest of us good people. What better way to tip your hat to Jesus and His message to the Pharisees.

Speaking of Jesus….

I don’t know how someone can give Paul’s evangelism more or less credence than other Gospel writers. And the Pullman book doesn’t look like it is going to help much if it argues that Paul is the inventor of Christology. Did Paul actually believe it or invent it. Did Paul (a Jew) learn about Jesus direct from witnesses or did he rely on his “imaginative genius” for that also.

Did Paul invent stories about Simon Peter and the other disciples to compliment his own work of “literary genius”?
No, this notion of Paul as the source of Christology looks like wishful thinking. All the Gospel writers were motivated by something from above.

Are we really expected to believe that Paul was so motivated to transform “plain old” Jesus into a divine identity that he was willing to endure the hardship which followed. Are we really expected to believe that Paul took his “new literary character” and started spruking the Christological Jesus to people who already understood the word Messiah perfectly well.

Lion (IRC)

[Thinking Aloud]

The Golden Compass promotes atheism? WOW. You gotta be kidding.

I saw that movie and loved it. It has magic, souls, good and evil, unseen worlds beyond, talking animals.

Amazing, isn't it? A fantasy story has "the Church" as the bad guys and portrays God as an anachronism, then it must be promoting atheism... (Here's a typical reaction.) The talking bear, personal daemons, and the afterlife are key atheist dogma, of course.

[Lion IRC]

The Golden Compass promotes atheism? WOW. You gotta be kidding.

I saw that movie and loved it. It has magic, souls, good and evil, unseen worlds beyond, talking animals.

Amazing, isn't it? A fantasy story has "the Church" as the bad guys and portrays God as an anachronism, then it must be promoting atheism... (Here's a typical reaction.) The talking bear, personal daemons, and the afterlife are key atheist dogma, of course.

Hi Thinking Aloud,
I KNOW!!!
Its unbelievable - even for us "gullible" theists.
Lion (IRC)

[GrahamH]

The Golden Compass promotes atheism? WOW. You gotta be kidding.

I saw that movie and loved it. It has magic, souls, good and evil, unseen worlds beyond, talking animals.

Amazing, isn't it? A fantasy story has "the Church" as the bad guys and portrays God as an anachronism, then it must be promoting atheism... (Here's a typical reaction.) The talking bear, personal daemons, and the afterlife are key atheist dogma, of course.

Hi Thinking Aloud,
I KNOW!!!
Its unbelievable - even for us "gullible" theists.
Lion (IRC)

Just jumping in here, isn't the 'promotes atheism' bit to do with portraying religion as just another fairytale, and with church as villan not good-guy?
Fiction about "magic, souls, good and evil, unseen worlds beyond, talking animals." is fiction, not any sort of support for religion.

[Lion IRC]

Hi GrahamH,
Suppose you wanted to promote atheism and help your children think more "rationally".
So you write a FICTION book about ghosts and werewolves and vampires.
Now, your child reads the book and just before they go to bed you ask them to go outside and take the trash can out.
Its a fairly long drive way at your place. Its already dark and you have lots of trees in your front yard, no street lights - just a torch.
Did your book help or hinder their clear thinking about the numinous?
The enlightened "age of reason" hasnt done much to stem the popularity of books about magic, gothic horror, vampires, golden compasses, avatars, tree spirits, schools of wizardry...you get the idea right?
Lion (IRC)

[Lion IRC]

PS - I notice YOU used the phrase "good" guy in one of your sentences.

Then you lumped "good and evil" in the category of "ficton" in your second sentence.

Those books of "imaginative genius" like Golden Compass have something contagious in them.

Lion (IRC)

[Rum]

Why do you say that Rum? Personally, I am looking forward to reading it, it sounds fascinating.

Not been posting for the last couple of days until tonight.

I think ignoring something (as long as it isn't threatening you directly) is the best tactic. We have great examples here of engaging with issues and giving then the 'oxygen' they need to stay alive when we would all be better off with a ..'meh'.. which would make the unpleasant smell leave rather faster than otherwise they do!

[Shaker]

The enlightened "age of reason" hasnt done much to stem the popularity of books about magic, gothic horror, vampires, golden compasses, avatars, tree spirits, schools of wizardry...you get the idea right?

The idea would be that you can furnish us with sound evidence that more people actually believe (as in take seriously) the existence of these things instead of treating them as harmless escapist entertainment, right?