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[Animavore]

Again I'll demonstrate why the argument ad populum is a total fallacy.

http://www.imdb.com/boxoffice/alltimegr ... world-wide

[Elessarina]

Again, the amount of money Avatar makes does not render an unfavourable opinion invalid....

Yes you keep repeating that.. It is, however, a reflection though of the film's success within its medium.. however i did not solely quote the box office.. it has got nominations for its writing, direction and for best picture.. it also has a 82% approval rating from critics (87% from top critics)

[Clinton Huxley]

Again, the amount of money Avatar makes does not render an unfavourable opinion invalid....

Yes you keep repeating that.. It is, however, a reflection though of the film's success within its medium.. however i did not solely quote the box office.. it has got nominations for its writing, direction and for best picture.. it also has a 82% approval rating from critics (87% from top critics)

I just think if you want to proselytise for Avatar, you should not use the box office receipts as an argument. Nominations are given for political and financial reasons as much as anything else, so I take little notice of those.

As for "top critics" you know what they say, "No-one in Hollywood knows anything"

[Trolldor]

Avatar is Ferngully with explosions.

Or Dances With Wolves, or Lawrence of Arabia, or Pocahontas or Apocalypto


And.........?

It's made 1.34bn at the worldwide box offices, it has an 82% approval rating amoungst critics, the Writers Guild of America have nominated it for Best Screenplay, it has Golden Globes nominations for Best Picture and Best Director..

I am sure James Cameron sleeps just fine...

Funnily enough, Titanic did well as well... and yet I still don't understand what exactly was special about that movie.
And, as I keep telling people, if you don't want me to complain about a movie I don't like, don't talk about movies you do like.
Especially when they happen to be the same movie.

You're obviously just looking to bitch about it.. and it's amazing how many people seem to know how better to make a film than the man who has the two biggest grossing films of all time.

The ability to make a better film has no relation to recognising a better film. "Avatar" had absolutely nothing special about it, not one thing to warrant any label above 'average'. It pulled a Harry Potter, basically.

Here's a challenge - point me to something Avatar had done superiorly to any of its predecessors where available technology is not the sole contributing factor.

[Elessarina]

Again I'll demonstrate why the argument ad populum is a total fallacy.

http://www.imdb.com/boxoffice/alltimegr ... world-wide

it's not a fallacy.. it's demontrable of what makes money.. and for movie studios.. that is the point.. is it not? I have never stated box office success makes a film Casablanca but nor does it make a film worthless.... box office success demonstrates that something is not a failure...

I have also stated that Avatar has major award nominations and is highly thought of amongst critics.. so it is not *just* a box office success.

[Trolldor]

But critics don't mean anything, neither do industry awards, or box office hits.
None of them indicate anything that seperates the film from the others like it. Not one of them.

[Clinton Huxley]

It's a tautology but all box-office success indicates is that a film made a lot of money. It tells you nothing about the film's merit. Transformers made a lot of money and yet most people would agree that Michael Bay must never be allowed to make another film again (well, everyone but his accountant would think that).

Argue for the film on its merits as you see them!

[Elessarina]

I just think if you want to proselytise for Avatar, you should not use the box office receipts as an argument. Nominations are given for political and financial reasons as much as anything else, so I take little notice of those.

As for "top critics" you know what they say, "No-one in Hollywood knows anything"

I believe I have freedom of speech to make any argument I want.. however I have used box office totals merely as a point of interest and to demonstrate the worldwide success of the film... I find wathcing the box office interesting for a film i care about particularly when i have come across numerous people over the year who have said it won't make $120m in the US.

You clearly do not like the film and have something against it or James Cameron.. that is fair enough but you are now ripping apart all the general indicators that the film is anything other than worthless to suit your own ends.

Oh and the top critics that are used are from everywhere - a lot of them are in the UK - from the Guardian, The Times etc.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

But critics don't mean anything, neither do industry awards, or box office hits.
None of them indicate anything that seperates the film from the others like it. Not one of them.

Indeed, nothing at all is valid as far as movies go. Which causes confusion when people get all ruffled over them. It's just a movie.

[Elessarina]

Does this site have to turn into a damn witch hunt because I happen to like Avatar?

I don't give a shit that the story is not bloody Casablanca.. not every film has to be.

I enjoy a wide range of movies why the hell does it seem like everyone in the damn world is going to tell me I am wrong to like something I like?

[Clinton Huxley]

I just think if you want to proselytise for Avatar, you should not use the box office receipts as an argument. Nominations are given for political and financial reasons as much as anything else, so I take little notice of those.

As for "top critics" you know what they say, "No-one in Hollywood knows anything"

I believe I have freedom of speech to make any argument I want..

I never said otherwise.

however I have used box office totals merely as a point of interest and to demonstrate the worldwide success of the film... I find wathcing the box office interesting for a film i care about particularly when i have come across numerous people over the year who have said it won't make $120m in the US.

And I've pointed out that this is an irrelevant point.

You clearly do not like the film

I've not even seen it!

and have something against it or James Cameron..

Nope, I love The Abyss and Aliens.

that is fair enough but you are now ripping apart all the general indicators that the film is anything other than worthless to suit your own ends.

I'm not arguing against the film, as I've not seen it, I've just been pointing out the fallacy of using the money as an argument.

Oh and the top critics that are used are from everywhere - a lot of them are in the UK - from the Guardian, The Times etc.

Aye, and it got decent reviews from the critics I respect. Merely decent.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Does this site have to turn into a damn witch hunt because I happen to like Avatar?

I don't give a shit that the story is not bloody Casablanca.. not every film has to be.

I enjoy a wide range of movies why the hell does it seem like everyone in the damn world is going to tell me I am wrong to like something I like?

Ele, don't take it personally, they're just arguing because that's what they do. It's not aimed at you, it's just the target of the moment.

[leo-rcc]

Within 5 years everybody will have forgotten about this movie. Then the novelty has worn off, the Bluray/DVD will be in the cupboard next to Titan AE and Event Horizon, and no one will speak of this high-grossing average hi-gloss eyecandy again.

[Animavore]

Does this site have to turn into a damn witch hunt because I happen to like Avatar?

I don't give a shit that the story is not bloody Casablanca.. not every film has to be.

I enjoy a wide range of movies why the hell does it seem like everyone in the damn world is going to tell me I am wrong to like something I like?

I liked Avatar. I never at any stage said any different. I just think its a very average film. Sure the effects are mind blowing, I would even call it art, but the story was not executed well. You think that doesn't matter I happen to think it does.
I'm just going to leave it at that because people seem to be getting very heated over it and its not fun any more.

[Trolldor]

But critics don't mean anything, neither do industry awards, or box office hits.
None of them indicate anything that seperates the film from the others like it. Not one of them.

Indeed, nothing at all is valid as far as movies go. Which causes confusion when people get all ruffled over them. It's just a movie.

Well, I wouldn't say "nothing at all", I think there's a sort of Universal truth that Battlefield Earth is absolute trite shit.