Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than some

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Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than some

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:50 am

Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than some would have you believe

by Grania Spingies

Last week the Ipsos MORI polls conducted by the Richard Dawkins Foundation for Science and Reason revealed that the majority of self-defined Christians living in the UK tend to have more far more liberal and secular views than those promoted by Christian campaign groups. The reaction from those groups has been predictably both outraged and outrageous, but the message is fairly clear: the highly conservative values espoused by such lobbies do not reflect those of the Christian majority on whose behalf they claim to speak.

A recent government-sponsored poll shows very similar attitudes in Ireland. The poll is based on the Irish Referendum in 2011 (in Ireland the Constitution can be amended only by popular referendum), and was conducted by the Irish government for political reasons: to find out why people voted as they did. Unlike the Dawkins Foundation poll, then, this one was not conducted by a pro-secularist organization, and thus cannot be criticized on that count.

The poll shows that despite being a "Catholic" country (the 2006 Census put the proportion of Catholics above 86%) and in spite of Irish religious lobby groups insisting that the conservative status quo remains, it seems that a comfortable majority of Irish people do not take their cues about morality from the Church at all. In fact, an article in Thursday's Irish Examiner by June McEnroe shows that the Irish overwhelmingly support same-sex marriage, and also do not support Ireland's ill-conceived new Blasphemy Law.

The poll found:
* 73% believe same-sex marriages should be allowed in the Constitution.

* 53% believe the offence of blasphemy should be removed from the Constitution.

* 51% believe references to women’s life within the home should be removed from the Constitution.

(The Constitution has a rather paternalistic view of women which, while it does not preclude women from working, tacitly endorses the idea that women are to be seen primarily as mothers. Here's one section:

1° [...] the State recognises that by her life within the home, woman gives to the State a support without which the common good cannot be achieved.

2° The State shall, therefore, endeavour to ensure that mothers shall not be obliged by economic necessity to engage in labour to the neglect of their duties in the home.)
Continues.
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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by Animavore » Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:53 am

You don't say! :bored:
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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by klr » Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:53 am

Only 53% believe the offence of blasphemy should be removed from the Constitution? :what:

They must have asked the wrong question.
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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:57 am

Animavore wrote:You don't say! :bored:
Amazing what people find when they actually look around, ain't it?
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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by Thinking Aloud » Fri Feb 24, 2012 1:30 pm

Dammit. I thought this was a "finish the sentence" thread.

Well, for the record, my entry is "nuns".

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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by Horwood Beer-Master » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:47 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:...Unlike the Dawkins Foundation poll, then, this one was not conducted by a pro-secularist organization...
Neither was the Dawkins Foundation poll, it was conducted by Ipsos MORI. :dunno:
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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:56 pm

Horwood Beer-Master wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:...Unlike the Dawkins Foundation poll, then, this one was not conducted by a pro-secularist organization...
Neither was the Dawkins Foundation poll, it was conducted by Ipsos MORI. :dunno:
Actually, that was Jerry Coyne's blog post.
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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by MrJonno » Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:12 pm

What about abortion?
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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by Coito ergo sum » Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:22 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:


(The Constitution has a rather paternalistic view of women which, while it does not preclude women from working, tacitly endorses the idea that women are to be seen primarily as mothers. Here's one section:

1° [...] the State recognises that by her life within the home, woman gives to the State a support without which the common good cannot be achieved.

2° The State shall, therefore, endeavour to ensure that mothers shall not be obliged by economic necessity to engage in labour to the neglect of their duties in the home.)
Continues.

:spray:

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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than

Post by klr » Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:41 pm

Coito ergo sum wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:


(The Constitution has a rather paternalistic view of women which, while it does not preclude women from working, tacitly endorses the idea that women are to be seen primarily as mothers. Here's one section:

1° [...] the State recognises that by her life within the home, woman gives to the State a support without which the common good cannot be achieved.

2° The State shall, therefore, endeavour to ensure that mothers shall not be obliged by economic necessity to engage in labour to the neglect of their duties in the home.)
Continues.

:spray:
It's no laughing matter. :lay:
God has no place within these walls, just like facts have no place within organized religion. - Superintendent Chalmers

It's not up to us to choose which laws we want to obey. If it were, I'd kill everyone who looked at me cock-eyed! - Rex Banner

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:mob: :comp: :mob:

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Re: Ireland may also be a lot more liberal and secular than some

Post by Animavore » Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:14 am

Slowly working through the list. SSM. Abortion. Blasphemy this Friday. And changes to statements on women's position in the home in the pipeline.
Libertarianism: The belief that out of all the terrible things governments can do, helping people is the absolute worst.

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