Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Dec 02, 2010 11:44 am

IF this is the biggest challenge we'll have for a while I'm going for donuts.
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by DRSB » Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:46 am

Eriku wrote:Screw it... it's such a fun read that everybody ought to have it imposed on them:
Vanga's Future Prophecies

2008: Baba Vanga speaks of conflicts in "Indonesia" leading to the upcoming WWIII, but some people say that Indonesia had been mistranslated and it's meant to read "India". This will also involve the attempted assassinations of 4 heads of state.
2010: World War 3 begins in November 2010. Starting as a regular war, it will progress to a nuclear and chemical war. Vanga says the war will be finished by October 2014.
2011: As a result of the war, radioactive showers will destroy almost all life in the Northern Hemisphere. The remaining Europeans will face an even further threat from the Muslims who will use chemical weapons to finish them off.
2014: As another result of the chemicals and nuclear weapons during the war, most of the world population will have skin cancer and other skin diseases.
2016: Extraterrestrials will make contact with Earth.
2018: China will become the new superpower. The exploiters will become the exploited.
2023: The Earth's orbit will change.
2025: Europe is still very underpopulated.
2028: A new energy source will be found. Hunger is overcome. A manned space flight will leave for Venus.
2033: The world water levels will rise as the polar ice caps melt.
2043: Economy is good. The Muslims will run Europe.
2046: All bodily organs can be reproduced, becoming the easiest and most popular method of treatment.
2066: The U.S. uses a new climate-changing weapon on Muslim controlled Rome.
2076: Communism takes over.
2084: Nature is reborn.(??)
2088: A new disease makes you grow old in seconds.
2097: The Fast-Aging Disease is cured.
2100: Man-made sun is lighting up the dark side of the planet.
2111: People become robots. Probably like androids.
2123: Wars between small countries. The big countries stay out of it.
2125: Signals from Space will be received in Hungary. (People will be reminded of Baba Vanga - probably due to her alien subjects)
2130: With the help of the aliens, civilizations will live underwater.
2164: Animals turn half-human.
2167: A new religion.
2170: Major drought.
2183: A colony on Mars will become a nuclear power and ask for independance from Earth. (Like the U.S. asked from England.)
2187: 2 large volcanic eruptions will be successfully stopped.
2195: The sea colonies will have energy and food.
2196: Asians and Europeans will be completely mixed.
2201: Temperatures drop as the sun's thermonuclear processes slow down.
2221: In the search for extra-terrestrial life, humans will come in contact with something terrible.
2256: A spaceship will bring a new disease to Earth.
2262: Planets will slowly change orbits. Mars will be threatened by a comet.
2271: Physics laws will be changed.
2273: White, black and yellow races will form 1 new race.
2279: Power will be obtained from nothing. (Possibly a vacuum or a black hole.)
2288: Possible time travel and alien contact.
2291: The sun grows cooler. Attempts will be made to make it hot again.
2296: Strong explosions in the sun. The forces of gravity will change. Old space stations and satellites will fall.
2299: In France, a resistance movement will rise against Islam.
2302: Important laws and secrets of the universe are revealed.
2304: Secrets of the Moon are also revealed.
2341: Something terrible will approach Earth from Space.
2354: An accident on the artificial sun will result in drought.
2371: World hunger.
2378: A new and fast-growing race.
2480: 2 artificial (man-made) suns will collide and leave the Earth in the dark.
3005: A war on Mars will change the trajectory of the planet.
3010: A comet will hit the moon. The Earth will be surrounded by a ring of rock and ash.
3797: By this time, everything on Earth will die. However, human civilization will be advanced enough to move to a new star system.


The following predections are collected from blogs and forums. These should not be perceived as fact, as they have not been posted with references. The origins of these predictions are unknown and are worded according to the users from whom they were written.

3803: A new planet is populated by little. Fewer contacts between people. Climate new planet affects the organisms of people - they mutate.
3805: The war between humans for resources. More than half of people dying out.
3815: The war is over.
3854: The development of civilization virtually stops. People live flocks as beasts.
3871: New prophet tells people about moral values, religion.
3874: New prophet receives support from all segments of the population. Organized a new church.
3878: along with the Church to re-train new people forgotten sciences.
4302: New cities are growing in the world. New Church encourages the development of new technology and science.
4302: The development of science. Scientists discovered in the overall impact of all diseases in organism behavior.
4304: Found a way to win any disease.
4308: Due to mutation people at last beginning to use their brains more than 34%. Completely lost the notion of evil and hatred.
4509: Getting to Know God. The man has finally been reached such a level of development that can communicate with God.
4599: People achieve immortality.
4674: The development of civilization has reached its peak. The number of people living on different planets is about 340 billion. Assimilation begins with aliens.
5076: A boundary universe. With it, no one knows.
5078: The decision to leave the boundaries of the universe. While about 40 percent of the population is against it.
5079: End of the World.
All the way up to 2079... I love the idea of us leaving the boundaries of the universe with forty per cent of the population saying "nay" :lol:
Not sure she made those prophecies or was attributed them. She never wrote a book, you know, she never went on TV to make a public prophecy. I'm inclined to think somebody has played a joke on her by posting these. She went blind as a child, never attended school, or only briefly, she was not concerned with the universe and its boundaries and mutations, had no such vocabulary either. There are too many legends about her.
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Hermit » Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:45 am

Deersbee wrote:Not sure she made those prophecies or was attributed them.
Either way, if Baba Vanga's actual or attributed prophesies are TheGreatGatsby's biggest challenge to his denial of the supernatural yet, the non-arrival of WWIII in November 2010 ought to put paid to it. I am looking forward to his next post in this thread.
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by my_wan » Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:05 am

Deersbee wrote:2201: Temperatures drop as the sun's thermonuclear processes slow down.
The thermonuclear processes do not slow down. As the sun burns its fuel it can't support as much outward pressure, which leads to the sun shrinking somewhat and burning even hotter in a contraction-burning cycle. The sun gets about 10% hotter and brighter roughly every billion years. In about 4.5 billions years it'll explode and take out the whole solar system.
2256: A spaceship will bring a new disease to Earth.
And by what kind of cosmic accident would an alien microbe be adapted to human host? That's the kind of giant accidents that theist accuse evolutionary biologist of claiming. It doesn't work that way.
Physics laws will be changed.
If the laws of physics changes, then there was a preexisting law of physics to allow that change. Hence no change in the laws of physics occurs, as said laws are already already contained in the laws, whether we know about them or not.
2273: White, black and yellow races will form 1 new race.
Common evolutionary mythology. Though what we now call races may change significantly. More likely speciation will occur in humans.
2279: Power will be obtained from nothing. (Possibly a vacuum or a black hole.)
Well, virtual particles and black holes are not "nothing" are they... That's like saying a solar cell gets power from "nothing".
2291: The sun grows cooler. Attempts will be made to make it hot again.
Same misunderstanding of solar evolution. It's not like a fire that slowly burns out. When the sun burns out, it'll do so by getting hotter. Which eventually leads to getting so hot so fast it take the solar system out in a big explosion.
2302: Important laws and secrets of the universe are revealed.
What, the ones that changed in the previous prediction, or the real ones?

A common tactic of psychics is to make huge list of predictions. A few long shots and many others that can be interpreted in countless ways. Then wait the the best ones to claim as predictions.

If you have a missing child that is in public news, you will receive a barrage of offers from so called psychics wanting to help. If they are allowed anything, and the child is found, they will claim credit. Even if they can't help they claim they helped on the resumes, so to speak. They know that one good accidental hit on a reasonably high profile case will set them financially for life, only not a single case clearly demonstrates that they ever helped even one person.
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by DRSB » Fri Dec 03, 2010 9:48 am

As I pointed out already, Vanga had no idea about thermonuclear processes, or physics in general, and only vaguely an idea, if at all, where China is on the map, not sure whether she was literate, most probably not. She did not have staff reading scientific magazines to her all day. I don't see what you all are trying to disprove, some stupid jokes played by attributing prophecies to her. It is all hearsay, she never gave interviews, taping was not allowed, and people went to her not to hear about thermonuclear process but to ask whether they would be able to finally conceive a child. In Russia they made a myth out of her, because they are crazy about so called "extra-senses" and wrote more books about her than in Bulgaria. Take my word, those so called "prophecies" are all made up!

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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Hermit » Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:27 am

Deersbee wrote:I don't see what you all are trying to disprove
Just speaking for myself, this is the point: "if Baba Vanga's actual or attributed prophesies are TheGreatGatsby's biggest challenge to his denial of the supernatural yet, the non-arrival of WWIII in November 2010 ought to put paid to it."
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops. - Stephen J. Gould

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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Feck » Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:32 am

:toetap: Nope still no searing death from the skies
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:45 pm

Deersbee wrote:As I pointed out already, Vanga had no idea about thermonuclear processes, or physics in general, and only vaguely an idea, if at all, where China is on the map, not sure whether she was literate, most probably not. She did not have staff reading scientific magazines to her all day. I don't see what you all are trying to disprove, some stupid jokes played by attributing prophecies to her. It is all hearsay, she never gave interviews, taping was not allowed, and people went to her not to hear about thermonuclear process but to ask whether they would be able to finally conceive a child. In Russia they made a myth out of her, because they are crazy about so called "extra-senses" and wrote more books about her than in Bulgaria. Take my word, those so called "prophecies" are all made up!
...as were her abilities to predict conception. Tell every woman that comes to see you that she will conceive within the year and you are bound to get plenty of hits - you even know that they are trying for a child because why would they bother otherwise.

There was a "sex-test" scam a few years ago. A firm advertised that it could tell the sex of your unborn child simply from a urine sample. They charged £20 a time for this - money back if they were wrong. They simply predicted that every sample showed the baby to be a boy - and kept half of the money. The scam was revealed when a TV show sent them urine from men, pre-pubescent children and dogs and was congratulated on the upcoming birth of a baby boy in every instance! If you can't see the parallels with Vanga's scattergun approach, I have overestimated you.
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by DRSB » Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:16 pm

Xamonas Chegwé wrote:
Deersbee wrote:As I pointed out already, Vanga had no idea about thermonuclear processes, or physics in general, and only vaguely an idea, if at all, where China is on the map, not sure whether she was literate, most probably not. She did not have staff reading scientific magazines to her all day. I don't see what you all are trying to disprove, some stupid jokes played by attributing prophecies to her. It is all hearsay, she never gave interviews, taping was not allowed, and people went to her not to hear about thermonuclear process but to ask whether they would be able to finally conceive a child. In Russia they made a myth out of her, because they are crazy about so called "extra-senses" and wrote more books about her than in Bulgaria. Take my word, those so called "prophecies" are all made up!
...as were her abilities to predict conception. Tell every woman that comes to see you that she will conceive within the year and you are bound to get plenty of hits - you even know that they are trying for a child because why would they bother otherwise.

There was a "sex-test" scam a few years ago. A firm advertised that it could tell the sex of your unborn child simply from a urine sample. They charged £20 a time for this - money back if they were wrong. They simply predicted that every sample showed the baby to be a boy - and kept half of the money. The scam was revealed when a TV show sent them urine from men, pre-pubescent children and dogs and was congratulated on the upcoming birth of a baby boy in every instance! If you can't see the parallels with Vanga's scattergun approach, I have overestimated you.
Actually, you second my point, namely, that her fame was overrated; but just think what a fame: to make it to Rationalia!
However, regardless whether her prophecies were accurate or not, I cannot rule out the possibility that she may have actually helped somebody conceive by recommending herbal treatments for treatable conditions.

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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:46 pm

Deersbee wrote:
Xamonas Chegwé wrote:
Deersbee wrote:As I pointed out already, Vanga had no idea about thermonuclear processes, or physics in general, and only vaguely an idea, if at all, where China is on the map, not sure whether she was literate, most probably not. She did not have staff reading scientific magazines to her all day. I don't see what you all are trying to disprove, some stupid jokes played by attributing prophecies to her. It is all hearsay, she never gave interviews, taping was not allowed, and people went to her not to hear about thermonuclear process but to ask whether they would be able to finally conceive a child. In Russia they made a myth out of her, because they are crazy about so called "extra-senses" and wrote more books about her than in Bulgaria. Take my word, those so called "prophecies" are all made up!
...as were her abilities to predict conception. Tell every woman that comes to see you that she will conceive within the year and you are bound to get plenty of hits - you even know that they are trying for a child because why would they bother otherwise.

There was a "sex-test" scam a few years ago. A firm advertised that it could tell the sex of your unborn child simply from a urine sample. They charged £20 a time for this - money back if they were wrong. They simply predicted that every sample showed the baby to be a boy - and kept half of the money. The scam was revealed when a TV show sent them urine from men, pre-pubescent children and dogs and was congratulated on the upcoming birth of a baby boy in every instance! If you can't see the parallels with Vanga's scattergun approach, I have overestimated you.
Actually, you second my point, namely, that her fame was overrated; but just think what a fame: to make it to Rationalia!
However, regardless whether her prophecies were accurate or not, I cannot rule out the possibility that she may have actually helped somebody conceive by recommending herbal treatments for treatable conditions.
...and I cannot rule out the possibility of a sweet, loving, all-powerful god that wants me to stop masturbating. The balance of probability however... :whistle: 'Scuse me, I'm off for a wank. :shifty:
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Coito ergo sum » Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:52 pm

TheGreatGatsby wrote:I've been a nonbeliever for more than a year now, but recently I came a cross a very disturbing "coincidence" that has me thinking twice about the existence of supernatural forces.

Baba Vanga, a little-known Romanian prophetess, predicted in 1980 that in August 1999 or 2000 Kursk would be under water (this is exactly how she phrased it, no possibility of reinterpretation here). Kursk is a Russian city that did not sink in either 1999 or 2000. However, in August 2000 a huge submarine named Kursk sank, killing more than 100 people.

Also, she predicted that WW3 would start in November 2010, which is weird given the current situation in Korea. (she claimed it would start with nuclear explosions, which will be either confirmed or disproved in the coming months.

I'm not saying that this is definitive proof of supernatural powers, but I think it certainly needs quite a serious investigation.
Well, looks like she was wrong about ww3, and the prediction of the Kursk, from the quote I googled online, appears to be referring to the city, not a submarine. So, it appears she is wrong, and that coincidentally a sub of the same name as the city sank. Not all that outlandish. She also said some war would occur in Indonesia in 2008 which would lead to WW3.

I'm not sure how that can be a challenge to a denial of the supernatural. People who make hundreds of predictions sometimes get one right. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and again.



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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by Trolldor » Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:10 pm

Deersbee wrote:Actually, you second my point, namely, that her fame was overrated; but just think what a fame: to make it to Rationalia!
However, regardless whether her prophecies were accurate or not, I cannot rule out the possibility that she may have actually helped somebody conceive by recommending herbal treatments for treatable conditions.

By corrolary, how many people might she have hurt because of her whackjobbery?
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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by electricwhiteboy » Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:10 pm

What? Someone entertained this pile of tosh? I have personally experienced a load of weird shit, from unnervingly accurate tarot readings and incredibly unlikely statistically repeating patterns in the cards, to full on group sightings. But I have never once thought there isn’t a rational and fully cohesive sceptical explanation, even for some of the things I still can’t fully explain rationally beyond “meaningful coincidences occur.”

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Re: Biggest challenge to my denial of the supernatural yet

Post by DRSB » Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:29 pm

electricwhiteboy wrote: “meaningful coincidences”
Serendipity, you mean. That was a lovely film!

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