"Satan doesnt want people talking about God."

[Lion IRC]

I know I shouldn't do this and I will get yelled at again, BUT:

Go Blow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jay G - nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent. I hope you dont make a grand exit from Rationalia (after a long psychodrama announcement thread...I'm going to leave, I mean it, I'm not kidding, this is my last farewell, please, somebody beg me to stay....yawn)
But if you dont like getting yelled at and yet you still want to post stuff like "go blow" in a quasi-serious discussion thread

[Lion IRC]

If Jesus wandered across the atlantic to Iceland tomorrow I would definitely be looking at what the cloven hoofed one was offering. He is much more honest and significantly less bloodthirsty.

When someone tells you what you want to hear it often sounds like honesty.

[charlou]

If Jesus wandered across the atlantic to Iceland tomorrow I would definitely be looking at what the cloven hoofed one was offering. He is much more honest and significantly less bloodthirsty.

When someone tells you what you want to hear it often sounds like honesty.

Like ... your version of 'God', for instance?

[Azathoth]

Everyone is going to hell anyway according to your book. Nobody can do all the stuff it tells you to. Why not have some fun on the way there

[Coito ergo sum]

Satan doesnt want people talking about God.

You really believe so?


Regarding the myth ... Satan is the one who encouraged us to have awareness and seek knowledge and enjoy the fruits of the world , while God wanted us to remain naive and gormless and frightened and feeling icky about ourselves and each other , and have eyes only for him . Satan encouraged discourse while God circumscribed it .
I know which character I prefer.

And, Satan told us the truth about the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge. God is the one who lied about it.

[Lion IRC]

And, Satan told us the truth about the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge. God is the one who lied about it.

God said if you eat from that tree you will die.
Satan said no you wont die.
Guess what? Adam and Eve DID die

[Coito ergo sum]

Does it make any strategic sense for satan (or some other opponent of God) to actively promote the cause of theological discussion?

Yes it does. The more people think about theology and the more they read the religious texts, the more likely it is that they will realize it's false.

Is it not counter-intuitive for New Atheism to stir up a renewed interest in God and religion in the hope that the more people talking about God the better it will be for atheists in the long run? Where is the logic in running an anti-theist polemic which jolts every single apathetic arm-chair apologist wannabe into action?

Because more people will see the light.

How many Hindus and Norse Thor worshippers and Wiccans and New Agers and Native/Aboriginal Religionists are teaming up with Jews, Muslims and Christians to say - hell YES Mr Hitchens, we WOULD like to talk publicly to you about "religion".

Some.

Because I think Mr Hitchens walked into the wrong bar to pick a fight.

Lion (IRC)[/color][/b]

It is only by not thinking that people can be suckered by the snake-oil salesmen that are the religiosos in this world. The Bible is a great catalyst to atheism. I've talked to many, many people who were once Christians, but when they finally started really reading and thinking about the Bible, they realized it could not be true.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Said it before, I'll say it again. The only way the Christian religion makes sense would be that God lost the War in Heaven. And the winner wrote the history.

[Coito ergo sum]

And, Satan told us the truth about the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge. God is the one who lied about it.

God said if you eat from that tree you will die.

Satan said no you wont die.
Guess what? Adam and Eve DID die

Like, 900 years later. The verse is as follows: "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." Genesis 2:17 - King James (Authorized) Version.

IN THE DAY THAT THOU EATEST..... Adam and Eve most certainly did not die in the day that they ate the fruit. God lied.

He didn't say, "you'll die at some point." Or, "you will become mortal." He said they would die that day.

So, one, for the Biblical literalists out there - obviously, that can't be taken literally. The only way one can find God here to be right is to make it some sort of metaphor, or a non-literal statement that by "day" he didn't really mean "day" he meant - at some point hundreds of years in the future.

If you don't follow the KJV, then the New American Standard Bible says it thusly, " 17but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it (A)you will surely die."

English Standard Version, "17but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil(A) you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat[a] of it you(B) shall surely die."

Darby Translation: 17but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it; for in the day that thou eatest of it thou shalt certainly die.

New International Version: 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die." (The NIV uses "when" not "in the day" - so, so much for "God's Word never changes"). But, alas, Adam and Eve did not die WHEN they ate the fruit, they died 900 years later. LOL, after long lives and children and all that.

[Santa_Claus]

The question being put here is whether or not polemicists who elevate the topic of "God" to the New York Times best seller list are being too smart by half. Ask yourself, how many atheists read The God Delusion or God is Not Great then consider how many "emotionally aroused" theists bought these books.

I argue that Mr Hitchens kicked a hornets nest. That Mr Dawkins should have left sleeping dogs alone. Instead, more people are writing more new apologetics books. Religious people themselves are saying...we have to get rid of those strawmen extremists and pedophiles that New Atheism continually misrepresent as being mainstream religion. Thanks to Mr Hitchens, people are debating morality, the soul, the afterlife, the origin of the universe, whether religion has served any useful evolutionary purpose. And those people arent just the easy target "Christians". New Atheism sticks its nose into the private lives of all theists and attacks supernatural "beliefs" ranging from Feng Shui to Wicca. From New Age Crystals to religious vegetarianism. From Chi Gung to Aboriginal Dreamtime sacred sites.

That is a pretty BIG hornets nest and not very many people like being told they are deluded. Especially when the secular, scientific enlightenment being offered as a replacement by atheists includes such "woo" as uncertainty principles and goldilocks enigmas and parallel universes and worm holes and quantum weirdness and holographic universes.

Does it make any strategic sense for satan (or some other opponent of God) to actively promote the cause of theological discussion? Is it not counter-intuitive for New Atheism to stir up a renewed interest in God and religion in the hope that the more people talking about God the better it will be for atheists in the long run? Where is the logic in running an anti-theist polemic which jolts every single apathetic arm-chair apologist wannabe into action? How many Hindus and Norse Thor worshippers and Wiccans and New Agers and Native/Aboriginal Religionists are teaming up with Jews, Muslims and Christians to say - hell YES Mr Hitchens, we WOULD like to talk publicly to you about "religion".

Because I think Mr Hitchens walked into the wrong bar to pick a fight.

Lion

You are correct! Satan does not want folk talking about God - simply because their is no Satan. therefore "he" can't want anything. Debating what the Scriptures say about Satan (or anything else) is as pointless as debating the best car - from reading the Austin Allegro Owners Club Magazine.



http://www.allegroclubint.org.uk/join.html


But on the Atheists stirring up debate, I think you are a tad optimistic

And tactically (for Atheists) debate can only be a good thing. and although counter-intuitive so is a resurgence in religions - both mainstream and the barmier end No better provider of examples of the stupidity that underpins religion than the practioners themselves - they can't seem to help themselves

Anyway, Religion simply on the wrong side of societal evolution (it's served it's purpose) - so it doesn't really matter what anyone alive now thinks.

[Lion IRC]

Five pages ! No WAY!

Does it make any strategic sense for satan (or some other opponent of God) to actively promote the cause of theological discussion?

Yes it does. The more people think about theology and the more they read the religious texts, the more likely it is that they will realize it's false.

Is that really true? Why is the bible STILL the most widely published book in history? More bibles are printed in one year than the all time sales of a New Your Times best seller.

Is it not counter-intuitive for New Atheism to stir up a renewed interest in God and religion in the hope that the more people talking about God the better it will be for atheists in the long run? Where is the logic in running an anti-theist polemic which jolts every single apathetic arm-chair apologist wannabe into action?

Because more people will see the light.

The light of non-stamp collecting? The light of science which is revealing that reality consists of concepts (theories) that are more bizarre than anything in the bible. Worm holes? Parallel universes? Quantum weirdness? Holograms?

How many Hindus and Norse Thor worshippers and Wiccans and New Agers and Native/Aboriginal Religionists are teaming up with Jews, Muslims and Christians to say - hell YES Mr Hitchens, we WOULD like to talk publicly to you about "religion".

Some.

Because I think Mr Hitchens walked into the wrong bar to pick a fight.

Lion (IRC)[/color][/b]

It is only by not thinking that people can be suckered by the snake-oil salesmen that are the religiosos in this world. The Bible is a great catalyst to atheism. I've talked to many, many people who were once Christians, but when they finally started really reading and thinking about the Bible, they realized it could not be true.

How does a person perform the mental fuction you describe as "not thinking"? I cant see any point in duelling anecdotes about the many many many people I have "talked to" and what they would say (if they were here) to the many many many people you have talked to but as for myself, reading the bible has not been a catalyst even to agnosticism let alone atheism.

[Ian]

Five pages ! No WAY!

We've got 29 pages worth of lolcats.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Is that really true? Why is the bible STILL the most widely published book in history? More bibles are printed in one year than the all time sales of a New Your Times best seller.

The head of the Reichsministerium für Volksaufklärung und Propaganda or Propagandaministerium could tell you. Go ask, I'll wait.

[Ian]

Is that really true? Why is the bible STILL the most widely published book in history? More bibles are printed in one year than the all time sales of a New Your Times best seller.

Having a copy of the Little Red Book was required of every Chinese citzen during Mao's time. Fat lot of good it did in maintaining Maoism for all time.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Is that really true? Why is the bible STILL the most widely published book in history? More bibles are printed in one year than the all time sales of a New Your Times best seller.

And how many of those are forced down peoples' throats? How many are SOLD? (Indicating people actually want them.) AND, the best question, are ANY of them being read?